Qf9 mel dxb lhr

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Astute

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Hi there, just wondering if anyone knows why QF9 is ALWAYS late departing Melbourne. It's meant to depart at 23:35 but is always a minimum 30 mins up to 3 hours late. This means that people who use that flight to connect to other European destinations are constantly missing their connecting flights. Eg. Travelling to Paris, Qantas sells QF9 with connecting QF8073 from Dubai to Paris. There's only 1hr 15 mins between scheduled landing and takeoff, so for the last 2 weeks that I've been following, passengers have only made their connection 3 times. If Qantas can't get their customers onto those connections consistently, they should not be selling those 2 flights together as a complete journey. So what ends up happening is that customers are having to wait for the next flight to Paris, which is 7 hours later. And that's IF there are seats on that flight!! I've always travelled Emirates but this time chose Qantas, BIG MISTAKE, and when I brought this to their attention and asked for them to put me on an earlier flight they wanted an extra $130 for me to make the change so I could guarantee getting onto that connecting flight. Their standard line response is that they always aim to meet their schedules. When you look at that flights on time rating on flight stats, it doesn't even rate one star!! It's really poor service and its no wonder Qantas is almost non existent as an international carrier.
 

Aussie_flyer

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The reason why at the moment is the tight schedule, QF10 to Melbourne turns around as QF9 to London, and the flight from London is getting in late more often than not. I'm not sure why it is getting in late so consistently, but it is disappointing.
 
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Himeno

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The reason why at the moment is the tight schedule, QF10 to Melbourne turns around as QF9 to London, and the flight from London is getting in late more often than not. I'm not sure why it is getting in late so consistently, but it is disappointing.
Are there delays to QF1/2 as often as on 9/10? The aircraft change in LHR (QF1 returns to AU as QF10, QF9 returns as QF2) and they have 5-6 hours between flights at LHR to recover most delays.
Both LHR and DXB are quite congested. Could it be that QF10 is being hit by worse ATC delays at DXB then the SYD flights?
It looks like on average, they are taking 10-30 min delays out of LHR which is then becoming 90-120 min delays at DXB - which then delays the return to MEL and causes a late departure back to DXB/LHR for QF9.
 

Aussie_flyer

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I haven't looked into it, but I suspect DXB is the issue, its a bad time of year for fog delays I believe. The whole airport was shut down for a while due to an unauthorised drone a couple of days ago too.
 

Colin 2905

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Mrs 2905 and I are booked on QF9 in about a month, so I've been watching the stats too. Fortunately for us we don't have to connect with anything; just collect a car, and drive to a hotel about an hour out of London.

We're returning on QF2. The stats on that suggest that we may not make the connecting 717 to Canberra, but worst case, we end up on a turboprop for about an hour.
 

Astute

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Yes I think that's what is happening, the issue is that its been going on for ages, and Qantas seems to have no problem booking people on flights that won't connect. When u bring it to their attention they won't acknowledge, you can bet when Im sitting at DXB for 7 hrs and I give them a serve on their Facebook page I'll get the scripted reply, we are sorry for your inconvenience. When you book connecting flights with an airline, you assume that you are more than likely going to make those connections. With this combo, you know you will more than likely NOT make your connections. That's a real contempt for the paying traveller. I'll never book with them again
 

Himeno

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Yes I think that's what is happening, the issue is that its been going on for ages, and Qantas seems to have no problem booking people on flights that won't connect. When u bring it to their attention they won't acknowledge, you can bet when Im sitting at DXB for 7 hrs and I give them a serve on their Facebook page I'll get the scripted reply, we are sorry for your inconvenience. When you book connecting flights with an airline, you assume that you are more than likely going to make those connections. With this combo, you know you will more than likely NOT make your connections. That's a real contempt for the paying traveller. I'll never book with them again
:confused: So you are blaming the airline for what is most likely a result of Air Traffic Control delays, something they have no control over?
 

Astute

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Well if it were traffic control delays why wouldn't the Emirates flights be delayed as well?? Those services all run on time, give or take a few minutes.
 

Awesom Andy

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Looking at the reliability stats on expertflyer, QF9 is at 67%, and EK407 is at 66%. So it's just the way life is on this route, and most likely not airline specific. Personally speaking, I wouldn't rely on making such a short connection (eg. 75mins) if I have a choice. Even if it departs on time, on such a long flight, a little bit of an unfavorable wind plus a little bit of a hold at the destination airport are already enough to miss the connection.
 

por930

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When we book flights both to and from Australia, where a connection on wards is involved the same day, we always allow for 4-5 hours between legs. Never rely on Travel agents or airlines when they say, "yes. you should have plenty of time"......We always look at the stats of previous flights and only ever book a connection less that 4-5 hours if internal, (usually allow 3 hours)and then if winter say in the USA or Europe, we are back to the 4-5 hours again. I'd rather the inconvenience of waiting in a lounge some where for my booked flight than queuing at the wait list counter for a seat of another aircraft often much later, when your hotel bookings may now have vanished?
 

RooFlyer

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:confused: So you are blaming the airline for what is most likely a result of Air Traffic Control delays, something they have no control over?

