Ok, I was *REALLY* unhappy at Velocity (re: Partner Gold issues)

[leemin]

While I am nowhere near close to being affected by this, I can certainly empathise.

This is extremely similar to the confusion around SC when they first introduced the new system. Unclear, contradicting and even incorrect information on DJ's various websites and explanations on here, via call centres and in person.

They really, really need to pick up their game on this stuff. It's not a good look and p*sses people off.

If this is indeed how it works, why on earth wasn't the wording from the beginning: "When a member earns an additional 1500SC after reaching Platinum status, they receive..."?

 

[connieguy]

*earns 1500/2000SC's before next review date*

According to the T&Cs that can't be done as the Review date resets to the current date you earn the 800 SCs + 1 year as soon as you earn 800 SCs and requalify for WP.

 

[LiamR]

That is not that the T&Cs say. VA have a problem as the T&C very clearly say the members Review Date is reset to the next 12 months whenever they earn enough SC to requalify. That way they can never earn PG or PP.

VA needs to reword their T&Cs as if their IT systems follows the T&Cs there will never be any PG or PPs.

My posted screen shot clearly shows the SCs I earned in the last 12 months are not being credited as against my WP requalify. This agrees with the T&Cs.

Well, what I am saying is that in reality. I have been told, and seen, people being awarded PG after 1500SCs. Not 1500SCs after hitting Platinum.

So I don't know what the computer says, or the T&Cs say. But, that's what I've seen happens in reality.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I certainly sympathise with 777 (and any other affected by this) but won't this be a annoying but moot point once family SC pooling is introduced?

 

[connieguy]

Well, what I am saying is that in reality. I have been told, and seen, people being awarded PG after 1500SCs. Not 1500SCs after hitting Platinum.

So I don't know what the computer says, or the T&Cs say. But, that's what I've seen happens in reality.

That was what was explained to me in the VA Mel lounge as well. However the OP has been told a very different story, has been denied PG and is just a bit PI**ED off. Also the T&Cs do agree with what he was told but even worst, according to the T&Cs, PG and PP is not possible unless VA rewrite the T&Cs.

 

[LiamR]

That was what was explained to me in the VA Mel lounge as well. However the OP has been told a very different story, has been denied PG and is just a bit PI**ED off. Also the T&Cs do agree with what he was told but even worst, according to the T&Cs, PG and PP is not possible unless VA rewrite the T&Cs.

I'd guess that he has been given the wrong information. (Just guessing here) And would consider calling up the VA platinum desk for more clarification.

Hard considering the OP is overseas right now.

 

[777]

Ok, i've just spoken to the VA rep from here by phone and i am very happy with how he's handled it and the communication that i've gotten.

So if i can summarise that conversation:

1. Yep, there are teething problems with the new system!
2. The upshot of it all is this is that partner gold is meant to be a benefit for those who earn 1500 SCs in a membership year (i.e. from your review date to the next) not for any rolling 12 month period or 2000 in the case of partner platinum. So it does work differently to other triggers that are based on a rolling 12 months.
3. There is however a glitch being created by the transition period in that people's membership years are being reset based on the new platinum date. Once platinum is more than a year old that will be irrelevant but for now it catches me (and maybe some of you) out.
4. I don't think it's meant to be 1500 SCs over and above platinum qualification but that the clock starts ticking from the date of your review.

I get the impression (and i may just be adding up 2+2 and getting 5) that people who had 1500+ or 2000+ credits on the day plat came in had their partners comped at that time. Everyone else effectively had the clock reset. Which was particularly galling for those who like me - ok, maybe it was just me - took the flight that clocked them over 1500 on that very night.

Dean has said he will look into my case and seems to be able to fix it up. I really appreciate that - happy wife, happy life and all that! He has also said that he will raise the issue more generally with those who actually control the process and see what (if any) changes can be made to ease the transition although that's not his decision. It's friday afternoon and lots of people need to be involved so that may not happen straight away.

He also added that once family pooling comes in some of these issues will be addressed (and i'll guess maybe a few more new ones will be discovered!) at that time through other mechanisms.

So, on the whole, i'm happy with the response to my case. I'm not entirely pleased that it works the way it does as it kind of rules out me shooting for partner platinum soon but i'm philosophical about that and if i'm lucky perhaps the transitional arrangements will take that into account. I think VA will be here to post at some point but i think he needs to clarify some things from their end before making any public pronouncements.

Oh, and i may have totally summarised that all wrong!

777.

