What's the point having points if you have to pay $850 in "fees"?

[ashleyn]

I might be the odd one out but my next planned booking is 2 x RTN Per-Europe (been saving points for 18 months). The points spend for J is approx 500k and the T&C about $1,500. The cash fare for the same flights is around $30k. Seems like a pretty good deal to me ?

 

[amaroo]

I might be the odd one out but my next planned booking is 2 x RTN Per-Europe (been saving points for 18 months). The points spend for J is approx 500k and the T&C about $1,500. The cash fare for the same flights is around $30k. Seems like a pretty good deal to me ?

Not the only one. Been happy with every award I've booked.......the cash component is peanuts IMO.

 

[bismarck]

Not the only one. Been happy with every award I've booked.......the cash component is peanuts IMO.

I think it's more that the points component is pretty high (for most people, it would take a damn long time to earn 500k points)....and then QF twists the knife with some pretty hefty fees.

I know that for me, redemptions with Qantas in premium cabins are pretty far beyond my reach because it would take me so many years to earn enough points to do it.

It frustrates me when I look over at AA (for instance) and see both much lower points and no fuel surcharge on award tickets.

Don't get me wrong, I really like flying with Qantas but I just don't earn enough money (and hence spend enough) to generate the points required for premium seats. There's not much of a way around, but I still look longingly east and wish I could have an SPG Amex and direct my spending to a variety of airlines 1:1.05 based on my needs at any given time (and then redeem without hefty surcharges).

 

[JohnK]

Trying flying JQ to Hawaii and then use SQ for an internal US flight. Uses fewer points and you don't pay fuel surcharge on the US sector + low value on award chart for SQ

Why not Qantas for domestic US flights.

Qantas does not charge fuel surcharges on US domestic bookings.

 

[Isochronous]

Why not Qantas for domestic US flights.

Qantas does not charge fuel surcharges on US domestic bookings.

Why do that when you can get a YUPP on AA code.

 

[Isochronous]

I think it's more that the points component is pretty high (for most people, it would take a damn long time to earn 500k points)....and then QF twists the knife with some pretty hefty fees.

I know that for me, redemptions with Qantas in premium cabins are pretty far beyond my reach because it would take me so many years to earn enough points to do it.

It frustrates me when I look over at AA (for instance) and see both much lower points and no fuel surcharge on award tickets.

Don't get me wrong, I really like flying with Qantas but I just don't earn enough money (and hence spend enough) to generate the points required for premium seats. There's not much of a way around, but I still look longingly east and wish I could have an SPG Amex and direct my spending to a variety of airlines 1:1.05 based on my needs at any given time (and then redeem without hefty surcharges).

Amex Plat (and maybe Diners) lets you transfer to SPG right?

 

[bismarck]

Amex Plat (and maybe Diners) lets you transfer to SPG right?

Amex PlatEdge does as well, but obviously only at 1:0.5 (not sure if the Plat Charge is different).

SPG Amex is, IMO, one of the best credit cards for people like me who want to keep their options open for reward redemptions and not necessarily pin to a particular carriers program (and I don't have enough spend to split it across too many different programs).

https://www304.americanexpress.com/credit-card/starwood-preferred-guest/

 

[Jack_OC]

I might be the odd one out but my next planned booking is 2 x RTN Per-Europe (been saving points for 18 months). The points spend for J is approx 500k and the T&C about $1,500. The cash fare for the same flights is around $30k. Seems like a pretty good deal to me ?

The cash fare for 2 J rtns to EU is $30k? Are you serious? If so that says something about QF's cash fares as well! IME you can pretty much always find J fares to EU on good airlines for $8-10k each, and sometimes even less.

Not the only one. Been happy with every award I've booked.......the cash component is peanuts IMO.

The cash component is peanuts if you're booking J or F, but as the OP correctly pointed out, for Y tickets it can be 50% of what you'd pay if you just bought a ticket with cash.

 

[amaroo]

The cash component is peanuts if you're booking J or F, but as the OP correctly pointed out, for Y tickets it can be 50% of what you'd pay if you just bought a ticket with cash.

Using QFF points for Y flights is not the best.....it sucks!

