Why Qantas why? second class service for codeshare premium pax

[CaviAck]

I have always had full MMB functionality when codesharing on other airlines metal/flights and not had this sort of problem before.

Just because you've had full MMB functionality when codesharing on other combinations, it doesn't mean it will be the same for this BA/QF combination or anything other combination out there. If BA has placed a restriction on what services you can access when flying on QF metal with BA number/stock then there's nothing you can do about it but suck it up and accept that BA is the limiting factor. That being said, you should at least try and get to the bottom of the issue to learn and not have the same issue again. If QF has passed the buck onto BA, contact BA and confirm.

 

[Altair]

Well I do not know if this is relevant but 5 years ago when travelling on QF codes on BA metal I noticed that for the same flights I had two PNRs listed on "My Bookings" page. When I went to AMS to check in for the BA flight to LHR the self check in kiosks could not locate the QF codeshare flights and luckily for me, due to the huge lines, I happened to remember the BA PNR (which is surprising as I am hopeless correctly remembering these things) and voila the BA PNR worked.
This indicated to me that even though BA and QF use Amedeus they may in fact use two PNR for the same flight so therefore if using the BA PNR in MMB may not give the full functionality but if there is a QF "shadow" PNR that may give full functionality.
Anyway this all supports my belief and experience that if you travel on codeshares you will not get the full service offerings and if you have a disruption you can find yourself lost between two airlines to sort out, so I try to avoid codeshares unless it suits my purpose eg. SC gained on QF code but EK flights for no extra cost. This is my expectation and if I get anything above this well them I will be

 

[MelUser]

I agree with comment that BA and QF aren't friends any more so there is no money or effort put into systems sharing and interface etc.

However, the current problem seems to be an upper first world problem!

 

[trixydoza]

I have always had full MMB functionality when codesharing on other airlines metal/flights and not had this sort of problem before.

I have always ordered VLML (lacto-ovo veggie) and always get VGML (vegan)

I understand that you have a cause you'd like to promote, but is this really the right forum?

And to keep things relevant, it'd be handy if you could let us all know the OneWorld airlines that work so well with QF MMB.

 

[juddles]

If anyone wants some real fun with codeshares, do what I did earlier in the year - a simple trip from Colombia to Ghana - flew MDE-MIA-PHL-MAD-LHR-ACC there, and ACC-LHR-MAD-LHR-MIA-MDE returning. All One World, but American doesn't use the same PNR system. I had to do seat selection through three different airline websites. And they lost my bag crossing the atlantic - that sector was a flight on US Airways metal, but on an Iberian codeshare, but purchased from American! Other sectors included BA codeshare/Iberia ticket, Iberia metal/BA ticket, American codeshare/BA metal, and American codeshare/US Airways metal.

Off course, most of the seat selection didn't stick via codeshare airline websites, but travelling solo in J meant that wasn't a biggie.

And certainly it is a pain in the bum when you cannot get your "favorite seat" due to the complications of the inter-airline difficulties, but I saved a hell of a lot of money by doing that way. A hell of a lot - which is why we people buy codeshares in the first place

 

[madrooster]

To clarify:

I'm flying to SIN on QF metal/aircraft and then with BA. My problem is related to the QF-operated sector only. The PNR is the same: it works on the QF MMB and the full range of J options, other than Q-eat, are available.

You'll actually have 3 PNRs for this ticket:

1. BA Amadeus PNR
2. BA BABS PNR (this gets created 7 days before departure of the first flight which is why BA's confirmation number shows as 'NOSYNC' on sites like CMT)
3. QF Amadeus operating PNR (a largely read only PNR for QF but does allow seat selection and so forth plus this is the PNR that QF will use when it goes to departure control) - applicable to codeshares only

Each of the above, will have its own record locator. The record locator that you most likely need for Q-eat is the QF operating PNR. QF should be able to find it for you, if you get them to search by your BA ticket number (125xx_xx_xx_x).

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Why not just book through a TA who can sell you a ticket marketed as QF81 or QF5 SYD/SIN then BA12 SIN/LHR if you really want the Qeat option?

Also, if you're vegetarian then about 80% of the Qeat selection will not be suitable for you so I don't quite get why the lack of the Qeat option when booking through BA is such a huge deal.

To clarify:
I'm flying to SIN on QF metal/aircraft and then with BA.

My problem is related to the QF-operated sector only. The PNR is the same: it works on the QF MMB and the full range of J options, other than Q-eat, are available.

You've still booked a BA marketed flight SYD/SIN eg BA74xx not QF81 or QF5. You booked BA marketed flights, BA do not subscribe to Qeat so QF are not treating you as second class. You need to take the issue up with BA.

Why am I flying this way? I detest DXB and find this a better, more convenient route. I realise that QF & BA have fallen out but, if they still want to codeshare the pax should not be suffering. IF they cannot give the pax proper treatment then just don't code share.

