Oneworld Classic Flight Reward Discussion - The Definitive Thread

[madrooster]

The french office weren't able to confirm the HKG-KUL-SYD legs due to MH never confirming the original seats and awards no longer existed. So I rang the WP desk a few hours later and despite having no award seats visible online, or to the agent initially they booked a seat in J on CX, so not sure what happened there but it was made available.

MH would've had confirmed seats in the PNR. Else they wouldn't have originally issued a ticket for those seats. It sounds like either MH took their seats back due to no ticket number being associated, or something along those lines (did you make any changes?).

They also combined the new "french" PNR with my old one and everything stayed the same, seat selection meals the lot, however when I arrived at check-in the following day BA couldn't action because the E-TICKET number hadn't been attached, so another call to the WP desk to get that fixed was needed.

Classic case of QF not issuing tickets on time. Well documented here on AFF!

At no time did any one question the request to move flights because of the no show despite me telling them I had missed it, but it could have been for any or multiple of these reasons (all speculation):

1) The call was received by QF BEFORE the "no show" message went from BA to QF.
OR
2) The call was received before scheduled departure time.
3) The french team weren't that familiar with the process & by accident they re-activated (if possible?) by playing around with the booking.
4) When speaking to the WP desk about multiple PNR's, no award seats despite a confirmed ticket on MH that apparently wasn't confirmed by them, the easiest option was to re-book and resolve the issue

The fact you got in before BA cancelled the rest of the itinerary is what saved you. There's probably some element of fault with QF themselves here. As I mentioned above, there's some likelihood they didn't do their ticketing in time and so it would've been up to them to resolve it regardless.

 

[blu]

I had major stress with 'no number, or an invalid ticket number' for about 6 codeshared flights.

 

[Alberto]

Hi I have used the RTW points several times. Hard to get away on points through South America in December and back in Jan though - are you better off paying for a cheap fare to Nth America or Europe and points to go up and down to Sth America or stick to the RTW? Thanks Alberto

 

[JohnK]

Welcome to AFF Alberto!

You might be best asking that question in the Oneworld award planning thread if you have not yet seen that thread.

 

[AndyGoodyear]

Taxes/Airlines to avoid, best research tool and best business class cabins for 280K award

Hi all. I'm looking to book a 280K award for next February/March and am currently in planning phase. I've been a QF frequent flyer for quite some time now but it will be my first time researching and booking one of these awards. I had some questions for those of you more experienced in this

1. Which airlines should I try to avoid in terms of cost (taxes, fees).
2. Which is the best tool for calculating the total taxes before I call up Qantas and get them to book it? ITA Matrix? Skyscanner?
3. Which business class cabins would you recommend in terms of both airline and type of plane? I want to make this the best J class experience possible.
4. Which partner flights will I not be able to find on Qantas.com - I know CX is one of them, are there any others? JAL?
5. I thought Emirates could have been used but alas they cannot. However I've seen on this thread a number of people saying they added EK flights without much extra cost. Does anyone have more info on this? What changes exactly if I want to add an EK flight and what should I look out for. I'm only asking because I have heard their business class product is pretty superior.

Thanks everyone!

 

[Danger]

Taxes/Airlines to avoid, best research tool and best business class cabins for 280K award

Hi all. I'm looking to book a 280K award for next February/March and am currently in planning phase. I've been a QF frequent flyer for quite some time now but it will be my first time researching and booking one of these awards. I had some questions for those of you more experienced in this

1. Which airlines should I try to avoid in terms of cost (taxes, fees).
2. Which is the best tool for calculating the total taxes before I call up Qantas and get them to book it? ITA Matrix? Skyscanner?
3. Which business class cabins would you recommend in terms of both airline and type of plane? I want to make this the best J class experience possible.
4. Which partner flights will I not be able to find on Qantas.com - I know CX is one of them, are there any others? JAL?
5. I thought Emirates could have been used but alas they cannot. However I've seen on this thread a number of people saying they added EK flights without much extra cost. Does anyone have more info on this? What changes exactly if I want to add an EK flight and what should I look out for. I'm only asking because I have heard their business class product is pretty superior.

Thanks everyone!

