Your chance to see Boeing’s 787 Dreamliner in Australia

[mannej]

Re: Your chance to see Boeing’s 787 Dreamliner in Australia

So without all the spiel, a simple answer to my question is that you are not trained in aeronautical engineering?

 

[straitman]

RAM,

I honestly think you are worrying unnecessarily.

Anything designed and built by humans has some issues and aircraft are no different. It is how you ultimately deal with these issues that is important.

 

[exRAAF]

The photo showing the lady in front of the engines caused me a little concern given the plane is not fully fueled, carrying next to no cargo and no bags to speak off nor passengers. Given the "flexibility" of the wings (see 787 web site for metres of vertical flex) the approx 80cm ground clearance would seem on the low side (no pun intended).

All current Boeing and Airbus Commercial aircraft have minimum ground clearance located at engines. For example:
B777-200LR min 0.70m, max 0.88m
B777-300ER min 0.73m, max 0.99m
B777-Freighter min 0.79m, max 0.99m
* Source Boeing

May I ask how you "caught the pilot out?"

 

[RAM]

All current Boeing and Airbus Commercial aircraft have minimum ground clearance located at engines. For example:
B777-200LR min 0.70m, max 0.88m
B777-300ER min 0.73m, max 0.99m
B777-Freighter min 0.79m, max 0.99m
* Source Boeing

May I ask how you "caught the pilot out?"

I waited to speak to the pilot. The chief steward asked me what I wanted to see the pilot about and I said I had a few questions about the landing. He asked me what I wanted to know and I told him about the emergency vehicles. He then said I could wait at the side for the pilot. The other flight deck officers came out with less than a dozen or so passenger left filing off, but no sign of the pilot. After 3 or 4 more minutes the pilot appeared with no other passengers left on the plane and the cleaners on board.

The pilot first said it was normal for that airport to have the emergency vehicles out alongside the runway unlike airports elsewhere. So I played along and said why is it just a case of German over-efficiency to which the pilot replied - Something like that.

I continued to play along and asked him about the off-balance landing intimating that I was in the centre of the 3-4-3 seating (and did not mention how close the wing tip had come to the ground) and if there was anything unusual.

His reply was that it was a pretty routine landing nothing out of the ordinary.

I then asked why as I had flown into that airport the previous 4 years +/-3 days from the day (Dec/Jan school holiday vacation with the family) that the emergency vehicles had never been along side the runway nor when we were waiting to depart were they out along side the runway. Not-to-mention the fact that a number of them started to follow the plane as we passed them.

I then added that the starboard wing tip was no more than 30cm from the ground as we landed badly tilted and that it definitely was not a straight forward landing. I made a couple more remarks about the ability of the plane to safely land using only the starboard undercarriage strut with such a heavy impact.

I then went silent.

He then asked if I was a pilot.

I replied no and went silent again waiting for him to fill the void.

Wingstrike pictures A320 Lufthansa in Hamburg - YouTube

This link is of a Lufthansa A320 landing in Hamburg. Check out the ground clearance of the nacelles.

Our landing was very different in comparison because we did not side-slip at all (and the wingtip did not touch the ground). Our B777 plane did not noticeably come any closer to the edge of the runway just before or after initial impact.

The only explanation (as not being a pilot) I could think of was that there may have been a problem with the port wing undercarriage and the pilot deliberately landed the plane at such an extreme skew to avoid any contact on the initial impact.

What I was disturbed about was that there had been no announcement made before, during or after we landed. As usual a number of people had already got their bags out of the overhead lockers etc once the plane was being prepared for landing (headphones retrieved etc).

 

[AaronBradford]

I replied no and went silent again waiting for him to fill the void.

What did he say after that?

Going off this Boeing document (page 9) it seems as though the 787 minimum ground clearance for the engines is greater than that of the 777-200LR and 777-300ER while using GE engines, and with the RR engines it's still higher than the 200LR.

I think hairs are being split here, though. I would feel comfortable in a heavy landing flying on the 787.

 

[RAM]

What did he say after that?

Going off this Boeing document (page 9) it seems as though the 787 minimum ground clearance for the engines is greater than that of the 777-200LR and 777-300ER while using GE engines, and with the RR engines it's still higher than the 200LR.

I think hairs are being split here, though. I would feel comfortable in a heavy landing flying on the 787.

He then said that he was limited in what he could say but that I was correct about the landing being "unusual" and I should be happy that we were able to talk about it. He then gave a huge grin and uttered the old maxim 'Any landing you can walk away from is a good landing' and hurried off.

As it was day one of a 4 week holiday I was going to follow-up once back in OZ. But then I had a 2nd event that made me forget the landing. Booked a Budget car in Munich fitted out with Winter tyres, asked when picking up if it had them, guy went into lot, looked & said yes. Set off on 1,200km driving through German/Swiss/Austrian Alps with snow/ice etc as well as on the autobahn. Driving thru 2 to 3 inches of snow on some passes.
Last day, dropped off my family at 1,100m in an Austrian valley 60km NW of Innsbruck and set back up the mountain to return hire car. Got a few hundred metres with no load in car and car lost traction and started sliding backwards towards the edge of the road on the mountain side. A single and a half lane road. Put on handbrake, turned into the backwards slide and stopped on the edge don't know whether I did the right thing or just good luck.

Turned out the car had summer tyres. Which is against the law in Austria & driver's responsibility, but locals in valley very understanding. The road was blocked for over an hour while a relative of one of the local farmers who ran a service station some distance away closed it and brought up a set of chains for the car. Several locals help us move the car to get the chains on and the service station chap volunteered to drive it from the edge.

I ended up driving very very slowly back to Innsbruck. Austrian Budget did not believe that the car did not have snow tyres on. First guy came out had a look and said a few German words I hadn't heard before and went and got the senior guy to come have a look. They wrote out a witness statement for me and told me what to do when back in Aust. I pretty much lost a day over it.

I'd booked through Driveaway, when I got back and told them they immediately offered a full refund of the 2 week booking and followed it through with Budget. The refund was through my card two days later. The thought of what could have happened with the 5 of us & luggage in the two weeks we'd been driving around put the landing well and truly out of my mind.

 

[HW]

Boeing have released a flash video showing a 787 takeoff and landing. You can pan around the coughpit as the video is playing.

http://www.boeing.com/newairplane//787/dreampass/ or Boeing's New Airplane - Home should get you there, click on the Dream Pass link