Complete newbie - is it worth it?

[SimonAus]

Hi all,

Appreciate any help I can get here. Bear with me...

I have just been reading and discovering the world of FF points over the past few months and am ready to commit the time and energy to hopefully make it work for me and the family.

Our situation: Family of 4, living in Perth. Emigrated from the UK so the main reason for getting involved is to make to flight back to the UK every 18months or so a bit more bearable! Have never flown business and always thought it was out of our financial reach (couldn't justify the price).
So we will be heading back to the UK every 18months or so - can be flexible on time of year but will mostly need to coincide with school holidays (+/- a week either side)

My main areas where I am lacking knowledge are where I should be focusing my efforts in collecting points and then where to look to spend them

I have seen that most places seem to recommend a flexible points program that allows transfer into a partner program (e.g. AMEX)

I shop in woolies (so get their rewards and have read the thread on here) but have considered whether I should switch to flybys to collect velocity points?? Probably not make or break.

I have also read that using a program like Asia Miles is preferable to Qantas as they are generally cheaper redemptions on the same route.



All that being said - my main question is where I should focus start collecting points. I have a AMEX platinum edge already so collect 5-8k points per month there. I'm not sure I'm ever going to build that up into anything worthwhile without any CC bonus offers??

Also, is this all achievable? In my situation, could I build up enough points every 18months for a family business trip to the UK? and is there likely to even be seats on offer?!

As I said, so grateful for any tips starting out. any any advice you can give for any mistakes you have made!!

Thanks
Simon

 

[Steady]

Welcome aboard SimonAus, 18 months of groceries isn’t going to get 4 x J returns to LHR - maybe aim at getting some of the flights on points and the rest revenue tickets. You can squeeze some great value from points and AFF will help you do that

 

[33kft]

The key problem I think you'll run into is availability of award seats, especially at school holidays times. With something like the Amex MR program, you can at least be selective of the airline partners you redeem with, but you'll need to choose carefully (I would forget QF if you aren't going to be flying in the interim, you'll need WP to get a jump on other status holders for availability and to be able to redeem 4 seats in J). You might be better with KF for availability from what I have read. The other option would be to dollar cost average, ie to book 2 x seats on points in J and 2 x revenue seats in J, which would effectively halve the cost of flying in J, require less points to redeem and require less status to obtain the reward seats.

 

[SimonAus]

The key problem I think you'll run into is availability of award seats, especially at school holidays times. With something like the Amex MR program, you can at least be selective of the airline partners you redeem with, but you'll need to choose carefully (I would forget QF if you aren't going to be flying in the interim, you'll need WP to get a jump on other status holders for availability and to be able to redeem 4 seats in J). You might be better with KF for availability from what I have read. The other option would be to dollar cost average, ie to book 2 x seats on points in J and 2 x revenue seats in J, which would effectively halve the cost of flying in J, require less points to redeem and require less status to obtain the reward seats.

Hey. That’s exactly the advice im after.

So KF likely to be a better option - and you can tf between velocity and KF I think I read?
So load up on AMEX/velocity and go from there?

 

[SimonAus]

Welcome aboard SimonAus, 18 months of groceries isn’t going to get 4 x J returns to LHR - maybe aim at getting some of the flights on points and the rest revenue tickets. You can squeeze some great value from points and AFF will help you do that

Thanks steady. Yeh I didn’t think a weekly shop would get me there! If I go down the CC bonus sign up offer route then would you recommend a velocity card, or AMEX Or Citi?
Is there an easy way to work out the best/most flexible?

 

[33kft]

So KF likely to be a better option - and you can tf between velocity and KF I think I read?

You can, but you will incur a fairly ordinary transfer rate, it's always best practice to transfer directly to the airline of choice rather than via another. That said, sometimes you may only be able to catch signup bonuses on QF/VA cards locally, if there's a dry spell of offers (since you'll only be able to pick up Amex points once per 18 months). In those cases, you could collect VA points and tf to KF. Others might be able to recommend other programs with good redemption opportunities and earning options in Aus.

 

[Steady]

Thanks steady. Yeh I didn’t think a weekly shop would get me there! If I go down the CC bonus sign up offer route then would you recommend a velocity card, or AMEX Or Citi?
Is there an easy way to work out the best/most flexible?

I am not up with all of the programs, I think there is a higher chance of getting 2 x J on SQ then QF (then possibly another 2 x J on a different flight the same day) but points are a bit harder to get. The Amex points have dropped in value but they are probably still the better earner - can you sign up to get the bonus points, then refer your spouse and cancel yours, and wait the 18 months and then your spouse refer you and cancel etc? Do you have business spend you can pump through?

Maybe look at the threads on programs where you can buy miles/points

 

[aikman]

What I would do is study the award tables of Qantas, Velocity, Krisflyer, etc to see how many points are needed to achieve your goal. I would then do dummy searches on those airline websites at around school holidays to see if 4 business seats ever even get offered and get an idea of what surcharges you will have to pay. Surcharges and availability vary which can make one points currency better than another.

I would then study the earn rates on credit cards, Flybuys, Woolworths Rewards etc.

Once you have identified the points currency with the best combination of easy to earn points, good availability, lowest points costs & surcharges then you can focus on earning those points and target which credit cards to apply for. You can also then work out how long it will reach your goal based on your current financial position.

I don't think that there is a simple answer to your question without the research being done but my impression is that Krisflyer would be a good choice to LHR but the downside is that it is at least twice as hard to earn them compared to Qantas & Velocity.

 

[Denali]

....
Krisflyer would be a good choice to LHR but the downside is that its at least twice as hard to earn them compared to Qantas & Velocity.

