QF21 Diverted to Tahiti due to Unruly Passenger

[Happy Dude]

I'm sure they wouldn't respond, but would it be possible to contact QF to enquire about this git's fate, or their role in it at least, and if they intend to pursue said git for damages/costs for the diversion?

 

[Quickstatus]

The comedian whose video we have all seen, subsequently said @2bobwatch was asleep until the person in front reclined their seat which then started the "entertainment."

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The comedian whose video we have all seen, subsequently said @2bobwatch was asleep until the person in front reclined their seat which then started the "entertainment."

Yup… reported by princess fiona in post 53 above.

So not served alcohol, woke up in a disorientated state. Sounds like it could be something like ambien potentially?

 

[Quickstatus]

Sounds like it could be something like ambien potentially

Dunno, possibly a few reasons.

 

[Rich]

The comedian whose video we have all seen, subsequently said @2bobwatch was asleep until the person in front reclined their seat which then started the "entertainment."

Well who hasn't bitten someone after the seat in front was reclined, on at least one occasion?

 

[Quickstatus]

Well who hasn't bitten someone after the seat in front was reclined, on at least one occasion?

Interestingly the comedian who posted the video said that the airplanes are so cramped passengers close to one another, that you could do dental work on the person in front who reclined their seat.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Interestingly the comedian who posted the video said that the airplanes are so cramped passengers close to one another, that you could do dental work on the person in front who reclined their seat.

lol… my hairdresser goes to Bali pretty frequently. I always joke… when the person in front reclines do you feel the urge to do a wash, cut and dry!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Well who hasn't bitten someone after the seat in front was reclined, on at least one occasion?

You may be surprised

Read threads like this https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travelbuzz/1880365-onboard-snoring-etiquette-3.html and plenty say that if they were snoring, and another passenger woke them up to stop that snoring, they would lash out or punch the passenger that woke them. Some say it would be ‘involuntary’.

‘Alpha passenger’ hyperbole? Almost certainly. But it does give insight to the mindset of some folk.

 

[Quickstatus]

Post surgery recovery nurses would say that sometimes when people are woken from the anaesthetic, they can be aggressive and occasionally start swinging and punching. It appears it is mostly the blokes.

 

[Aeryn]

So many here quick to excuse this blokes appalling behviour and look for things other than him to blame.

A plane is a form of public transport that means you will be travelling with others in close proximity especially in whY. One shouldnt expect to have unbroken (or realistically any) sleep in whY, so when you are inevitably woken you need to shake it off.

If you cant cope with someone reclining then book an exit row or bulk head or higher class. Whilst i think we'd see less air rage if airlines removed recline in whY, its a known annoyance.

Walking around the cabin arguing / harassing crew or other passengers is not ok. Biting someone is not ok.

We know this wasnt a couple of seconds of disorientation after waking, the articles all say his behaviour was over an extended period long before he was recorded.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So many here quick to excuse this blokes appalling behviour and look for things other than him to blame.

A plane is a form of public transport that means you will be travelling with others in close proximity especially in whY. One shouldnt expect to have unbroken (or realistically any) sleep in whY, so when you are inevitably woken you need to shake it off.

If you cant cope with someone reclining then book an exit row or bulk head or higher class. Whilst i think we'd see less air rage if airlines removed recline in whY, its a known annoyance.

Walking around the cabin arguing / harassing crew or other passengers is not ok. Biting someone is not ok.

We know this wasnt a couple of seconds of disorientation after waking, the articles all say his behaviour was over an extended period long before he was recorded.

What you say is reasonable and correct, assuming the person is in control of the situation. And that’s the big assumption you are making in regards to this behaviour… that it was deliberate and controllable.

We’ve seen plenty of circumstances involving things like Ambien where this isn’t the case… the Grant Hackett incident for example. Or it may have been some other prescribed medication where the combination of altitude and other factors led to an unforeseen outcome.

Yes the person may have taken a sleep aid. Yes that was a voluntary choice. But the outcome may not have been.

We don’t know the facts. It’s entirely possible the guy is highly embarrassed by this and very contrite. And this behaviour was completely outside their norm.

 

[RooFlyer]

And that’s the big assumption you are making in regards to this behaviour… that it was deliberate and controllable

Exactly - reading some of the detail, including from some of the staff involved, it seems very likely that the guy was affected by some medication, possibly accentuated by the altitude difference.

