BA heading (further) down the LCC path

[drivatruk]

BA don't do pre departure drinks in Club Europe.

That would be the first airline I've travelled J on and not got a drink. Even Airasia X J give you water. When i was in South Africa last year BA (Comair) gave out drinks.

 

[anat0l]

That would be the first airline I've travelled J on and not got a drink. Even Airasia X J give you water. When i was in South Africa last year BA (Comair) gave out drinks.

At least from my last experience in 2013, LH shorthaul had no pre-departure drinks in J.

In 2015, flying SAS intra-Europe J (short/medium), there were no pre-departure drinks in J.


On the other hand, if there is a delay in pushback or something like that, drinks may be offered before departure. For example, I flew BA in Y LHR-PRG one time and we didn't pushback from our gate for a while. The crew went around the Y cabin offering water (they carried a big bottle of water and a stack of cups - you took a cup and they poured). I assume the J cabin got offered drinks (either in the same style as us, or in glasses on a tray).

 

[amaroo]

BA J motivates me to fly BA Y for flights <2 hrs Absolute dump of a cabin!

 

[TonyHancock]

Club Europe is awful......but it can be a relatively inexpensive means of picking up TP's or SC's. I tend to either use points to book Club Europe, I prefer getting off the plane quickly, particularly if back to backing in OSL, or I will book a Y flight and keep my eye open for a POUG. I just paid GBP99 for an upgrade on a flight to SVG from LHR later this year that will net me the extra TP's I need to tick over to 7000 for the year.

CE is only going to get worse because BA can't work out what it wants to be. QF has been successful with its JQ model, whilst BA backed away from this and is attempting, and failing in my view, to be all things to everyone.

 

[anat0l]

BA J motivates me to fly BA Y for flights <2 hrs Absolute dump of a cabin!

On the face of it, plenty of intra-Euro J doesn't really make you think it's all worth it. Even BA J for that matter.

When you start seeing the Hand Baggage Only fares (which even status can't help you escape), sometimes you really do wonder if flying the LCCs is a better proposition. Thinking about the lounge at your local station makes that decision even more so.

Only good thing about BA is that they still have RWS offering flights at very reasonable prices, including J if you just want a good excuse to get away from the crowd, have some extra checked baggage to use, lounge access (if you don't have it already) and have some space for your hand baggage.

 

[docjames]

CE is only going to get worse because BA can't work out what it wants to be. QF has been successful with its JQ model, whilst BA backed away from this and is attempting, and failing in my view, to be all things to everyone.

This. 678910

 

[Mattg]

CE is only going to get worse because BA can't work out what it wants to be. QF has been successful with its JQ model, whilst BA backed away from this and is attempting, and failing in my view, to be all things to everyone.

Their approach appears very misguided from my point of view. They're trying to attract low-yielding leisure travellers from the likes of Ryanair and Easyjet. And at the same time they're losing high-yielding customers by degrading the product to the point where LCCs are actually a viable alternative.

 

[BAM1748]

BA seem to be pretty average in the 21st century, it's really a shame to see considering BA's history overall since inception in the mid 1970's and some of the great things like Concorde.

I'm not sure I'd book a ticket with them in 2016.

Matt

 

[serfty]

Their cheapest fares are now called "basic". "Plus" fares come with seat selection and checked luggage included for a flat £15 to £25 more each way (depending on route/distance).

However they can be relatively cheap ... I am seeing (>1500 mile) LHR / IST for £58 each way (£83 for Plus).

 

[OATEK]

Club Europe is awful......but it can be a relatively inexpensive means of picking up TP's or SC's. <SNIP>

BA Club Europe compares poorly against QF/VA domestic J. And having flown BA, AF, AY, OS, A3 "J" in the last two years, they compare poorly there as well, despite being largely similar with the seat arrangement of Y seats and centre seat blocked. The food and service on the others above were actually very good, as we one or two of the BA flights, but they were the minority. I was surprised how good the service and food was on AF, and AY is very consistent. A3 was also very good for food and service, but they fly in to T1 at CDG which is just the weirdest setup I have yet faced. A bit like a cross between Starship Enterprise and Hogwarts, with tunnels and escalators across a round void. But this is of course OT.

I have used BA/AY where I can to maximise Pts/SC earn as you mention. The last flight with them in June was LHR-BUD, from T3 (which I found better than my BA flights out of T5), where the moveable divider was about Row 8. And the enlarged J was very full, and luckily we were in Row 3 so were served while there was still some humour in the FAs. Suffice it to say that by about Row 5 the FAs had lost their sense of humour, and were rushing to finish service. But then, with 30 minutes to go, all of a sudden good humour broke out again, and wine was proffered freely for topups etc. Real Jekyll and Hyde. Still, the food was OK, and the flight very comfortable.

