Use of lithium Batteries for medical equipment on board

[krm]

I started this thread to warn air travelers of new regulation some airlines have introduced .

Specifically the use of lithium batteries are now banned . It is true that IATA regulation do allow installed lithium batteries and there is a grey area where the "powerbank " the sole purpose of which is to power a device and packed with a CPAP machine .

Some airlines have gone over board banning lithium batteries completely in flight meaning any medical device is effectively not allowed to be use unless you have several kg of non lithium gel batteries at hand.

It is important to note that you can carry a lithium power bank ( under 100W ) but not use it. but you cant carry a CPAP machine unless it has self non lithium batteries. I have sought clarification from one airline on if this includes a CPAP you are not using ( It a stupid dumb , dare I say discriminatory rule )

The culprit is SCOOT airlines who state Scoot's policy requires that CPAP devices must be self-powered using a gel or dry battery, as in-flight power for such equipment is not provided. I should add I have had numerous communications with them pointing out IATA and Singapore airline rules to no avail.

Scoot airlines is a subsidiary of Singapore airlines. Singapore do allow it, even more stupid.

Cathay Pacific also ban the use of lithium batteries on board citing Hong Kong civil aviation rules despite their rules specifically allowing medical equipment as the IATA rules do. Last flight I took they gave permission to use the CPAP if the batteries were under 100W but was refused permission to use the batteries when on board even though I showed them the approval I printed out ( mains was available so it wasn't an issue )

This mess will only be resolved if more people complain to the airlines but ultimately it Needs IATA to clarify the rules to their member airlines, there are no contact details on their website, hopefully someone in that organization picks up on this.

I would appreciate any suggestions or hearing of similar experiences because I am looking at a booked 8 hour flight leaving at 3am and I am not allowed a comfortable sleep.

I have not been able to find a suitable battery designed for CPAP machines that complies any recommendation on that would be great.

Currently I suggest if you need to use any medical equipment requiring lithium batteries don't book SCOOT be careful with CATHAY PACIFIC and always check with the airline. Its a pity they are both pretty good otherwise


Keith

 

[Quickstatus]

I have not been able to find a suitable battery designed for CPAP machines that complies any recommendation on that would be great.

I believe all CPAP batteries are Li-ion and most under 100W but most airlines allow you to carry spares. For example, If under 100W QF allows up to 20 spares in carry on luggage.

Basically the bottom line is to always check with airline.
Regardless of what IATA says or does not say, each airline has the final decision.

The only suggestion i can make is to get a 12V AGM battery (yes but then you need a converter which CPAP providers usually can supply as an accessory

Resmed has a battery guide which discusses use of AGM batteries.
The equivalent AGM battery would be something like a 20-25Ah AGM sealed deep cycle battery but instead of weighing 0.5Kg, these batteries likely would weigh 7-8kg as they are sealed lead acid.

 

[krm]

I believe all CPAP batteries are Li-ion and most under 100W but most airlines allow you to carry spares. For example, If under 100W QF allows up to 20 spares in carry on luggage.

Basically the bottom line is to always check with airline.
Regardless of what IATA says or does not say, each airline has the final decision.

The only suggestion i can make is to get a 12V AGM battery (yes but then you need a converter which CPAP providers usually can supply as an accessory

Resmed has a battery guide which discusses use of AGM batteries.
The equivalent AGM battery would be something like a 20-25Ah AGM sealed deep cycle battery but instead of weighing 0.5Kg, these batteries likely would weigh 7-8kg as they are sealed lead acid.

Hi I appreciate that I checked out the Resmed battery guide its more suitable for camping trips I think, your right about the weight it puts the unit all up into the 10 kg mark which is not very practical flying . A 12 v deep cycle battery, converter and machine then start to fall foul of the other rule they must fit under the seat in front. Basically its virtually impossible to follow Scoots interpretation of IATA regulation. I should add they did state "we strictly follow IATA dangerous regulations" even though they dont.

 

[offshore171]

Out of curiosity, what was the workaround for long haul travel before CPAP machines?

 

[DC3]

Out of curiosity, what was the workaround for long haul travel before CPAP machines?

By ship?

 

[Quickstatus]

what was the workaround for long haul travel before CPAP machines

Nothing.
Colin sullivan invented portable nasal CPAP, though CPAP as a technique was used in ICUs for many years prior to that but that was for intubated patients.
Resmed started mass production maybe late 1980s into early 1990

 

[offshore171]

Nothing.

How long can people who need these devices be without them? Is it a matter of hours or days etc?

 

[Bolthead]

How long can people who need these devices be without them? Is it a matter of hours or days etc?

I have a Cpap machine and if I miss it for a few days it's not a big deal for me. However I guess it depends on the severity of your condition. I have never used my machine on a plane. I am not eevn sure it has a battery.

 

[krm]

How long can people who need these devices be without them? Is it a matter of hours or days etc?

It's not that you can't live without them. it does pose a slight health risk but snoring very loud would certainly upset those around you. Basically, if you don't use it, you feel like you only had half the sleep you had because you stop breathing momentarily, it can be up to 30 times per hour and wake up gasping for air (not to mention a few elbows from the occupant of the surrounding seats ) . Portable oxygen concentrator are more critical I expect and Scoots rules affect those as well. A typical travel CPAP is little bigger than a packet of cigarettes and can easily run many hours on a small lithium powerpack like you use to charge a phone if mains power is not available.

 

[offshore171]

It's not that you can't live without them. it does pose a slight health risk but snoring very loud would certainly upset those around you. Basically, if you don't use it, you feel like you only had half the sleep you had because you stop breathing momentarily, it can be up to 30 times per hour and wake up gasping for air (not to mention a few

Ok thanks, understood. I'll know of these machines, but never really knew what they were for, and how life and death critical they are.

Even as a non CPAP user, if my priority is sleep in flight, Scoot wouldn't be high on my list of airlines!

 

[krm]

Scoot plus is ok premium economy in effect ...my flight Perth to Shenyang China is the only realistic option