1. BA and QR are high. I think IB is up there, too.
2. I would use ITA but note also there are lots of taxes included in the Wiki to this thread.
3. QR A350 and 787 (and Q suites on the 777 but they will be hard to come by), particularly on long haul and overnight flights, wherever possible; CX 777, A350 and A330; AY A350.
4. CX is bookable on the QF website. I think QR flights originating in Doha are unavailable online. Possibly S7.
5. EK taxes are high. Depending on where you want to fly to, it might be better buying Y tickets outright. Personally, I don't rate their J product (although their new 777 J seat is apparently quite good).

 

[exceladdict]

Which partner flights will I not be able to find on Qantas.com - I know CX is one of them, are there any others? JAL?

JAL flights are still, more often than not IME, not showing on qantas.com. I also personally find BA easier to use anyway as you can go forward/back days without having to re-plug-in your search.

 

[AndyGoodyear]

1. BA and QR are high. I think IB is up there, too.
2. I would use ITA but note also there are lots of taxes included in the Wiki to this thread.
3. QR A350 and 787 (and Q suites on the 777 but they will be hard to come by), particularly on long haul and overnight flights, wherever possible; CX 777, A350 and A330; AY A350.
4. CX is bookable on the QF website. I think QR flights originating in Doha are unavailable online. Possibly S7.
5. EK taxes are high. Depending on where you want to fly to, it might be better buying Y tickets outright. Personally, I don't rate their J product (although their new 777 J seat is apparently quite good).

Thanks for this great info. The taxes listed in this thread are fuel surcharge - am I right in saying that other taxes are pretty much the same on each airline, which is why its the fuel surcharges listed here?

The prices of each are certainly interesting. BA and QR are indeed high, but Qantas are much higher than both of those. Calculating the fuel surcharge on a SYD / transit point / LHR itinerary comes up with the following:

JAL - Just $3 fuel surcharge????
CX - $103 AUD
AY - $200 AUD flat fee total for multiple flights all within the same itinerary. This would be extremely good value.
QR - $323
BA - $387
QF - $540

Having put together an itinerary like this that includes Emirates didn't seem to be much of a difference in points. As EK is also $540 like QF flights, is that the only difference if I added an EK flight? To clarify, it states that EK cannot be used in a OneWorld itinerary, however the cost of QF points for the same amount of mileage in a regular multi city is almost the same right? I guess I am just trying to work out if there is a difference between booking the OW award 280K through Qantas, or a regular multi city through QF which is similar points in J?

UPDATE: I have since been told by a QF agent on online chat, that under this itinerary, I can book a flight marketed by QF but operated by EK?

Have you flown AY J class? Would you rate them?

 

[nickfromeastryde]

Thanks for this great info. The taxes listed in this thread are fuel surcharge - am I right in saying that other taxes are pretty much the same on each airline, which is why its the fuel surcharges listed here?

The prices of each are certainly interesting. BA and QR are indeed high, but Qantas are much higher than both of those. Calculating the fuel surcharge on a SYD / transit point / LHR itinerary comes up with the following:

JAL - Just $3 fuel surcharge????
CX - $103 AUD
AY - $200 AUD flat fee total for multiple flights all within the same itinerary. This would be extremely good value.
QR - $323
BA - $387
QF - $540

Having put together an itinerary like this that includes Emirates didn't seem to be much of a difference in points. As EK is also $540 like QF flights, is that the only difference if I added an EK flight? To clarify, it states that EK cannot be used in a OneWorld itinerary, however the cost of QF points for the same amount of mileage in a regular multi city is almost the same right? I guess I am just trying to work out if there is a difference between booking the OW award 280K through Qantas, or a regular multi city through QF which is similar points in J?

UPDATE: I have since been told by a QF agent on online chat, that under this itinerary, I can book a flight marketed by QF but operated by EK?

Have you flown AY J class? Would you rate them?

Still not completely sure what you are asking. Using EK will mean there will be no cap on the points, they will continue going up as you add flights whereas with the 280K award, once you hit that limit all subsequent flights are capped from a points perspective at least.

It doesn't take too many flights to hit that cap and even if your planned flights are about the same, the ability to add additional flights later is also a great benefit.

