Oneworld Classic Flight Reward Discussion - The Definitive Thread

[travelislife]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Not sure whether a new thread might be in order for this or not...but regardless.

Following on from getting the ~$1200 taxes overcharge on my award booking funded. When I spoke to QF last week they said they need to re-ticket and then it will take 5 business days to get the money back. Re-ticketing I was told would take a day or two.

On the weekend I hadn't received an email about the flights be re-ticketed so I decided to log in to check seat select. Low and behold, my three QR flights had disappeared from the booking. A call to QF yesterday to find out about this. Sure enough, some issue getting those re-ticketed. After being on hold for 15 minutes they can get two of the three flights back. They can't do anything on the weekend about the third but the lady I spoke to said she'd look into it on Monday morning and call me back.

Just got the call back. Some long winded story about they now need to wait 72 hours for QR to do something and that I should call back on Friday. No, they can't call or email me, I have to do it. I check whether this is holding up the refund and I'm told yes. They can't (read won't) refund until its re-ticketed. Now remember another 5 business days before the refund actually happens.

Personally I think this is really poor for a few reasons:

1) If I hadn't have been proactive in the first place, I would have been over-charged $1200. How many people just get ripped off I wonder.
2) If I wasn't proactive in following up the missing QR flights, I suspect I would have eventually turned up at the airport and had issues.
3) Why can't they call me back or email me to update them? Why do I need to waste my time on their lengthy hold queues...again
4) At least three weeks to get a refund from being over-charged. It really shouldn't take so long.

</whinge>

Yep it's cough.

Unfortunately with the general complexity of most of these bookings they are often processed manually so it just comes down to human error, which there is a lot of in these. It would be really interesting to know how many OneWorld awards they book each year. The average punter doesn't have a hope. I would have been stuck without the advice in this thread.

 

[hutch]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Yep it's cough.

Unfortunately with the general complexity of most of these bookings they are often processed manually so it just comes down to human error, which there is a lot of in these. It would be really interesting to know how many OneWorld awards they book each year. The average punter doesn't have a hope. I would have been stuck without the advice in this thread.

Yes it's cough. But I don't want to complain too hardcore about the "system" as I can just see QF making it simpler and fairer (aka canning it)

 

[Cardinal]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I had a similar issue. For one sector I called back several times and they could never see it even though there own website and BA could. For another sector they initially couldn't see it, but then did something and could. Makes zero sense to me.

Exactly the same for me, I feel stalkerish. I'm going to have another crack. Unfortunately the service and knowledge has been really inconsistent and it's taking up more of Qantas's and my time then I would like.

 

[immature]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I'm slowly being driven nuts. Why would Qantas staff have so much difficulty finding available QR award seats when its own website says they are available?

How are you searching for QR availability on QF website? And for which routes?

I had a problem where using multi-city tool shows availability which is not bookable (QR restriction, not QF).

 

[Pablo]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I'm currently having problem with my 2 x 280K awards and Qatar. I made a change of flight yesterday, and the booking had to be re-ticketed. Within 30 minutes of it being sent off, Qatar grabbed the initial flights back (SYD-DOH-BUD) as when I next checked back, they were missing. Called QF and they said that they have been taken back by QR.

So QF are now trying to get those seats back for me, although they have added in a 'paid' 'I Class' flight for that sector, while they attempt to get the 'U Class' fare returned.

I won't mind if it remains an I Class as the points will be nice.

Seems like there is a bit of a problem with QR at the moment and these seats.

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I'm currently having problem with my 2 x 280K awards and Qatar. I made a change of flight yesterday, and the booking had to be re-ticketed. Within 30 minutes of it being sent off, Qatar grabbed the initial flights back (SYD-DOH-BUD) as when I next checked back, they were missing. Called QF and they said that they have been taken back by QR.

So QF are now trying to get those seats back for me, although they have added in a 'paid' 'I Class' flight for that sector, while they attempt to get the 'U Class' fare returned.

I won't mind if it remains an I Class as the points will be nice.

Seems like there is a bit of a problem with QR at the moment and these seats.

I had a similar thing with my upcoming September RTW OW Award, something else changed and QR "took back" the FCO-DOH-SYD flights. Had to call and the same process was followed, eventually got the U seats back after a few days.