SYD-LAX-SYD in J is 192,000 points + fee ?. OP if you're not going to build points from here - use them in style.

 

[Jack_OC]

Using QFF points for Y flights is not the best.....it sucks!

SYD-LAX-SYD in J is 192,000 points + fee ?. OP if you're not going to build points from here - use them in style.

Yes I agree, and to be fair to QFF the same is true with most FF programs. Points are a great way to get very cheap premium tickets, but not to get free (or even almost free) Y tickets.

 

[aikman]

Yes I agree, and to be fair to QFF the same is true with most FF programs. Points are a great way to get very cheap premium tickets, but not to get free (or even almost free) Y tickets.

Most US FF programs don't charge fuel surcharges therefore award tickets really are almost free.

 

[Jack_OC]

Most US FF programs don't charge fuel surcharges therefore award tickets really are almost free.

Yes, that's correct actually. Unfortunately it's difficult to earn points and status with US carriers from Oz (you can really only earn by flying and by convoluted means using CCs, which give a poor earn rate).

AFAIK all of the FF programs that directly target Aussie residents impose surcharges (I know VA, EK, EY, SQ and MH do anyway). There is still a differential in how much the surcharges are and how many points are required though, and as noted above QF is at the more expensive end on both counts. The net result is that redeeming QFF pts on intl Y fares is almost a waste of time.

 

[Peter78]

Most US FF programs don't charge fuel surcharges therefore award tickets really are almost free.

Slightly off-topic but hopefully still relevant to the discussion: LH is not better with their Miles & More program. We had some points left over and recently redeemed for a one-way flight from YVR to MUC for Octoberfest 2014. Flying in J, the cost was 52K points + A$507 ea. At that level of surcharges/ fees, a Y redemption would have represented terrible value!

Just another reference point, although I guess M&M is not very relevant for the Australian market...

 

[travelislife]

AFAIK all of the FF programs that directly target Aussie residents impose surcharges (I know VA, EK, EY, SQ and MH do anyway). There is still a differential in how much the surcharges are and how many points are required though, and as noted above QF is at the more expensive end on both counts. The net result is that redeeming QFF pts on intl Y fares is almost a waste of time.

This is incorrect. VA do not charge surcharges. Government and airport imposed taxes only. Hence why on a MEL-LAX return the difference in dollars on an award ticket between VA and QF can be $500+ with a similar points cost.

 

[Jack_OC]

This is incorrect. VA do not charge surcharges. Government and airport imposed taxes only. Hence why on a MEL-LAX return the difference in dollars on an award ticket between VA and QF can be $500+ with a similar points cost.

Sorry, by "surcharges" I really just meant cash was required in addition to points.

It's certainly true that the cash component required with VA is much lower though, almost low enough to be irrelevant, and you're right that they are just passing on externally imposed taxes/charges, which seems easier to justify. As I said, QF is expensive wrt to points required and cash required.

Another factor is that credit card earn rates can be higher for many programs other than QFF.

 

[serfty]

MEL-LAX	Economy Points & +++	Economy Points Only	Prem. Econ. Points & +++	Prem. Econ Points Only	Business¹ Points & +++	Business Points Only
Qantas FF	48000 & $484	110230 ²	72000 & $484	134230 ²	96000 & $534	164460 ²
Velocity*	47000 & $94	60705	70500 & $94	84235	94000 & $94	107765

* Approximate - Adjusted to remove October 15% discount
¹ Note that Qantas charge an additional $50 YQ (Fuel fine) on T-Pac business class flights
² Estimated at .78 ¢ per point

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Slightly off-topic but hopefully still relevant to the discussion: LH is not better with their Miles & More program. We had some points left over and recently redeemed for a one-way flight from YVR to MUC for Octoberfest 2014. Flying in J, the cost was 52K points + A$507 ea. At that level of surcharges/ fees, a Y redemption would have represented terrible value!

Just another reference point, although I guess M&M is not very relevant for the Australian market...

agree miles and more can be atrociously bad for its surcharges... to the point where those surcharges can exceed the cost of the ticket outright particularly for intra-Europe or other domestic redemptions!