When is fraud, not fraud? [Car rental charges after return]

[nutwood]

I've been caught somewhere in NSW, Armidale I think, where there's a petrol station right next to the airport but it doesn't open early. I remember that they carefully told me to "..fill the car before returning. There's a station just next to the airport.", whilst omitting the key information on opening hours. You turn up for the first flight and you can't fill the car. Of course, you don't have to fill the car, they'll do it for you at $3/litre...

 

[MickC32]

My 2 cents.....

I really don't think senior management instruct employees to rip off the average punter, it would be too hard to keep quiet. Pressure can be applied other ways though like "we need a good month", "push extras" etc which could even include incentives for hitting top line and/or bottom line targets. Then the individual takes it upon themselves to invent ways to achieve the targets.

I think it happens way too often for it to be purely errors. One time as I paid my dinner and drinks tab I thought it sounded higher than I had imagined. Sure enough upon checking there were 4 extra drinks on my tab. Raised it and was told the waiter must have failed to clear the previous account properly. Right! Lesson learned though and I now check closely before payment and pick up lots of errors and only one ever in my favour (which I pointed out to them and they gladly took my extra cash)

My last point is that while I agree most people do not wish to blatantly rip off other people, we travellers are seen as easy targets, perhaps even faceless. To the average Joe or Josephine we appear to be living the dream travelling here and there and thus it is assumed we are rich and won't notice the extra charge or 2. Or we are travelling on the company expense account and who really cares about that.

Cheers

 

[nutwood]

My 2 cents.....

I really don't think senior management instruct employees to rip off the average punter, it would be too hard to keep quiet. Pressure can be applied other ways though like "we need a good month", "push extras" etc which could even include incentives for hitting top line and/or bottom line targets. Then the individual takes it upon themselves to invent ways to achieve the targets.

I think it happens way too often for it to be purely errors. One time as I paid my dinner and drinks tab I thought it sounded higher than I had imagined. Sure enough upon checking there were 4 extra drinks on my tab. Raised it and was told the waiter must have failed to clear the previous account properly. Right! Lesson learned though and I now check closely before payment and pick up lots of errors and only one ever in my favour (which I pointed out to them and they gladly took my extra cash)

My last point is that while I agree most people do not wish to blatantly rip off other people, we travellers are seen as easy targets, perhaps even faceless. To the average Joe or Josephine we appear to be living the dream travelling here and there and thus it is assumed we are rich and won't notice the extra charge or 2. Or we are travelling on the company expense account and who really cares about that.

Cheers

I totally agree with you regarding deliberately ripping customers off. Pressure can be as simple as letting it be known that any mistakes that cost the company money will be treated very seriously, whilst not showing any real concern when customers complain about over charges.
The waiter who can't remember whether they delivered an extra round of drinks or not will err on the safe side and shove them down anyway.
The employee checking the mini bar who can't remember whether or not that beer was missing when they checked yesterday, shoves it down just in case, and so it goes.

 

[Tamerton]

We hired a car in Broome for one day while cruising. We were charged over $600 on our credit card for 1200 km which we did not do.
I called them after the charge appeared on our credit card and I received good service and the charge was reversed pretty quickly. Its a well known company beginning with A. I wasn't happy when it happened but they did resolve it fairly quickly.

 

[clementine6]

I once returned a car mid afternoon to Tullamarine that I had picked up in the Melbourne CBD the same morning, and driven to Geelong before heading to the airport. The car rental company charged me for excess mileage. I pointed out that given the times I picked up and dropped off the car (which were not disputed) I would have had to have been traveling at an average speed of 168km/hour for the entire 7 hour period in order to cover the distance they claimed i had driven.Talk about trying it on.

I would say that of the last dozen times I've rented cars I've had fraudulent charges added to 10 of them

 

[Richard Ling]

I've made a habit of taking a video of the car at pickup. Just a quick walk around with phone. Photo of the dashboard, showing the fuel gauge is also done at drop off.

Was in Calgary in January, and Budget there charged me for a pre-existing broken windscreen wiper. A dispute lodged, with the attached video, and they reversed the charge. Without the video, I've would have been stuck with the extra charge, despite it being marked in the pickup sheet, but not detailed as a broken windscreen wiper.

 

[vetrade]

It's a big mistake not to cover everything. Resist the urge some people have of expecting verbal assurances from the agent to be satisfactory. Allow yourself enough time both at pickup and drop-off to get it right and in writing. Being a pedantic type I never let the agent just take the keys at drop-off and wave us goodbye.
Do all the things others have mentioned like photographing the vehicle, checking fuel level and odometer reading against the paperwork etc. At drop off I present the receipt for fuel and I also insist the agent inspects the car with me and signs my copy of the docs to the effect that the car is full, there is no damage and the odometer reading is "xyz". I also insist they include a statement that there are no further charges payable. Make sure you get their name if the signature is illegible. It is surprising how many resist finalising everything to my satisfaction on the spot but I don't leave until they do.
Needless to say, just dropping off the car and putting the keys in a box without it being checked is as foolhardy as you can get in my book.