If its a persistent issue, (which I think has been satisfactorily identified) but the airline chooses to ignore it, then yes, I think one is entitled to blame the airline.

They do have control over their response to persistent ATC issues.
 

dajop

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When we book flights both to and from Australia, where a connection on wards is involved the same day, we always allow for 4-5 hours between legs. Never rely on Travel agents or airlines when they say, "yes. you should have plenty of time"......We always look at the stats of previous flights and only ever book a connection less that 4-5 hours if internal, (usually allow 3 hours)and then if winter say in the USA or Europe, we are back to the 4-5 hours again. I'd rather the inconvenience of waiting in a lounge some where for my booked flight than queuing at the wait list counter for a seat of another aircraft often much later, when your hotel bookings may now have vanished?

I think we're now talking about philosophies about how to live lives. Some people are inherently conservative, and others don't mind living life on the edge. Important to know which sort of person you are when making bookings for connecting flights.

To illustrate, 4-5 hrs to me seems way over the top. I know I have absolutely no qualms about booking 1-2 hr same ticket international connections at HKG, SIN, KUL or BKK, or any dom-dom connection in Australia or US, but I may have to consider other airports on their merit (or lack of merit as the case maybe). Different matter for bookings not on the same ticket.
 

RooFlyer

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I think we're now talking about philosophies about how to live lives. Some people are inherently conservative, and others don't mind living life on the edge. Important to know which sort of person you are when making bookings for connecting flights.

To illustrate, 4-5 hrs to me seems way over the top. I know I have absolutely no qualms about booking 1-2 hr same ticket international connections at HKG, SIN, KUL or BKK, or any dom-dom connection in Australia or US, but I may have to consider other airports on their merit (or lack of merit as the case maybe). Different matter for bookings not on the same ticket.

Agree. Also discriminate between business and leisure trips; or if there is a critical event at the end (ie beginning a cruise).

Airlines have published (or at least discoverable) 'minimum connection times' at connections / airports and have to take some responsibility for those. As I was indicating above, if there is a connection which is consistently being missed - for whatever reason - they need to change the MCT, even if its on a seasonal basis. Of course that will probably screw a bunch of schedules.

I almost never rely on MCT but if its the only sensible connection available on the day, I'll usually take it, unless there is a critical event at the end. I have arranged for ~6 hour connections at LAX or YVR vs possible 2 hrs or even 4 hrs plenty of times, when coming in from Canada in winter.
 
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I had a 12 hour window on connections BNE - SIN. Due to a broken plane ended up with 3 hour turnaround.
 

burmans

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If its a persistent issue, (which I think has been satisfactorily identified) but the airline chooses to ignore it, then yes, I think one is entitled to blame the airline.

They do have control over their response to persistent ATC issues.

Agree, that argument is like coming in to work every day and saying my bus was late. If it's consistently late you should take an earlier bus.
 

dajop

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I almost never rely on MCT but if its the only sensible connection available on the day, I'll usually take it, unless there is a critical event at the end. I have arranged for ~6 hour connections at LAX or YVR vs possible 2 hrs or even 4 hrs plenty of times, when coming in from Canada in winter.

Agree, but in the OP's case, I'd rather try for the 1:15 connection knowing that it could end up being 6-7 hr, rather than initially settling on a 6-8 hr connection. Although having said that, in this particular case unless wanting specifically to fly on QF metal, I'd prefer to take the EK flight leaving MEL 1 hr earlier.
 

Himeno

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If its a persistent issue, (which I think has been satisfactorily identified) but the airline chooses to ignore it, then yes, I think one is entitled to blame the airline.

They do have control over their response to persistent ATC issues.
So you want the airlines to change their schedules because of something they have no control over (weather, ATC) causing delays that are temporary, variable and unpredictable?
 

burmans

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So you want the airlines to change their schedules because of something they have no control over (weather, ATC) causing delays that are temporary, variable and unpredictable?

I have no way of checking the facts on this but your statement relies on this being unpredictable and variable. If it is true as suggested by the OP that this plane is consistently late over a reasonable period of time it fails those assumptions. The fact it's beyond their control is kind of irrelevant if this is happening on a consistent basis over an extended period.
 

RooFlyer

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So you want the airlines to change their schedules because of something they have no control over (weather, ATC) causing delays that are temporary, variable and unpredictable?

In another post above and a couple of hours before yours I did acknowledge (new bolding):


<snip>

Airlines have published (or at least discoverable) 'minimum connection times' at connections / airports and have to take some responsibility for those. As I was indicating above, if there is a connection which is consistently being missed - for whatever reason - they need to change the MCT, even if its on a seasonal basis. Of course that will probably screw a bunch of schedules.

<snip>.


The OP and my comments were about persistent delays to the same service. That's a rather significant part of the argument ;). If ATC, or catering, or anything persistently delays an inbound flight and persistently causes connections to be missed, what should they do? Just shrug shoulders and say 'Screw it?' Week in, week out, large numbers of connections missed, same flight. "Jeez, not out fault. Stiff cheese."

Open up MCT, tweak schedules, if possible. YES.

But that's just me.
 
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