AFF - are we our own self-moderating enemy?

[Pushka]

If every AFFer abandoned QF, yes we would affect them. But we're just not that organised.

It's not like a captain of industry saying "we only fly virgin now" because in that case personal preference doesn't come into it.

I’m not convinced of the size of AFF that would impact Qantas given many here don’t fly with them anyway. Sadly Virgin schedules are not great for work out of Adelaide, but then Qantas is making timetable changes also.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I’m not convinced of the size of AFF that would impact Qantas given many here don’t fly with them anyway.

It's also about influence. If many on here don't fly QF it might mean their travel advice also reflects that.

 

[juddles]

I agree with many view points so far expressed here. AFF is a small community, but with much expertise in travelling. What I most like about the forum is learning from others - it is perfect for that. It may be the case that the airlines can identify here loopholes that we discover and share, and thus close them, but given that the amount of people that are avid enough to learn these and use them, probably those same loopholes are fairly meaningless to the airlines.

If "we" as AFF wanted to have more of an impact, we could always set up some sort of industry advocate/whatever group, and I am sure we could command some decent press, and thus influence, but that is not my cup of tea Likewise we all know that such things as jumping ship from QF to VA are also not real choices, as the grass certainly is not greener on the other side.

I think that the interpretation of the comment that we are "self-moderating" must be a clear insight into the insignificance of us on QF's current loyalty radar. It may be valid in a short-term commercial sense, but I do believe that this view by QF is symptomatic of their whole loyalty methodology, which is "b/s to the masses". It seems to be working for them, at least in the short term.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

I agree with many view points so far expressed here. AFF is a small community, but with much expertise in travelling. What I most like about the forum is learning from others - it is perfect for that. It may be the case that the airlines can identify here loopholes that we discover and share, and thus close them, but given that the amount of people that are avid enough to learn these and use them, probably those same loopholes are fairly meaningless to the airlines.

The group here may be small in numbers, but it's absolutely representative of the attitude for the majority of frequent flyers.

 

[dajop]

A good example can be found here of how this forum is self-moderating from QF's perspective.

 

[juddles]

A good example can be found here of how this forum is self-moderating from QF's perspective.

That is a great example of how people can get a balanced and realistic view. Which is what AFF offers in spades.

 

[juddles]

Although I am no expert in online forums, in my experience this one is extremely well run. It is organised, respectful, civil. As members such as trippin have said, we are very much representative of frequent flyers as a group. I think we are over-educated/more knowledgable than many who use such things as QF's FF program, but as possibly the best collection of this experience in Australia, I think we have the potential to be a voice with influence.

Travel is a big issue for Aussies. Qantas specifically likewise is of interest to most. AFF is already producing newsletters of admirable quality. Newspapers are always begging for material of interest that fills their pages. I just see an angle here that seems to not have been attempted.

 

[JohnK]

I don't care that Qantas does not listen to me or AFF as a group.

As a Platinum I fly Qantas, and Emirates, as they are streets ahead of the others with their economy product. Even if they can appear to be overpriced at times.

 

[serfty]

as they are streets ahead of the others with their economy product.

I guess you don't fly others then.

EK are are somewhat better with soft product in economy than Qantas.

I flew AA in economy from AKL to LAX earlier this year. As an Emerald I can get front row bulkhead on booking and was server three meals on the flight along with regular drink runs. Hot towl runs were done before the first drinks run, before each of the three meals and before landing.

I flew VA in early June and on the day flight from MEL, received two decent meals, not the white tray with a meal pack and a dry hot bun tossed on top, followed by some icy thing 30 minutes later with a soggy pizza stick some hours after.

 

[p--and--t]

I guess you don't fly others then.

EK are are somewhat better with soft product in economy than Qantas.

I flew AA in economy from AKL to LAX earlier this year. As an Emerald I can get front row bulkhead on booking and was server three meals on the flight along with regular drink runs. Hot towl runs were done before the first drinks run, before each of the three meals and before landing.