As others have said it's not QF's fault if BA choose to not subscribe to or pay extra for the Qeat option. I doubt that BA would view that not having this Qeat option is "not giving pax proper treatment" as I'd suggest you would be the only BA passenger who would expect to use it.

My point is: QF offer Q-eat and make a big deal of it. It is a good service. This is one reason I chose QF-BA rather than CX-BA for this trip. QF are treating pax in my situation as second class. They are still making money out of my fare. QF promote Q-eat but then do not offer it to everyone on their planes. If they are going to be so restrictive then they should asterix the promotions as 'only on QF ticketed and operated flights'.

I don't believe there is an option where you can fly CX-BA all booked direct through BA on BA marketed flights. You could of course book a CX marketed and operated flight SYD/HKG then a BA marketed and operated flight HKG/LHR just like you can book a QF marketed and operated flight SYD/SIN connecting with a BA marketed and operated flight SIN/LHR.

 

[Sprucegoose]

I think that codeshares and the corresponding interaction between systems is a dodgy area. Maybe it is because it is just a very complex art to weave the systems together, maybe it is because of the suspected use of cheap-recently graduated?-IT people

I frequently fly QF/LAN codeshares in J across the pacific, and seat selection is IMPOSSIBLE - the QF site and the LAN site both only have partial seatmaps, and anything you select on either system does not stick through to actual checkin stage. I have on many occasions tried to sort this through via both LAN and QF premium hotlines, have been assisted by very caring and energetic staff, but it just does not work.

thats why you need a damned good TA who understands how important these matters are to folk like us!!

i have one. PM me for details.

 

[madrooster]

I don't believe there is an option where you can fly CX-BA all booked direct through BA on BA marketed flights.

BA codeshares on most if not all of CX's HKG-AU vv. flights and they prefer to sell the CX codeshare over the QF codeshare generally I've found. BA fares generally allow either BA codeshare on CX, CX prime, QF prime or BA codeshare on QF for the Asia-AU sector.

 

[katiebell]

In reply to comments above:

I had the option of CX codeshare on a BA booking but chose QF because of a superior product (eg Q-eat) or so I thought

Whilst it may be a part of the QF/BA tiff, QF are still marketting Q-eat on Qantas flights i.e. to the average pax that would mean if on QF metal. If it is not available on codeshare on QF metal then, in the interests of transparency and not having misleading advertising, QF really should add *only available on flights with a QF flight number and QF aircraft. Not available on codeshare tickets on QF aircraft. Or something similar then it would be clear.

Most of my codeshares have been on other airlines metal and thier websites have given me the same functionality as I have had with the MMB when on that airline's tickets.

Re why do I want to do this if I am vegetarian? Because I want to ensure that the meal I am served is one that I can eat for both dietary reasons and allergy reasons. I do not want to have the plane diverted to Alice or Darwin because of eating something that makes me ill. The Q-eat allows me to read the ingredients and ensure the food is safe. Why not order VLML? because of not knowing the ingredients and because the caterers do not care and serve a VGML meal with a VLML sticker and think that is OK: these meals are usually inedible and often contain the ingredient I cannot eat.

Yes, I agree that this is a first world problem but then isn't almost everything on AFF first world? Most third world problems never get anywhere near aircraft unless it is to do with being bombed by them. Fortunately we live in the first world, pay first world prices and, not unreasonably IMHO, expect first world goods and services in exchange f0or first world payments.

 

[Princess Fiona]

In reply to comments above:

I had the option of CX codeshare on a BA booking but chose QF because of a superior product (eg Q-eat) or so I thought

Whilst it may be a part of the QF/BA tiff, QF are still marketting Q-eat on Qantas flights i.e. to the average pax that would mean if on QF metal. If it is not available on codeshare on QF metal then, in the interests of transparency and not having misleading advertising, QF really should add *only available on flights with a QF flight number and QF aircraft. Not available on codeshare tickets on QF aircraft. Or something similar then it would be clear.
.

I'm perplexed that you would choose QF over CX on a BA booking because of a superior product in Q-eat. Astounded actually but that's my opinion and obviously you think otherwise and are entitled to that opinion.

QF are marketing Q-eat as that's part of them advertising what's available on their tickets, pure and simple. There's no need to add disclaimers on codeshare flights booked through another airline as the average pax would think that if you buy a ticket with QF you get Q-eat and that is in fact 100% correct.

Are BA marketing Q-eat as part of their advertising?
No I don't think so. The average pax booking a BA ticket regardless of operating carrier is not expecting to be able to pre-order their meal as that's not a service BA market or offer.

Your expectations and disappointments are entirely caused by the fact that you are not the "average pax" and you have a far greater understanding of the range of options available to you on a QF ticket as you have in fact flown QF J before.

 

[Ansett]

Perhaps a review of the Terms and Conditions would have prevented your disappointment.

