Oneworld Classic Flight Reward Discussion - The Definitive Thread

[vetrade]

I have heard (but have no first hand experience) that it is very hard to get award bookings split or merged.

It's actually worse than "hard" - it's impossible.

 

[Mr H]

It's actually worse that "hard" - it's impossible.

That's what I understood but I didn't want to be so definitive in case someone pointed me to a post on Page 94 where someone had done exactly that.

 

[vetrade]

That's what I understood but I didn't want to be so definitive in case someone pointed me to a post on Page 94 where someone had done exactly that.

That post you mentioned actually only referred to someone who couldn't get 2 x J on the same flight so one of them was booked into J and the other was booked into Y. The key point was they both travelled on the same flight so they actually didn't have different itineraries at all. That's a lot different to 2 pax being on different flights or merging separate itineraries, both of which just can't be done.

 

[Mr H]

That post you mentioned ...

I didn't have a specific post in mind - only that whenever you make a definitive statement someone always pops up with a counterexample.

 

[vetrade]

I didn't have a specific post in mind - only that whenever you make a definitive statement someone always pops up with a counterexample.

Well, when you singled out Pg 94, I went back and read every post on that page, (I bet a few other people did too) even though it was way back in 2014 (coincidentally 4 or 5 posts on that page were actually written by me. Ah, memories!).
Anyway, there was only one post on Pg94 which referred to splitting of award bookings so I took a not unreasonable leap of faith and assumed that's the one you were referring to. Now I'm guessing the bit about Pg94 was just a throw-away line.

I'm still going to let my definitive statement stand, though..........

 

[Kendall Roy]

OK AFF, I've been trying to book the following with limited success. Can anyone here see the rule breach?

Miles are ~34.5K

AKL-SYD-HND (Stop)
HND-SYD (Stop)
SYD-MEL-HND-HEL-BRU (Stop)
AMS-HEL-HND-SYD-AKL (Stop - ideally dump AKL at the end)

Two transits and one stop in both HND & SYD - that's within the rules?

I was also getting the "Cannot return to country of origin" error, which is BS given that NZ is my country of origin and not my last leg. Perhaps the system is hard coded to AUS being "home".....

 

[snabbu]

OK AFF, I've been trying to book the following with limited success. Can anyone here see the rule breach?

Miles are ~34.5K

AKL-SYD-HND (Stop)
HND-SYD (Stop)
SYD-MEL-HND-HEL-BRU (Stop)
AMS-HEL-HND-SYD-AKL (Stop)

Two transits and one stop in both HND & SYD - that's within the rules?

I was also getting the "Cannot return to country of origin" error, which is BS given that NZ is my country of origin and not my last leg. Perhaps the system is hard coded to AUS being "home".....

You can't transit/stop through the same port that many times (SYD/HND) from memory.

 

[Captain Halliday]

OK AFF, I've been trying to book the following with limited success. Can anyone here see the rule breach?

Miles are ~34.5K

AKL-SYD-HND (Stop)
HND-SYD (Stop)
SYD-MEL-HND-HEL-BRU (Stop)
AMS-HEL-HND-SYD-AKL (Stop)

Two transits and one stop in both HND & SYD - that's within the rules?

I was also getting the "Cannot return to country of origin" error, which is BS given that NZ is my country of origin and not my last leg. Perhaps the system is hard coded to AUS being "home".....

Looks okay to me at face value. Things to check would be:
- HND & SYD stops both >24h so they’re not being counted three times.
- All OW airlines
- Check miles in an actual GDS to ensure you’re definitely under 35k miles.

If those are all clear, I’m stumped.

 

[Kendall Roy]

Yes, both HND/SYD are 2 week+ stops. Mix of QF/JA/AY metal.

Miles all good, with surface segments included.

You can't transit/stop through the same port that many times (SYD/HND) from memory.

(c) only one Stopover is permitted in any one city in the Itinerary; and
(d) only two Transfers may be taken at any one city in the Itinerary.

Which is bang on what I'm trying to do in HND & SYD I think?

 

[aikman]

OK AFF, I've been trying to book the following with limited success. Can anyone here see the rule breach?

Miles are ~34.5K

AKL-SYD-HND (Stop)
HND-SYD (Stop)
SYD-MEL-HND-HEL-BRU (Stop)
AMS-HEL-HND-SYD-AKL (Stop)

Two transits and one stop in both HND & SYD - that's within the rules?

I was also getting the "Cannot return to country of origin" error, which is BS given that NZ is my country of origin and not my last leg. Perhaps the system is hard coded to AUS being "home".....

1. gcmap is showing 34,507 miles. QF could be calculating it as over 35,000.

2. For my booking, I could book MEL-HND on its own but it wouldn't let me book the same flight to connect to HEL. I don't know why.

 

[flapper]

I see CX have finally started releasing award seats on flights from HKG to Aus (SYD & MEL). There is plenty of availability. Some flights have 6 J seats available. Take note QF. Flights to other states may become available if they ever open their borders.

 

[vetrade]

Ari Gold,
Distances OK
Stops and transits OK
I certainly can't see any breach of the OW rules in what you are trying to do.

My guess is that you will find your answer (or at least your explanation) in Married Segment Control. In this case maybe you are being blocked from booking 2 connecting flights with the one carrier.