 

[leemin]

Hard considering the OP is overseas right now.

A PM to VFF perhaps?

And a report back, obviously.

 

[connieguy]

I certainly sympathise with 777 (and any other affected by this) but won't this be a annoying but moot point once family SC pooling is introduced?

If VA do not fix the T&Cs to make this happen, they will start to lose credibility and maybe end up with no one expecting family SC and point pooling to do much to help.

The issue is the SCs are not that earned in the past 12 months but instead the SCs earned from the Review Date. So VA changed the rules here and used 2 different SC earning periods. Past 12 calendar month SC earning for tier upgrades / retains and SC earns from the Review Date for PG and PP awards. But as the Review date resets as soon as a WP earns 800 SCs. it is impossible to ever earn PG or PP even using the 2 measuring systems VA have decided to adopt.

I now agree with the OP. VA this sure appears to be sneaky by not using the SC earn in the past 12 months to award PG and PP but to use the SC earn in the 12 months since the Review Date. Why 2 different SC totals?

 

[Velocity Frequent Flyer]

As much as we hate to admit it, teething issues are bound to happen when as many changes were to be made to our program.

What has happened in 777s case, has been compounded by the phone advice that was initially provided regarding Companion Gold Membership eligibility has turned out to be incorrect.

We've offered our apologies to 777 and will honour the mistake in this instance.

Further, to avoid a repeat of such an incident, we will be reinforcing to all staff as to the correct operation of this benefit.

As some of you have rightly pointed out, Platinum members will be eligible for Companion Gold or Platinum membership upon earning an additional 1500 or 2000 Status Credits respectively after achieving or maintaining Platinum status.

We also acknowledge that our website could be clearer on the eligibility requirements of this benefit. We will be reviewing all copy on the website to avoid any unnecessary confusion.

In the next few months we will be reviewing the launch and all the new services associated with the new program. Your feedback during this time will be invaluable to us, as it is the frequent flying community who we have designed the Velocity program for.

 

[777]

Again, thanks for all your help. BUt i am still not clear on this:

As some of you have rightly pointed out, Platinum members will be eligible for Companion Gold or Platinum membership upon earning an additional 1500 or 2000 Status Credits respectively after achieving or maintaining Platinum status.

So, now that i have achieved platinum for the next 12 months (and reset my SC count to 0) do i need to earn 1500 SC's between now and next review date to get/ maintain partner gold [passing through the following year's plat requal threshold along the way] OR do i need to reach that threshold again (for 2012-13) and THEN earn an additional 1500 SCs (eg. 2300 in a year) to get partner gold?

I'm still just a little confused.

 

[LiamR]

Thanks VFF for clearing the air. It's nice when a company openly says they've made a mistake.

Is it me or has this only been recently updated? I'm sure one of us would have noticed it before...

Family Benefits | Velocity Frequent Flyer

Companion Gold and Platinum membershipPlatinum members can now share Velocity benefits and rewards with a friend or family member. You can gift a Companion Gold or Companion Platinum membership once you earn an additional 1,500 or 2,000 Status Credits respectively within your membership period*.

 

[777]

Oh, and can the mods perhaps change the title of the thread? I think "sneakiness" is probably not the right word - and i'm no longer really annoyed (although that certainly was accurate at the time of the OP!)

 

[connieguy]

Re: Ok, now i'm *REALLY* annoyed at Velocity (re: Partner Gold sneakiness)

Again, thanks for all your help. BUt i am still not clear on this:



So, now that i have achieved platinum for the next 12 months (and reset my SC count to 0) do i need to earn 1500 SC's between now and next review date to get/ maintain partner gold [passing through the following year's plat requal threshold along the way] OR do i need to reach that threshold again (for 2012-13) and THEN earn an additional 1500 SCs (eg. 2300 in a year) to get partner gold?

I'm still just a little confused.

According to the current T&Cs your Review date and tier year SC earn will reset every time you earn 800 SCs.

I suggest VA have a problem here as which comes first, WP retain or PG? If the next trigger is PG and that happens, I assume those 1,500 SCs are gone from your tier year 12 months total and you need to earn another 800 SCs in that tier year to retain WP. But what about PP at 2,000 SCs? Do we get multiple triggers we can pull as we decide how to spend our tier year SCs?

IE,

1) WP retain - cost 800 SCs from the last 12 months SC earn (Yes / No) caution selection this option will restart your tier year from today and zero your tier year SC earnings.