I would be trying to use One World first and worrying about taxes second, it's a great way to use your points

 

[Danger]

Thanks for this great info. The taxes listed in this thread are fuel surcharge - am I right in saying that other taxes are pretty much the same on each airline, which is why its the fuel surcharges listed here?

The prices of each are certainly interesting. BA and QR are indeed high, but Qantas are much higher than both of those. Calculating the fuel surcharge on a SYD / transit point / LHR itinerary comes up with the following:

JAL - Just $3 fuel surcharge????
CX - $103 AUD
AY - $200 AUD flat fee total for multiple flights all within the same itinerary. This would be extremely good value.
QR - $323
BA - $387
QF - $540

It might be best if someone like madrooster helps with the +++ questions.

Having put together an itinerary like this that includes Emirates didn't seem to be much of a difference in points. As EK is also $540 like QF flights, is that the only difference if I added an EK flight? To clarify, it states that EK cannot be used in a OneWorld itinerary, however the cost of QF points for the same amount of mileage in a regular multi city is almost the same right? I guess I am just trying to work out if there is a difference between booking the OW award 280K through Qantas, or a regular multi city through QF which is similar points in J?

Emirates flights cannot be included in this type of award. If you've put together the itinerary that you want and it's been not much over 280k (". . . Emirates didn't seem to be much of a difference in points") then you haven't come close to maximising the value of this type of award. As just one quick example, something like MEL-HKG-JNB-LHR-JFK-SCL-SYD-MEL completed as one of these awards would top out at 280k. However, if you were include EK (e.g. HKG-DXB-JNB) it is no longer a oneworld award and you'd be looking at something upwards of probably 400k I would think. So there is a significantly higher cost in points (and almost certainly in taxes too) by including EK into your itinerary (which, again, despite what the QF agent told you, isn't possible under this type of award).

I have since been told by a QF agent on online chat, that under this itinerary, I can book a flight marketed by QF but operated by EK?

The agent is wrong.

Have you flown AY J class? Would you rate them?

Yes but not in some time and it was an A340.

 

[hanrahs]

Great info throughout this thread, thanks to all those who have contributed.

Our planing and dummy bookings are coming along pretty well for our 2XJ OWA flights, we are quite flexible in where we go, and when for the most part so finding pretty good availability for everywhere. The one we can't seem to find any availability to at all is AY to the USA (doesn't seem to matter which dates I check or which departure city or destination I check), if we don't find it we will jump on another airline but would like to try it out if we can so any ideas would be great.

our plan is basically:
PER-DOH-SKP (QR) (basically anywhere in the Balkans will do as we will spend a few months there but SKP saves a few miles)
overland
ZAG-LHR-CDG (BA) (aim for a long transfer at LHR, can start elsewhere, once again anywhere out of the Balkans and ZAG saves a few miles)
overland to Munich then ideally
MUC-HEL-MIA-BOG (AY/AA) (just want to get to Bogota, don't really mind route or where/when we start as long as it is reasonably easy to get to from Munich, more about picking a decent flying experience/new airline, obvious choice would be IB direct from Madrid for best route, just not sure on experience, or something like AA FRA-DFW or CDG-MIA where we can connect easily to BOG but I think it (FRA-DFW at least) is on the awful angled beds)

We will spend a few months over landing to Mexico somewhere, jump a last minute flight to Houston and then on to New Orleans.
then basically we return to PER, probably with a stopover somewhere for a couple days, probably try either CX or a mix of JAL/CX, but we aren't really all that worried about the route as it is basically just the trip home

We will probably use our last stopover either in London or somewhere on the route between Munich and Bogota ie Helsinki, Madrid or somewhere in the US.

Mostly been using Qantas and BAEC to check out the availability, and the one world route map and more so the flightconnections (not sure if I'm allowed to put the .com after it?) website for route planning, and GCM for distance

so a couple questions:
1. If anyone has any ideas about finding the AY flights particularly from Europe to the US I would be interested to hear them, cant use expert flyer either as they don't pick up AY in J.
2. Its easy enough to find out the plane, but is there any where to find out which configuration the plane will be in (particularly thinking of the AA flights as they have some old junk seats still flying around).
3. and any suggestions of good routes/experiences flying back from the US to PER, probably have time for a stop over of a day or two somewhere, but we basically have a week from when we finish in New Orleans until we need to be back in Perth, so may need to take whatever is available. Miles available shouldn't be a problem, should be enough to com back via DOH with QR if my calcs are correct.