Trying not to touch the booking now to ensure we don't end up stranded in the EU...

 

[hutch]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I had a similar thing with my upcoming September RTW OW Award, something else changed and QR "took back" the FCO-DOH-SYD flights. Had to call and the same process was followed, eventually got the U seats back after a few days.

Trying not to touch the booking now to ensure we don't end up stranded in the EU...

Yep, once it was ticketed again, I went with no more changes! Don't want to deal with it anymore lol

 

[Danger]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I, too, have had QR award issues through QF.

It might be a naive statement but I reckon a fair few of these QR issues centre on QF's low affair with EK.

How are you searching for QR availability on QF website? And for which routes?

Qatar availability does show on QF searches. It may not be complete or exhaustive, but awards do show.

 

[yoyo]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I'm feeling a bit annoyed that I am the only one that was told it would take three months to get my Qatar flights reinstated and was pressured to change to a much longer alternative. In regard to the tax calculation, I have no idea if I was charged the correct taxes. If the exact flights I am taking are no longer available, how can I calculate the taxes to make sure I was charged correctly?

 

[Daver6]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I'm feeling a bit annoyed that I am the only one that was told it would take three months to get my Qatar flights reinstated and was pressured to change to a much longer alternative. In regard to the tax calculation, I have no idea if I was charged the correct taxes. If the exact flights I am taking are no longer available, how can I calculate the taxes to make sure I was charged correctly?

Just look at similar. In my case that's what I did. Taxes were over 25% out, so stood out. If its only a few percent, then put it down to different flights perhaps.

 

[Cardinal]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

How are you searching for QR availability on QF website? And for which routes?

I had a problem where using multi-city tool shows availability which is not bookable (QR restriction, not QF).

Guangzhou to Munich.

Do we generally find if routing is available on the British Airway site that Qantas can find seats, even if the Qantas website isn't bringing them up?

 

[immature]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Guangzhou to Munich.

Do we generally find if routing is available on the British Airway site that Qantas can find seats, even if the Qantas website isn't bringing them up?

My understanding is that QR releases availability for a route as a whole, without considering the transit city. Ie, even though there may be heaps of availability showing for CAN-DOH and DOH-MUC, there may be little or none for CAN-MUC. Have seen this referred to as married segment logic.

I've found that BA will show availability for CAN-DOH and DOH-MUC without considering the whole route, and so QF is not able to book as they can't see availability. A few operators have commented that they see availability for the first leg, but then the second leg isn't able to be added to the booking as the availability disappears.

The QF website will correctly show availability for CAN-xDOH-MUC if you search for CAN-MUC, just tested this for 5/6/2017 where there is J and Y availability for QR875 and QR57. Alternatively, I believe that if you have a stopover of more than 24 hours in DOH, this restriction doesn't apply - I haven't tested this on a real booking though.

 

[travelislife]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I'm feeling a bit annoyed that I am the only one that was told it would take three months to get my Qatar flights reinstated and was pressured to change to a much longer alternative. In regard to the tax calculation, I have no idea if I was charged the correct taxes. If the exact flights I am taking are no longer available, how can I calculate the taxes to make sure I was charged correctly?

Use ITA matrix to get a good indication.

 

[travelislife]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

My understanding is that QR releases availability for a route as a whole, without considering the transit city. Ie, even though there may be heaps of availability showing for CAN-DOH and DOH-MUC, there may be little or none for CAN-MUC. Have seen this referred to as married segment logic.

I've found that BA will show availability for CAN-DOH and DOH-MUC without considering the whole route, and so QF is not able to book as they can't see availability. A few operators have commented that they see availability for the first leg, but then the second leg isn't able to be added to the booking as the availability disappears.

The QF website will correctly show availability for CAN-xDOH-MUC if you search for CAN-MUC, just tested this for 5/6/2017 where there is J and Y availability for QR875 and QR57. Alternatively, I believe that if you have a stopover of more than 24 hours in DOH, this restriction doesn't apply - I haven't tested this on a real booking though.

I.e. Married segments. Similar to CX.