Select Inflight Meal | Qantas

You will see no Code Share flights are notated as eligible including those of its close partner EK.

May I also suggest that you read and understand the conditions from Point 7 and below given your special meals requirement.

The perceived failure is neither that of QF or BA and rests solely, I am afraid, on your shoulders and lack of attention to detail.

Important Flight Information

You must be travelling on an eligible Qantas operated international service. View Terms and Conditions.

 

[eminere]

Perhaps a review of the Terms and Conditions would have prevented your disappointment.

Select Inflight Meal | Qantas

You will see no Code Share flights are notated as eligible including those of its close partner EK.

May I also suggest that you read and understand the conditions from Point 7 and below given your special meals requirement.

The perceived failure is neither that of QF or BA and rests solely, I am afraid, on your shoulders and lack of attention to detail.

Important Flight Information

You must be travelling on an eligible Qantas operated international service. View Terms and Conditions.

And hence, Hanlon's razor: Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

 

[mannej]

Katie - you mention the average pax. I think you have it the wrong way around with what you have mentioned. More often then not it is the average pax complaining about purchasing a fare on airline X, but ended up on airline Y flying a codeshare (QF flight no. On JQ is the classic), not the other way around as you mention.

 

[katiebell]

Perhaps a review of the Terms and Conditions would have prevented your disappointment.

Select Inflight Meal | Qantas

You will see no Code Share flights are notated as eligible including those of its close partner EK.

May I also suggest that you read and understand the conditions from Point 7 and below given your special meals requirement.

The perceived failure is neither that of QF or BA and rests solely, I am afraid, on your shoulders and lack of attention to detail.

Important Flight Information

You must be travelling on an eligible Qantas operated international service. View Terms and Conditions.

Isn't a flight on a RPT Qantas liveried aircraft with Qantas crew a 'Qantas operated international service' (JetConnect excluded). If they mean 'not available on code share flights on QF aircraft' then they should state so: that would be attention to detail. The T&C do not: I did read them. I would not expect this on a QF flight number on an EK aircraft, Ansett, as QF have no control on what another carirrier does on its metal: that really would be stupid.

All I am saying is that Qantas should clearly state that this is not available on Qantas aircraft unless the ticket has a Qantas flight number, or whatever other retriction they decide to have.

My other point, now lost in everyone's desire to label me as stupid, is that offering codeshare pax this additional benefit will show pax, who may not have experienced a great service like Q-eat, that QF offer a better product and, just maybe, the pax will choose to fly QF in the future, i.e. a bit of free marketing to other carrier's pax.

Finally, the average pax now know about codeshare. 10 years ago they did not, now they do.

 

[mannej]

Finally, the average pax now know about codeshare. 10 years ago they did not, now they do.

Sorry, but that is your opinion only. I think that if you trawl through the threads on here about pax on codeshare flights, it may suggest otherwise.

 

[Ansett]

Isn't a flight on a RPT Qantas liveried aircraft with Qantas crew a 'Qantas operated international service' (JetConnect excluded). If they mean 'not available on code share flights on QF aircraft' then they should state so: that would be attention to detail. The T&C do not: I did read them. I would not expect this on a QF flight number on an EK aircraft, Ansett, as QF have no control on what another carirrier does on its metal: that really would be stupid.

All I am saying is that Qantas should clearly state that this is not available on Qantas aircraft unless the ticket has a Qantas flight number, or whatever other retriction they decide to have.

My other point, now lost in everyone's desire to label me as stupid, is that offering codeshare pax this additional benefit will show pax, who may not have experienced a great service like Q-eat, that QF offer a better product and, just maybe, the pax will choose to fly QF in the future, i.e. a bit of free marketing to other carrier's pax.

Finally, the average pax now know about codeshare. 10 years ago they did not, now they do.

Qantas clearly nominate eligible flight numbers again there is no BA flight numbers where this is applicable. End of story. Your mistake and a lesson learnt no doubt.

If you want full Qantas Service then book and pay Qantas Ticketed operated and numbered flight, don't book code shares.

 

[mannej]

Can someone correct me, but is it still the case that on certain flights EK flights that also have the codeshare QF number, those on the QF flight number do not get CD, whilst those on the EK number will?

If that still occurs, there is an example of the marketing carrier (BA in your case) not offering the full bells and whilstles of the operating carrier.

 

[Ansett]

Can someone correct me, but is it still the case that on certain flights EK flights that also have the codeshare QF number, those on the QF flight number do not get CD, whilst those on the EK number will?

If that still occurs, there is an example of the marketing carrier (BA in your case) not offering the full bells and whilstles of the operating carrier.

Absolutely Correct MEL-SIN is a good example of this.

 

[madrooster]

In reply to comments above:

I had the option of CX codeshare on a BA booking but chose QF because of a superior product (eg Q-eat) or so I thought

Did you end up getting a hold of the QF operating PNR? Does that PNR have the ability to use Q-eat?