I am assuming (a) that you know awards are available for all flights and (b) you're trying for a J award, so if that's the case, the possibilities I'd investigate are:
HND - HEL - BRU (if your're trying to book both flights with AY).
HEL - HND - SYD (if you're trying to book JL for both flights, which you almost certainly are, given that your only alternative to JL is AY, which I know from my own recent experience has been showing zero availability for HEL - HND).
The third possibility (least likely because of the lack of AY J awards from HEL - HND), I see is AMS - HEL - HND if you're trying for AY for both flights

I'd experiment a bit to explore these possibilities:
Change the dates for the HND - HEL - BRU flights a little to make HEL a stopover and see if that fixes your problem. Keep all other particulars the same, particularly the carrier.
If that doesn't work, I'd do the same for the HEL - HND - SYD flights by including a stop in Tokyo (you will need to temporarily change your original stop in HND to a transit to try this)

MSC can be a very confusing animal to try and make sense of, especially because the same airline may only apply it to some individual routes, and not others. I recently booked JL for LHR - HND - SYD and it got ticketed without problems but that was after I couldn't get HEL - HND - SYD with JL to work. Same airline, different result.

Your fix could be as simple as converting one of your transits into a stopover in one of these cities (in my case I was hamstrung by the fact I had already used up all my 5 stopovers)

Good luck

 

[Mr H]

(c) only one Stopover is permitted in any one city in the Itinerary; and
(d) only two Transfers may be taken at any one city in the Itinerary.

I had read this as only two transits in a city, one of which may be a stopover.

 

[flapper]

I had read this as only two transits in a city, one of which may be a stopover.

No! One stopover PLUS two transfers.

 

[Kendall Roy]

Ari Gold,
Distances OK
Stops and transits OK
I certainly can't see any breach of the OW rules in what you are trying to do.

My guess is that you will find your answer (or at least your explanation) in Married Segment Control. In this case maybe you are being blocked from booking 2 connecting flights with the one carrier.

I am assuming (a) that you know awards are available for all flights and (b) you're trying for a J award, so if that's the case, the possibilities I'd investigate are:
HND - HEL - BRU (if your're trying to book both flights with AY).
HEL - HND - SYD (if you're trying to book JL for both flights, which you almost certainly are, given that your only alternative to JL is AY, which I know from my own recent experience has been showing zero availability for HEL - HND).
The third possibility (least likely because of the lack of AY J awards from HEL - HND), I see is AMS - HEL - HND if you're trying for AY for both flights

I'd experiment a bit to explore these possibilities:
Change the dates for the HND - HEL - BRU flights a little to make HEL a stopover and see if that fixes your problem. Keep all other particulars the same, particularly the carrier.
If that doesn't work, I'd do the same for the HEL - HND - SYD flights by including a stop in Tokyo (you will need to temporarily change your original stop in HND to a transit to try this)

MSC can be a very confusing animal to try and make sense of, especially because the same airline may only apply it to some individual routes, and not others. I recently booked JL for LHR - HND - SYD and it got ticketed without problems but that was after I couldn't get HEL - HND - SYD with JL to work. Same airline, different result.

Your fix could be as simple as converting one of your transits into a stopover in one of these cities (in my case I was hamstrung by the fact I had already used up all my 5 stopovers)

Good luck

RE: MSC - This is an issue for AKL-SYD-HND

It'll let me do it online with separate legs, but the staff over the phone are telling me computer says no.

I asked for MEL-BRU and the system actually offered up MEL-HND-HEL-BRU as an option.

Some consistency between online and staff systems would be nice!

 

[vetrade]

2. For my booking, I could book MEL-HND on its own but it wouldn't let me book the same flight to connect to HEL. I don't know why.

I'd be scratching my head about that, too, simply because those flights must have been with different airlines i.e. QF with either AY or JL.

 

[vetrade]

RE: MSC - This is an issue for AKL-SYD-HND

It'll let me do it online with separate legs, but the staff over the phone are telling me computer says no.

I asked for MEL-BRU and the system actually offered up MEL-HND-HEL-BRU as an option.

Some consistency between online and staff systems would be nice!

Obviously AKL - SYD was QF, but were you trying for SYD - HND with JL or QF?
If you were going for the QF / JL combo there really shouldn't have been a problem.
Normally you wouldn't expect 2 QF connecting flights to throw up a problem either, so it sounds like you have been stiffed.

 

[flapper]

I'm so glad to see people booking OWA flights again. I've booked 2 for next year. I'll only take one of those. One is booked for the middle of 2022 and the other for Sep 2022. Which one I take depends on the Covid situation. After 3 cancelled OWA trips I'm glad I booked them. Things are starting to look positive for a change.

 

[Mr H]

I'm so glad to see people booking OWA flights again. I've booked 2 for next year. I'll only take one of those. One is booked for the middle of 2022 and the other for Sep 2022. Which one I take depends on the Covid situation. After 3 cancelled OWA trips I'm glad I booked them. Things are starting to look positive for a change.

Agreed. I was feeling very low and booked an award that grew into a OWA thanks to advice on here. It was transformational to my mood, letting me focus on the future for the first time in a year and a half.

 

[ozflier]

I see CX have finally started releasing award seats on flights from HKG to Aus. There is plenty of availability. Some flights have 6 J seats available. Take note QF.

Not much showing HKG-BNE direct mid 2022 on CX!