 

[2infinity]

I recently hired a car in New Zealand and was unfortunately enough to be rear ended by a careless driver. I followed all the procedures outlined in my rental agreement for such an event, got photos of the damage, obtained complete details from the at fault driver including their insurance provider and policy number. I reported all this to my rental company. I did not receive an acknowledgment of my report until I hassled them. This happened in the first week of my 4 week vacation. The vehicle was still usable and when I returned it at the end of the rental period, I was required to pay the excess. This was stated in the contract, so I knew it was coming. I was assured that their investigations team would refund my money considering the information I provided. I note their investigations team had done nothing in the 3 weeks after the incident, despite the information I gave them with the required 12 hours.

When I returned to Australia, I was contacted by their investigations team and told I didn't fill out the correct paperwork. I disputed this, but had to redo it anyway. It's like talking to a brick. I was then told to make a claim against my travel insurance. I told them I disagreed with this and said I am entitled to a refund of the excess once they have made a claim on the 'at fault' drivers insurance. They quickly responded saying yes yes we can do that. Anyway I left it 6 weeks without contact from them, so I contacted the rental company and asked what's going on. I get told 'oh we tried ringing the at fault driver and sent them a letter, but haven't heard from them so there's nothing more we can do'. I was a little flabbergasted at their incompetence. I asked why they hadn't contacted the insurance company of which full details were supplied. This was never answered. I personally contacted the at fault driver myself who advised the claim had already been processed and the money provided to my rental company. She even gave me the claim and payment references. I'm just thinking 'What the ..........', so I contact the rental company and put this too them. They got back to me a day later saying they would refund the money to me. No apology for the lies and incompetence. I am just thankful that the at fault driver was scrupulous.

Makes me think that in a less regulated country worse could happen and there's very little you can do about it. There's the tyranny of distance, time, language and money to swim through trying to deal with rental car companies.

 

[blaz]

It seems to be a franchise thing, because while mistakes can be honest, a culture of deceptive practice comes from the management, rather than the brand. I think it helps to have elite status though, as the franchisee knows that upsetting a regular customer will leave a stain on the whole brand. Offering low rental rates often means that adding clip ons in the form of various insurances, pre bought petrol, baby seats etc. are often the only way of making profits.

 

[CMA222]

Some time back I had a Hertz rental car in Queensland and a side door was backed into by another vehicle. On returning the vehicle I had to complete all Hertz's paperwork and pay the excess ($2000). I had the at fault driver's personal and insurance details and sat back and waited for my excess to be refunded but I heard nothing. After about 8 weeks I queried the repayment of the excess I had paid and was told that actions would now be initiated to authorise the refund of my $2000. It was clear to me that if I had not chased them the reimbursement would not have been paid.

 

[BAM1748]

Makes me think that in a less regulated country worse could happen and there's very little you can do about it. There's the tyranny of distance, time, language and money to swim through trying to deal with rental car companies.

In South America, it was cheaper the buy the car after an accident than all the add ons. The car would have been a write off here but in those countries they will still repair it, and charge for that and the days rental it's off the road.

 

[Millie]

I wonder just how many of these things 'get through' because people had not double checked like you had and were in a position to raise an objection.

I recently hired a car for 2 days in Spain through Rentalcars.com , they debited my credited card for $827.00 Au$ including an international charge of $24. I have requested twice from the merchant the amount to be refunded immediately - all I get is an automated response stating it can take up to 30 days for the amount to credited back into my account! Another example of rental car companies basically "stealing" - using money that isn't theirs for as long as they possibly can.

 

[geoffs]

True, but how often to people come along to public forums, such as this, bragging about how they got away with excess km, or one days less rental? Also, in any event if km were under-reported (or reported as returned eight hours earlier) would anyone really notice, as long as not overcharged? People tend not to take so much notice of the detail if the charge was as expected.

Standard procedure:
Photo of Odometer at start and end of hire.
Video of car at start and end of hire.
All easily done on your phone.
The biggest ripoff from hire companies is the daily insurance they charge to cover the $4,000 excess or damage but you can get a better rare online on your phone before you take delivery of the car.

 

[maxwelljames]

Not really - I find it happens with any business that keeps your credit card, and is especially rife in rental cars (such as this case) and hotels (here, here's a charge for that beer you didn't have from the minibar)

Vigilance is key.

is it possible to mention the names of companies which have always done the right thing , as distinct from the offenders as I know that that would lead to legal problems.

 

[nutwood]

is it possible to mention the names of companies which have always done the right thing , as distinct from the offenders as I know that that would lead to legal problems.