 

[exceladdict]

Great info throughout this thread, thanks to all those who have contributed.

Our planing and dummy bookings are coming along pretty well for our 2XJ OWA flights, we are quite flexible in where we go, and when for the most part so finding pretty good availability for everywhere. The one we can't seem to find any availability to at all is AY to the USA (doesn't seem to matter which dates I check or which departure city or destination I check), if we don't find it we will jump on another airline but would like to try it out if we can so any ideas would be great.

our plan is basically:
PER-DOH-SKP (QR) (basically anywhere in the Balkans will do as we will spend a few months there but SKP saves a few miles)
overland
ZAG-LHR-CDG (BA) (aim for a long transfer at LHR, can start elsewhere, once again anywhere out of the Balkans and ZAG saves a few miles)
overland to Munich then ideally
MUC-HEL-MIA-BOG (AY/AA) (just want to get to Bogota, don't really mind route or where/when we start as long as it is reasonably easy to get to from Munich, more about picking a decent flying experience/new airline, obvious choice would be IB direct from Madrid for best route, just not sure on experience, or something like AA FRA-DFW or CDG-MIA where we can connect easily to BOG but I think it (FRA-DFW at least) is on the awful angled beds)

We will spend a few months over landing to Mexico somewhere, jump a last minute flight to Houston and then on to New Orleans.
then basically we return to PER, probably with a stopover somewhere for a couple days, probably try either CX or a mix of JAL/CX, but we aren't really all that worried about the route as it is basically just the trip home

We will probably use our last stopover either in London or somewhere on the route between Munich and Bogota ie Helsinki, Madrid or somewhere in the US.

Mostly been using Qantas and BAEC to check out the availability, and the one world route map and more so the flightconnections (not sure if I'm allowed to put the .com after it?) website for route planning, and GCM for distance

so a couple questions:
1. If anyone has any ideas about finding the AY flights particularly from Europe to the US I would be interested to hear them, cant use expert flyer either as they don't pick up AY in J.
2. Its easy enough to find out the plane, but is there any where to find out which configuration the plane will be in (particularly thinking of the AA flights as they have some old junk seats still flying around).
3. and any suggestions of good routes/experiences flying back from the US to PER, probably have time for a stop over of a day or two somewhere, but we basically have a week from when we finish in New Orleans until we need to be back in Perth, so may need to take whatever is available. Miles available shouldn't be a problem, should be enough to com back via DOH with QR if my calcs are correct.

If you've tried every city combo, there's not much more you can do with AY. I remember noticing Saturday flights had more avails for US>HEL when I looked a while ago. Unsure if the same the other way.

In an AAdvantage email I got today, AA had recently announced a year-round ZRH>PHL route, might be some availability on that.

Other than avoiding the 767s unsure re: avoiding bad AA planes sorry.

 

[nickfromeastryde]

Great info throughout this thread, thanks to all those who have contributed.

Our planing and dummy bookings are coming along pretty well for our 2XJ OWA flights, we are quite flexible in where we go, and when for the most part so finding pretty good availability for everywhere. The one we can't seem to find any availability to at all is AY to the USA (doesn't seem to matter which dates I check or which departure city or destination I check), if we don't find it we will jump on another airline but would like to try it out if we can so any ideas would be great.

our plan is basically:
PER-DOH-SKP (QR) (basically anywhere in the Balkans will do as we will spend a few months there but SKP saves a few miles)
overland
ZAG-LHR-CDG (BA) (aim for a long transfer at LHR, can start elsewhere, once again anywhere out of the Balkans and ZAG saves a few miles)
overland to Munich then ideally
MUC-HEL-MIA-BOG (AY/AA) (just want to get to Bogota, don't really mind route or where/when we start as long as it is reasonably easy to get to from Munich, more about picking a decent flying experience/new airline, obvious choice would be IB direct from Madrid for best route, just not sure on experience, or something like AA FRA-DFW or CDG-MIA where we can connect easily to BOG but I think it (FRA-DFW at least) is on the awful angled beds)

We will spend a few months over landing to Mexico somewhere, jump a last minute flight to Houston and then on to New Orleans.
then basically we return to PER, probably with a stopover somewhere for a couple days, probably try either CX or a mix of JAL/CX, but we aren't really all that worried about the route as it is basically just the trip home

We will probably use our last stopover either in London or somewhere on the route between Munich and Bogota ie Helsinki, Madrid or somewhere in the US.