2) PG - cost 1,500 SCs from the current tier year SC earn (Yes / No)

2) PP - cost 2,000 SCs from the current tier year SC earn (Yes / No)

This could work but would still be confusing.

With respect to VA and VFF, as it is currently is in the T&Cs it can't work.

 

[Velocity Frequent Flyer]

Sorry but as we have some of the team off-site today we will have to defer some of these questions until Monday.

 

[markis10]

Sorry but as we have some of the team off-site today

They are obviously out at the mailing house helping facilitate the delivery of those Platinum Kits , cannot keep those Plats waiting!

 

[connieguy]

Sorry but as we have some of the team off-site today we will have to defer some of these questions until Monday.

Ok. Excellent. I'm not being negative here. I like VA but there are issues with how this can / will work. The inquiring minds here will help you guys to get it right.

I might add that to expect a VA WP to earn another 1,500 SCs (beyond the 800 SCs needed to retain WP) to gift VA Gold is a bit much. I mean they only needed to earn 800 SCs to retain WP. And then to say they need to earn ANOTHER 1,500 SCs to gift PG is like saying fly enough to retain 3 x VA WPs to get a single VA PG? Sorry but the logic and structure behind this decision just does not hang together. Trust in FFers. Those very low benefit earning SCs (beyond 800 SCs) will be earned with other carriers, in other programs. They win and VA loses revenue. You sure VA really wants that to happen?

Over all the VA FFer system is thumbs up. But here you have smashed one thumb with a rather big hammer. May I suggest VA needs to consider all SC based rewards to be determined by the last 12 months SC earn?

What VA needs, and seems to be moving that way, is a 12 months SC bank account where SC expire in their 13th month. SCs are credited as happens now. FFers are allowed to debit their SC account when obtaining a tier status retain / upgrade or PG or PP benefit. That way everybody stays happy and VA does not lose customers who seen earning another 1,500 SC is not good value for the spend and go elsewhere with their business.

Suggested SC cost:

1)Tier earn and retain as current.

2)PG 500 SCs once awarding member is WP

3)PP 1,000 SCs once awarding member is WP.

What could be fairer to ensure both sides see value and do not wander once the 800 SCs are earned?

 

[777]

Re: Ok, now i'm *REALLY* annoyed at Velocity (re: Partner Gold sneakiness)

According to the current T&Cs your Review date and tier year SC earn will reset every time you earn 800 SCs.... With respect to VA and VFF, as it is currently is in the T&Cs it can't work.

I do agree that as explained it is essentially a recursive loop: Reach 800 SC's then reset to zero. Repeat.

I don't think that's how it works in practice or how it is meant to work in practice and i'm sure it will be clarified sooner or later. I think the way it should work is that when you requalify for platinum that you get platinum for your next membership year from your review date and your SC count keeps rising to see if you hit the maximum 1500 or 2000 for extra goodies for your companion before the year is out.

In an ideal world this transitional period should have included some provision to measure your most recent status year or in the interests of simplicity just made it the same rolling 12 month basis that they calculate the membership tiers based on. I am sure i'm not the only one who assumed that it was rolling 12 months like everything else (although i do accept the T&Cs dont say that).

 

[connieguy]

Re: Ok, now i'm *REALLY* annoyed at Velocity (re: Partner Gold sneakiness)

...I am sure i'm not the only one who assumed that it was rolling 12 months like everything else (although i do accept the T&Cs dont say that).

I'm sure that was what we all thought. Why VA enacted another SC counting period seems a bit strange especially as it requires a VA WP to earn almost 3 x that required to retain VA WP, while QF is a lot less at 2x. Does VA want to be seen as having a worst PG program than QF and risking losing revenue to FFers who will see the generated benefit (VA PG) is not worth the spend and will do the spend with other carriers to earn high tier status there?

My 2 cents is VA PG costing 2,300 VA SCs with a 800 VA SC WP retain as against QF's 2,400 SC for PG with a 1,200 QF SC WP retain is not a smart way to keep high SC earning FFers spending money with VA. I for one would spend the money above 800 VA SCs with another carrier as the VA PG earn was not worth the cost.

With respect, JB this is not smart thinking. Your mileage my vary.

 

[777]

Re: Ok, now i'm *REALLY* annoyed at Velocity (re: Partner Gold sneakiness)

With respect, JB this is not smart thinking. Your mileage my vary.

I think we should wait for clarification on this one. I *think* it means 1500 providing you are eligible for platinum not 1500 on top of but we should wait and see i guess. I think VA will get back to us next week on this.