To date, Budget have always done the right thing by me. I've also had no problems with Europcar but I've always felt slightly uneasy with them, possibly because their interpretation of "or similar" makes one wonder and I've quite frequently noticed damage that's not noted on the paper-work.
I think these things probably vary from location to location. I recall booking Budget out of somewhere that I can't recall, and the experience was entirely different. No problem but I wouldn't have rushed back! Budget's communication is terrible though. I'd hate to have a problem with them that you didn't deal with on the spot.

 

[OATEK]

To date, Budget have always done the right thing by me. I've also had no problems with Europcar but I've always felt slightly uneasy with them, possibly because their interpretation of "or similar" makes one wonder and I've quite frequently noticed damage that's not noted on the paper-work.
I think these things probably vary from location to location. I recall booking Budget out of somewhere that I can't recall, and the experience was entirely different. No problem but I wouldn't have rushed back! Budget's communication is terrible though. I'd hate to have a problem with them that you didn't deal with on the spot.

I have used AVIS in Tas, Austria, France etc - and so far so good. Even when I did a drop at CDG, where it was mayhem with a bunch of people dropping off all at once, the attendant rolled the car out into the sunshine, did a check and signed the all clear. Picking up from AVIS in Berlin in a few weeks, and hoping the good experience continues .

 

[First two rows]

Hi all, long time trawler - first time poster

I rented a truck from Avis and used it t move my daughters furniture a considerable distance. I have a preferred account with Avis which allowed me a few extra KM per day, but not many.

Upon arrival at new residence (> 1000 km) I checked KM and saw an inordinate variation to the KM I expected to do. I used an odometer app as well as a speed app on the return journey and found a variance at 17% which was 17% of 2500 km @ 30 cents that I would be paying for.

I discussed this upon arrival at my original hiring point and also offered an explanation being the lower profile truck tyres that had been fitted on the drive axle (checked off tyre compliance plate on truck) were causing the increase in wheel rotations, therefore overcharge for KM. I was promised a "look into the matter" and after two follow up calls took the matter to Avis corporate.

I explained the situation as well as asking how, with inaccurate odometer, can you charge based on that. My fruit shop and butcher both need to have their scales calibrated and certified regularly to charge me for produce. I explained that would be the basis for my argument with Dept of Fair trading if we continued.

Refund of disputed km within 24 hours but no apology or undertaking to rectify the issue. So, we need to certify the scales that sell us a kilo of prawns BUT can be charged for km or fuel based on rubbery science y car rental companies,

 

[nutwood]

That's a really interesting one. If I'm doing a long trip in a hire vehicle, I generally check the speedo against the GPS on my phone. Based on this, I tweak the cruise control to sit on the limit. Also sometimes I check time against distance as boredom relief. Invariably, every car I've checked is out by at least 5%. Mostly I try and hire with unlimited km's so I'm not suggesting any evil intent, it's more an ADR thing where speedos can't read low, but there's a margin allowed for reading high.
In your case though, and in most long trips with a truck, that odometer becomes very significant. I know the occasional times I've been in this position, the km charge is considerably more than the daily rate. At $0.30/km, your charge is on the low side for commercial vehicles, it could go a lot higher, depending on the vehicle. Even 5% could be a significant error, especially for a truck owner forced to hire for a week or two due to a breakdown. Those odometers really ought to have a calibration certificate if they are used to base charges on. Then a correction factor could be applied to the distance charged.

 

[nutwood]

The sums are interesting. Assuming a set of tyres lasts 50,000 kms, at 17% error and $0.30/km, those tyres net a useful $2550. I reckon that'd nicely cover the cost of six new tyres.
How to make tyres pay for themselves; just reduce the profile a bit!

 

[Deleted member 62084]

I have also been a victim of an unexplained higher charge than what was expected, but it had nothing to do with extra mileage, damage, or anything else for that matter. I have only ever rented a car twice in my life.

Brief history: Became Velocity Gold status, linked up with a major car rental company, automatically got elevated a couple of status levels with them, planned a holiday months in advance, selected a car, was given a free upgrade when we picked it up, received an invoice receipt a few days after getting back home for the same amount as the original quote.

Second time, still at the same status level I planned another holiday well in advance, selected a car, was given a free upgrade when we picked it up, received an invoice receipt a few days after getting back home for a higher amount than what was quoted, by about 10%. No explanation. I sent an email via their website and was refunded the difference a couple of weeks later, but again, with no explanation.

I'm still confused why I was charged more. Even by the invoice I was under the km allowance and I returned the car full of fuel, there was no (additional) damage, and it was returned on time. I assumed it was because of the "free" upgrade, but I had already had a precedent set in place, and the car had the same category code as what I had originally chosen. Those factors formed the basis of my argument in the email.

Although I was successful in being refunded the difference, it sucks that the onus is on the customer to chase it up.