Mostly been using Qantas and BAEC to check out the availability, and the one world route map and more so the flightconnections (not sure if I'm allowed to put the .com after it?) website for route planning, and GCM for distance

so a couple questions:
1. If anyone has any ideas about finding the AY flights particularly from Europe to the US I would be interested to hear them, cant use expert flyer either as they don't pick up AY in J.
2. Its easy enough to find out the plane, but is there any where to find out which configuration the plane will be in (particularly thinking of the AA flights as they have some old junk seats still flying around).
3. and any suggestions of good routes/experiences flying back from the US to PER, probably have time for a stop over of a day or two somewhere, but we basically have a week from when we finish in New Orleans until we need to be back in Perth, so may need to take whatever is available. Miles available shouldn't be a problem, should be enough to com back via DOH with QR if my calcs are correct.

Have done a couple of similar trips in the past (based in Syd which is much easier) and one going the other way later this year.

1. Have found generally that IB and BA offer best availability to USA east coast though IB seems to often only have 1 seat available for QFF
2. Almost impossible to find direct availability MIA to BOG. We travel there every year and have found either via CAN or DFW or even LIM if you want to travel J all the way. Most often we end up paying for a direct flight
3. Most likely to find J availability back to Perth via Asia using CX though we have jagged QF8 from DFW a couple of times

I think you might find some of these routings quite indirect and would be worried about exceeding the 35K distance allowance

 

[hanrahs]

Have done a couple of similar trips in the past (based in Syd which is much easier) and one going the other way later this year.

1. Have found generally that IB and BA offer best availability to USA east coast though IB seems to often only have 1 seat available for QFF
2. Almost impossible to find direct availability MIA to BOG. We travel there every year and have found either via CAN or DFW or even LIM if you want to travel J all the way. Most often we end up paying for a direct flight
3. Most likely to find J availability back to Perth via Asia using CX though we have jagged QF8 from DFW a couple of times

I think you might find some of these routings quite indirect and would be worried about exceeding the 35K distance allowance

Thanks for the info, i have actually found pretty good availability on the IB direct from MAD to BOG usually with multiple seats available, and that is probably the smart way to go, not sure what their A340 is like... and yes not so much on the MIA-Bog route... I assume you mean CUN can have availability, probably try and avoid LIM as the lounge situation sucks at the moment and it will make the miles a bit tight depending on the route home, we actually have a fair few miles up our sleeves as long as we get the PER-DOH-*Balkans*.

 

[landl]

Have done a couple of OneWorld RTW in one trip, however, am now looking at splitting the trip over the 12 months and need clarification around departing the same city/country once. Is it possible to depart SYD, stopover BNE and transit SYD twice eg SYD-LHR stop MXP-HKG-BNE stop AKL-SYD-SFO stop LAX-SYD-BNE? Have not calculated miles on this as yet just checking departures, transits etc. Appreciate your advice

 

[rock86]

Have done a couple of OneWorld RTW in one trip, however, am now looking at splitting the trip over the 12 months and need clarification around departing the same city/country once. Is it possible to depart SYD, stopover BNE and transit SYD twice eg SYD-LHR stop MXP-HKG-BNE stop AKL-SYD-SFO stop LAX-SYD-BNE? Have not calculated miles on this as yet just checking departures, transits etc. Appreciate your advice

If your routings are all in the one booking, then that won't be allowed under the OWE rules. You cannot pass through the country of origin, once you go back into the country (no matter the transit city) the OWE fare ceases

 

[There'sOnlyOneJimmy]

If your routings are all in the one booking, then that won't be allowed under the OWE rules. You cannot pass through the country of origin, once you go back into the country (no matter the transit city) the OWE fare ceases

As Rock said, to quote the RuleBook:
14.3.5 A Classic Flight Reward Itinerary must contain no more than one departure from the city or country of first departure on that Itinerary.