Earn Velocity and convert to KrisFlyer? SQ Flight to Manchester then train to wherever. VA reward with Etihad to Edinburgh then train or drive to UK?

Lots of bonus points to earn with FlyBuys and convert to Velocity. I've split rewards seats, claimed both SQ and VA on same flight.

 

[Forg]

IMHO it’s important to ensure you mostly do things you would have been doing anyway, just ‘optimised’. Or at least, don’t deviate from what you’d usually do by too much. I can understand people doing ‘status runs’ to some degree, for example, but not if there’re 4 kids at home that you rarely see because you’re travelling all the time ...

Before I wrested control of the remote last night, the better-half was watching some show about American shopping voucher nutbags. This woman, who doesn’t eat mustard (and her husband doesn’t eat mustard) had spent all this time snipping out vouchers in order to buy that cheap awful mustard-flavoured squeeze-bottle ‘mustard’ for 37c instead of $1.37, and because she was saving so much money she bought 62 bottles of it. Which she’s then storing at home along with all the other stuff they buy & don’t use.

I frankly see little value in the schemes where you shop to accumulate points; not compared to international flights, at least. But if you’re doing that shopping anyway, then who cares - it’s effectively free. As others have said however, getting 4 points-based upgrades to J on the same flight during school holidays doesn’t sound like something which is likely to happen often ...

 

[tdimdad]

VA reward with Etihad to Edinburgh then train or drive to UK?

Sounds like you're foreseeing two things here: it'll take years to reach the family's reward flight goal and at that time there will be a Republic of Scotland with a border crossing to whatever is left of the United Kingdom...

 

[JohnM]

Being in PER, there is no chance of getting J award flights on the direct QF flight to LHR. They effectively don't exist.

However, availability on EK can be quite good using QF points. OneWorld options are QR and CX.

School holidays work against you.

It's always worth collecting points - just don't be too starry-eyed about how you are able to use them.

 

[harvyk]

Do you do any other flying (eg for work)?
I agree with the others, collect points from things you're doing anyway. It's very easy to lose the game (and end up paying more) by making adjustments for the purpose of collecting points.

I'd also suggest start doing dummy bookings on various airlines to get an idea of what the normal costs are. That way when you see that "unbelievable deal" you know if it really is good, or just marketing spin.

Be prepared to book a year out (fares on QF are 363 days out from memory), whilst you won't get "sales", it does give you the best shot at reward seats for 4.

Finally, be flexible with days, do you really need to leave on a Saturday morning or can you wait til Monday or even Tuesday? You can often snap up very good deals by flying on a less popular day.

 

[SimonAus]

Being in PER, there is no chance of getting J award flights on the direct QF flight to LHR. They effectively don't exist.

However, availability on EK can be quite good using QF points. OneWorld options are QR and CX.

School holidays work against you.

It's always worth collecting points - just don't be too starry-eyed about how you are able to use them.

Thanks so much. Willing to do a bit of research (a lot of research maybe!) to figure this out. Haven't got ridiculously high expectations of what we could achieve at the moment, just want to make sure we start on the right path.

The confusing part for me is figuring out where to book (or look to get an idea of the bookings). I.e using Asia Miles for a Qantas flight or Qantas for another one world partner.

Is there anywhere I can figure out all these nuances?

Really pleased with all the helpful responses!

 

[JohnM]

Really pleased with all the helpful responses!

Hey, mate, this is AFF! .

 

[wandering_fred]

And remember from PER, a cheap 5 hour(ish) flight to SE Asia will open opportunities for much more reasonably priced flights in all the alliances.
Effectively flying one time in paid PE will go a long way to having enough points to get (or upgrade to) seats in the J cabin the next time.

Happy wandering
Fred

 

[SimonAus]

And remember from PER, a cheap 5 hour(ish) flight to SE Asia will open opportunities for much more reasonably priced flights in all the alliances.
Effectively flying one time in paid PE will go a long way to having enough points to get (or upgrade to) seats in the J cabin the next time.

Happy wandering
Fred

This is the type of tip I was hoping for!

So effectively - bite the bullet and pay PE to get to Asia (Singapore?) and then book a rewards flight from there with more options?
Is there a 'best' way to search for awards flights? or is it just a case of (at the time of booking) looking at the Asia miles/Kris flyer/VA websites and seeing what is available?

 

[JohnM]

I can't comment on any other program than QF/OneWorld. It meets my needs, I have WP status and I travel solo, so that makes it a different scenario than yours..

 

[Happy Dude]

I think 4 x J to Europe every 18 months or so is not possible unless you operate a business in which you can pay everything with a points earning card that can be transferred to anywhere except QF. If you do not, then you may want to check out the Life Miles threads here.

It's likely that only SQ would have the availability that you need but unlikely that you'd all be on the same plane. At a minimum, you would need 848k points. Generating that amount of points, without business spend, would require some serious credit card churning and spending.

That's not to say that chasing points is futile but I would suggest that a change of objective, together with plenty of research on these fine pages, would see you undertake some very nice travels in relative luxury for not much more effort than you're already expending.

 

[SimonAus]

I think 4 x J to Europe every 18 months or so is not possible unless you operate a business in which you can pay everything with a points earning card that can be transferred to anywhere except QF. If you do not, then you may want to check out the Life Miles threads here.

It's likely that only SQ would have the availability that you need but unlikely that you'd all be on the same plane. At a minimum, you would need 848k points. Generating that amount of points, without business spend, would require some serious credit card churning and spending.

That's not to say that chasing points is futile but I would suggest that a change of objective, together with plenty of research on these fine pages, would see you undertake some very nice travels in relative luxury for not much more effort than you're already expending.

TBH, anything above economy would be great! and even though the general advice is not to 'waste' points on economy - if it just pays for an economy trip then its money saved !