I flew VA in early June and on the day flight from MEL, received two decent meals, not the white tray with a meal pack and a dry hot bun tossed on top, folleed by some icy thing 30 minutes later.

YMMV

After 5 / 5 bad flights in Y on EK, including irrops, safety, hygiene and crewing issues won't fly them again.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I'm pretty sure all the trappings of platinum status including first class check in, lounges, prompt cutomer service, shadows, business class amenities, first crack at meals and the best seats in the house would take the edge off ANY airline's economy. Again, the comparison JohnK makes is not necessarily apples with apples. QF and EK may be the best for a QFFF platinum regularly flying to SE Asia (and there's not a lot of OW to Thailand). But a solitaire PPS on SQ probably has a better ride on SQ and a DM on CX (etc). For non-status economy class pax I think the field is much tighter.

 

[juddles]

I'm pretty sure all the trappings of platinum status including first class check in, lounges, prompt cutomer service, shadows, business class amenities, first crack at meals and the best seats in the house would take the edge off ANY airline's economy. ...

"trappings of platinum"?? I think that the benefits of platinum, nice as they should be, do not substantially change a shiite economy intrinsic product. We have all had our experiences, but I do actually rate QF economy very well. Yes you pay for it, but it is very good, IMHO, when compared to other cheaper options.

 

[juddles]

Damn! Just realised I was suckered completely off-topic - in a thread I started!

 

[JohnK]

I guess you don't fly others then.

EK are are somewhat better with soft product in economy than Qantas.

I have flown quite a few. QF, EK, 3K, SQ, CX, VA, MH.

For me Qantas is up there. EK is ok too. I hate ICE. CX again in a couple of weeks.

In a couple of weeks have a QF A330 and 789 flights which will be my first long haul on that aircraft. Just on $2000 for 3 of us BNE-HKG-SYD-BNE earning close to 24,000 QFF points. Status helps with some quality lounges but even without status I don't think other airlines come close to price. Put it this way, Qantas was the cheapest by far booking a few days ago for 31 July travel.

 

[cove]

I was told Delta was winning against American on flight quality in the US.
My son is saying QR is really good and better than SQ at the pointy end. He has been buying AA miles to book QR.
Sometimes I have to use VA in J when Qantas points are ridiculous. I have plenty of points with both.

 

[serfty]

Qantas was the cheapest by far booking a few days ago for 31 July travel.

I was not referring to price* - I wrote 'soft product' - i.e. Food, Beverages, service levels (e.g. hot towels in economy). Of the carriers you mention, QF generally provides the worst in economy.

*(although in general QF is not cheapest)

 

[JohnK]

I was not referring to price* - I wrote 'soft product' - i.e. Food, Beverages, service levels (e.g. hot towels in economy). Of the carriers you mention, QF generally provides the worst in economy.

*(although in general QF is not cheapest)

And that's your opinion. In my opinion Qantas are by far the best including food, beverage, seats, service, price etc.

You can ignore the other points but everyone is very important. I do like that I can preorder meals in economy and 2 different curry meals is not a choice. Qantas along with Emirates also has good child meals. And I do like that I can earn status and QFF points on the cheapest of airfares and you can't do that on SQ, CX or TG.

 

[serfty]

And that's your opinion. In my opinion Qantas are by far the best including food, beverage, seats, service, price etc. ....

My opinion respectfully disagrees with your opinion.

Enjoy your Qantas blinkers ....

---

There you go-"Self Moderation"

 

[dajop]

And I do like that I can earn status and QFF points on the cheapest of airfares and you can't do that on SQ, CX or TG.

Well of course you can’t earn QFF points on the cheapest airfares of SQ and TG. You can’t even earn them on the most expensive F fare either

That aside your post(s) illustrate perfectly why QF don’t need a presence on AFF - there will always be “self moderation” - someone to defend the brand in a far more convincing manner than a company representative ever could.

 

[33kft]

So just so that I understand here, it's self moderation because some passengers are prepared to counter negative views with positive views? In that case who is doing the self moderating, is it those with the positive views only? Is the natural order of things that negative views should go unchallenged and if so, is that for one airline or all of them?