If you want to break up the itinerary, a useful strategy is to start in SE Asia (say a LCC to KUL), then onward to Europe, return to Oz, then over to US, then return to KUL. The itinerary stops there, and you LCC back to Oz.
You will need to keep an eye on the mileage though...

For a summary of the various rules, take a look at the wiki at the top of the page.

 

[landl]

As Rock said, to quote the RuleBook:
14.3.5 A Classic Flight Reward Itinerary must contain no more than one departure from the city or country of first departure on that Itinerary.

If you want to break up the itinerary, a useful strategy is to start in SE Asia (say a LCC to KUL), then onward to Europe, return to Oz, then over to US, then return to KUL. The itinerary stops there, and you LCC back to Oz.
You will need to keep an eye on the mileage though...

For a summary of the various rules, take a look at the wiki at the top of the page.

Thanks for that. I guess I was hoping the definition of "departure" was different from "transit".

 

[Ken1]

We are planning to fly SYD-AMS in May next year as the first segment of a 280K J award, and I've been checking flight releases each day for the last 3 weeks and I see that SYD-AMS is usually available in J for flights on Mon, Tue & Wed through QFF but none are released for the other days each week. The only combination of flights on Mon-Wed are CX110 departing SYD at 07:35 arriving at HKG at 15:20, connecting to CX271 departing HKG at 00:15, although they do seem to release flights on CX162 dep SYD at 10:15 in PE, but never J.

I've logged in to Asia Miles on the CX website and they seem to be releasing "Business Standard Awards" for their members every day. For example, when I looked today I saw for Sun 14 April 2019 CX162/CX271 and also CX110/CX271, and for Sat 13 April CX162/CX271 & CX100/CX271. CX100 departs SYD at 14:15 giving a 2hr15 connection time compared with 8hr55 for the flights available on QFF so they don't seem to be offering the better connections to QFF members. We don't mind spending time in the CX lounges so will be grateful for any J seats we can book, even with long connections.


I've also looked at LHR-SYD with BA for our return home at the end of the trip. We would prefer to use BA for coming home because we will get 2 x 32kg bags compared with 40kg with CX, even though the taxes etc are higher, since we always come home with more than we start with. We will actually fly from somewhere else in Europe, probably ZRH and connect through LHR to avoid the UK APD. BA are often releasing BA11/15 through QFF in J through QFF but not every day. When I log in to BAEC I see that they usually release 2 J seats each day on BA15 and they currently show as available for 8 & 9 April but these never seem to show up on QFF. When we did a 280K OWA in 2016 I was able to call up and QFF could see the BA15 flight and we booked it and added it to our OWA, even though it didn't show on the QFF site.

I want to be ready as our flights are released so tonight I called QFF to ask if they could see the CX J flights for 13 & 14 April that I can see on CX Asia Miles, and also the BA15 flights on 8 & 9 April that I can see on BAEC but they couldn't see any of these flights so it appears that they are not released to QFF. I am QFF Bronze and I wonder if these extra flights would be available to QFF Silver, Gold or Platinum members? I don't know if Bronze members have less availability for other One World airlines. Because we were able to book BA15 in 2016 I thought that this would have been available but things must have changed. Has anyone been able to book flights showing in CX or BA sites but not on QFF?

 

[Captain Halliday]

I'm in the planning stages of an award and I'm encountering errors on the QF website. Can anyone see an issue with this:

NRT-HNL stop
HNLxKIXxSYD-BNE stop
BNExMELxADLxHKG-HEL STOP
OSLxHEL-SIN

Including miles back to NRT GC Mapper says I'm 1500 under.
I'm one stop short of the maximum.
I'm well below the allowed number of transits.
The only think I can think of is that they're considering KIX to be in Tokyo for the city of first departure rule. The QF error appears when I try to add KIX.

Perhaps I'm missing something obvious because I've been working on it for hours. The itinerary cross checks fine on both BA & Awardnexus.

Can anyone spot something I'm missing?

EDIT: Within minutes of posting it dawned on me... can't depart twice from country of origin.

Back to the drawing board.