I’m willing to cut the guy some slack for the cause but not of course for what actually happened.

Biting someone is not ok.

Yup.

 

[Aeryn]

Yes the person may have taken a sleep aid. Yes that was a voluntary choice. But the outcome may not have been

Disagree if you take any drug (otc, legally prescribed or illegal) you have made a concious choice to do so, so are fully responsible for any outcome.

Only an absolute idiot would take medication for the first time on a plane, but even if drugs impared him, the choices he made were his own and he needs to be held accountable.

If you get drunk and drive and then kill a person, we dont say oh your reflexes were impacted by alcohol so you are not responsible. No we prosecute you, because you made the decision to drink and the subsequent stupid decision to drive when effects are well known.

Medication doesnt make you swear, that guy was using seriously offensive language, he chose to use those words. Even if he felt disoriented and annoyed at being woken, his behaviour is not ok and he would know that. And if he doesnt well he isnt fit to particpate in free society.

Medications come with warnings re side effects, failing to read these isnt an excuse for inflicting the effects on others.

Very glad Qantas have banned this fool.

 

[kpc]

This thread makes me want to stop reading AFF....full of baseless speculation without any facts bar some video snippets!

 

[Aeryn]

full of baseless speculation without any facts bar some video snippets!

The fact the passenger behaved poorly has been verified by the airline in the decision to divert and request police remove the violent pax from the plane, and backed up by both video and witness statements.

Some are speculating why the pax acted as he did, but its irrelevent - drug use or just a jerk - doesnt change the facts that his behaviour was unacceptable, endangering other pax such that the pilot felt compelled to divert and the crew member who was bitten needed medical attention before the flight could resume.

Qantas did not act without cause, verbally abusing crew and pax, trying to open a door at altitude and biting crew all apalling and worthy of off loading, prosecution for assault and to recover costs and a lifetime ban.

 

[JessicaTam]

[mod hat]
This thread is going round in circles. If you have made your point, do not rehash it.

If there is something new to add then that is welcome.
[/mod hat]

 

[Quickstatus]

are speculating why the pax acted as he did, but its irrelevent - drug use or just a jerk - doesnt change the facts that his behaviour was unacceptable, endangering other pax such that the pilot felt compelled to divert and the crew member who was bitten needed medical attention before the flight could resume.

No one is excusing any bad behaviour. What most are seeking to understand and therefore discussing are the underlying factors leading to this behaviour. Is it a single factor or multifactorial?. Whatever the contributing factors, what are some things the airline could prospectively do to mitigate future occurrences. Detaining and banning some like this is post facto. It is better to mitigate these situations before they happen.

For example, it is well known that alcohol worsens hypoxia in the air compared to on the ground. How would an airline manage that from a policy perspective?. Someone who drinks appropriately on the ground could find themselves behaviourally "over the limit" in the air.

Do we have any objective facts that explains @2bobwatch's behaviour. Was it alcohol, was it prescription or recreational illegal drugs, was it a medical or psychological condition, was it a combination or maybe none of the above?. I don't know.

From CASA:

 

[Quickstatus]

Hypoxia is a lack of oxygen to the vital organs. Below 90% oxygen saturation is considered hypoxia

The usual oxygen saturation level of a human without lung disease at sea level about 95-97%.

Blood Oxygen saturation level at 1800m,( cabin altitude of 787 when the aircraft is in cruise altitude ) is about 2-3% lower than at sea level.

Then add in the O2 saturation when asleep is also lower. Maybe another 1-2% Add in sleep apnoea which is common in middle aged men

Then add in alcohol

It is easy then to see that it does not take much to be hypoxic on an airplane.

 

[offshore171]

He's not getting hypoxia on a modern pressurised passenger aircraft, unless there's a leak/depressurisation issue, in which case the whole plane is affected.

Maybe he just had a "succulent Chinese meal"

 

[Quickstatus]

succulent Chinese meal

There is nothing succulent about Qantas Y catering and certainly not on the transpacific route.

Here is an 2016 white paper from the Australian Institute of Criminology on AirRage - much of it known to most travellers:



Also here:




Here is one reason why I suspect @2bobwatch was not put through the legal wringer in Tahiti - see scenario 2.