One of the biggest delineators for J in the EU, is whether the airline sells by the "leg", as per say QFd, or where returns tickets are far more economic as per QFi. I found myself buying open jaw itineraries with BA, OS and AF to get around the "penalty" fares for a single leg, but A3/AB offer economic "single" fares. When you are flitting around Europe on holidays, the airlines that don't penalise for single leg fares are high on my list, regardless of Pts/SC.

 

[Isochronous]

BA - Bloody Awful!

 

[anat0l]

Their approach appears very misguided from my point of view. They're trying to attract low-yielding leisure travellers from the likes of Ryanair and Easyjet. And at the same time they're losing high-yielding customers by degrading the product to the point where LCCs are actually a viable alternative.

And yet there's still enough demand in CE such that with the flexible movement of the class divider (since CE is just Y with middle block) you can still easily fill up 5 or 6 rows on even short routes. Crazy.

I wonder how ground support compares between BA and its rival LCCs. For business travellers (i.e. those who travel for business, not necessarily flying Business Class), if the LCCs have bad support during IRROPs or even mere delays, that could push them onto BA (or other legacy carriers) unconditionally. The business crowd must be keeping BA afloat; in almost any era after the proliferation of the LCCs I'd highly doubt BA's ability to be a viking amongst the leisure market.

 

[LGW]

Ive now done a few flights in Club Europe. Personally, I think they're great value. I'd never fly economy with CE pricing so cheap.

I don't have any expectation that I'm going to have a luxury experience, but in fairness, nor am I paying for it.

I think CE is great if you look at it as getting near the front of the plane, generous luggage allowance and a decent meal.

 

[docjames]

And yet there's still enough demand in CE such that with the flexible movement of the class divider (since CE is just Y with middle block) you can still easily fill up 5 or 6 rows on even short routes. Crazy.

I wonder how ground support compares between BA and its rival LCCs. For business travellers (i.e. those who travel for business, not necessarily flying Business Class), if the LCCs have bad support during IRROPs or even mere delays, that could push them onto BA (or other legacy carriers) unconditionally. The business crowd must be keeping BA afloat; in almost any era after the proliferation of the LCCs I'd highly doubt BA's ability to be a viking amongst the leisure market.

It's likely full due to the connections from "long haul" J/F.

 

[andye]

Pretty cheap to upgrade with Avios or when offered a cash upgrade predeparture

 

[kelvedon]

And yet there's still enough demand in CE such that with the flexible movement of the class divider (since CE is just Y with middle block) you can still easily fill up 5 or 6 rows on even short routes. Crazy.

Flew an A320 LHR to ZRH this morning and the first 10 rows (yes 10) were CE, so they're doing something right. Y was full too

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I wonder how ground support compares between BA and its rival LCCs. For business travellers (i.e. those who travel for business, not necessarily flying Business Class), if the LCCs have bad support during IRROPs or even mere delays, that could push them onto BA (or other legacy carriers) unconditionally. The business crowd must be keeping BA afloat; in almost any era after the proliferation of the LCCs I'd highly doubt BA's ability to be a viking amongst the leisure market.

The major difference between BA (any legacy) and LCCs is lounge access during IRROPS. But also the rest of the ground handling including premium check-in.

Delays and cancellations (and duty of care) are the same for all - LCC or not - under EU261.

 

[blackcat20]

BA J motivates me to fly BA Y for flights <2 hrs Absolute dump of a cabin!

We realised that an exit row in Y was far better than J for those European flights...

 

[MEL_Traveller]

We realised that an exit row in Y was far better than J for those European flights...

For sure. Not sure what's the current scoop with BA Y catering - but in ye days of old it was perfectly fine for short flights. Get on, couple of G&Ts, a sarnie and landing. Perfect start and end to a weekend away from London. Scoring the left side of the first row of economy when they had convertible seating was also a bonus.

 

[serfty]

For sure. Not sure what's the current scoop with BA Y catering - but in ye days of old it was perfectly fine for short flights. Get on, couple of G&Ts, a sarnie and landing. Perfect start and end to a weekend away from London. Scoring the left side of the first row of economy when they had convertible seating was also a bonus.

Not so much anymore - basically you need a long flight to get anything substantial.

There's a good FT thread on it: BA Short haul catering guide - FlyerTalk Forums