 

[Daver6]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I didn't have issues with marrying up two single sectors when booking QR flights. My issue came for a single sector that both BA and QF showed, yet QF phone operators couldn't "see" or book it.

 

[Daver6]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Well that was quicker than expected. Missing QR flight has been put back today.

 

[hutch]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I didn't have issues with marrying up two single sectors when booking QR flights. My issue came for a single sector that both BA and QF showed, yet QF phone operators couldn't "see" or book it.

Yep, I've combined 2 QR single segments before

 

[madrooster]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Yep, I've combined 2 QR single segments before

You can never combine 2 single segments like that. Both QF and QR use Amadeus and Amadeus does not permit that to happen. You would've had a situation where the through-availability was there in the first place.

For example if your routing is CAN-X/DOH-MUC, if you sell in the CAN-DOH segment on its own, then search for DOH-MUC separately, Amadeus will return availability as if you searched CAN-MUC. What basically happens is, it takes the contents of the PNR and returns availability based on the PNR content so it will see the already existing CAN-DOH segment.

I can confirm that QR uses the same married segment logic that CX uses on awards, so the availability MUST exist for the origin/destination pair, eg CAN/MUC and not CAN/DOH + DOH/MUC.

I was recently looking at QR seats for SIN/LHR for example and there's U4 on SIN/DOH and U4 on DOH/LHR, but nothing on SIN/LHR, which is another example of the above.

 

[hutch]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

You can never combine 2 single segments like that. Both QF and QR use Amadeus and Amadeus does not permit that to happen. You would've had a situation where the through-availability was there in the first place.

For example if your routing is CAN-X/DOH-MUC, if you sell in the CAN-DOH segment on its own, then search for DOH-MUC separately, Amadeus will return availability as if you searched CAN-MUC. What basically happens is, it takes the contents of the PNR and returns availability based on the PNR content so it will see the already existing CAN-DOH segment.

I can confirm that QR uses the same married segment logic that CX uses on awards, so the availability MUST exist for the origin/destination pair, eg CAN/MUC and not CAN/DOH + DOH/MUC.

I was recently looking at QR seats for SIN/LHR for example and there's U4 on SIN/DOH and U4 on DOH/LHR, but nothing on SIN/LHR, which is another example of the above.

I can only go off my experience... it is entirely possible that a LHR-JNB married segment existed, but I certainly didn't search that way. I then later switch to FRA-DOH, DOH-JNB and then again moved my FRA-DOH leg to an earlier departure, without adjusting the second leg. Again entirely possible that FRA-JNB, FRA-JNB married availability existed and hence the booking was allowed.

 

[Youfah Mizzum]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I wonder if those more experienced than me can assist...I am trying to do some preliminary trials to get an itinerary sorted for a family trip next July 2017. 4 x Y (140,000 points x 4).
I understand I can't get seats more than 353 days in advance (331 days with AA) so I am going back to June just for playing around with the system.

My desired itinerary:
SYD - TLV
TLV - LHR
LHR - JFK
JFK - HNL
HNL - SYD.

Nothing too complicated there, and it meets all the rules for the OW award. I have already called up Qantas FF call centre to discuss (twice) and both consultants found it impossible to locate seats on the JFK - HNL for any dates onwards from April with AA, even with potential transit in LAX or elsewhere. The best they said was "Book all legs you can, then call us up each day and try again because availability changes daily".
I couldn't do it online either on the Qantas site, or on the BA site. [As an aside, one of the consultants said the website is better than their own internal booking software, it runs faster and shows the same availability anyway. Hmmm?]

Have others found JFK to HNL (or any other Pacific island) hard to book?
If it ends up being simply impossible to do this (seemingly simple) leg, what would others suggest? Possibly JFK to LAX, then pay for flights to HNL, then continue the award flights from HNL to SYD? Or just give 'em a ring every day until the seats become available?

I know the issue isn't the quantity of seats I'm after, as each time I try, both online and over the phone it is only with 1 seat.

On another secondary question, the SYD-TLV TLV-LHR is just for me. The wife & kids will be going SYD-LHR direct. Would this be best on 2 separate bookings or would you think the consultant can put us all on the one booking even though the routing is slightly different?

Cheers