QF Mystery: We can see but the agent can't

[MelbFlyer]

So, after a few weeks without contacting Qantas for a change, I can now see another alternative flight with classic rewards seats that would work for us (same route, just a day apart) - I (begrudgingly) called up this morning to try to change to that flight and again got the same answer -

"We can't see the flight you can see online / there are no classic reward seats on the flight number and date that you've mentioned".

All this, whilst I can see and select the reward seats online!

All I can do is sigh - Why does Qantas advertise reward seats online that are available to be selected online, but can't be added to existing rewards bookings (as has to be done via the phone)?

It defies belief.

 

[Paddy Melon]

Another experience to add to this thread:

I have a business OWA/RTW booking and am trying to add a leg MEL-SYD at the beginning of the trip for which I can see availability at various times on my selected date (which you would expect given it is some months away and there are many flights on that route). So I know for a fact those seats are available. After calling approx 10 times I have been told, variously (and sometimes in combination):

1. the flights are fully booked (ie no seats at all)
2. there are no rewards seats on that flight (ie the agent says they can't see them at all) or any seats in any class all day, which is obviously laughable on the SYD-MEL route
3. there are a couple of flights earlier in the day with award availability, but which ones are available seem to be inconsistent between agents...
4. admitting that another part of their system shows those particular seats do exist but can't be added to an existing booking, only new bookings
5. under the OWA fare rules it is not permitted to change the origin of a OWA booking (ie the first flight). Only one agent has said this - this is my first time doing this so I don't know if this is true (and it could explain everything!) would be grateful if someone could please confirm?

So there have been various, at time inconsistent, reasons. I've also had agents:

• blatantly hanging up mid call
• putting me on hold for ages whilst intermittently taking unholding without speaking, then putting me on hold again (I assume to check if I am still on the line, hoping that I'd hung up)
• escalating to a supervisor
• saying that the matter is not an escalation issue and refusing to ask a supervisor
• transferring me to the "reservations team" (despite me selecting the same call options each time)

Character building stuff.

 

[jpp42]

I have a business OWA/RTW booking and am trying to add a leg MEL-SYD at the beginning of the trip for which I can see availability at various times on my selected date (which you would expect given it is some months away and there are many flights on that route). So I know for a fact those seats are available.

Welcome to AFF. Sorry to hear of your frustrations, they unfortunately are not unique.

We have seen a lot of cases recently where award seats seem to be available for purely domestic itineraries, but not when connected to an international leg. I guess this is a minor form of revenue protection as they would get more points redeemed as a separate itinerary , whereas adding it to an international could result in zero further points being redeemed. At least within Qantas, it seems that not all classic reward availability is created equal, but I don't know if there is any way to determine this from ExpertFlyer or similar.

The other point seems to be that only the Hobart call centre (and maybe Auckland and Manila?) has direct access to all availability, for some reason the more commonly reached Mindpearl agents (Fiji/South Africa) use a different system which inhibits availability of many classic rewards. That's why you get all these agents insisting there is nothing available - they aren't allowed to look at the external web site and must only use their internal, limited tool. Why this problem exists and why it isn't being fixed is a matter for Qantas , I guess, but I suppose with the very low revenues they get from classic reward redemption, they don't seem to be in any hurry to solve this sort of thing.

Unfortunately, unless you are Platinum it can be very different to reach Hobart. Apparently it's best to try early in the morning. Good luck!

 

[Paddy Melon]

Thanks JPP

If there's a legitimate reason for this, or at least a clear policy, then that's fair enough and I have no qualms.

But the inconsistent and conflicting reasons given by the call centre is rather frustrating. I guess it comes down to a lack of training and having to deal with relatively complex fare rules, a lack of coherent policy, a bad IT system and a bunch of probably demanding customers who are (entirely legitimately) trying to extract maximum value.

I will likely admit defeat, save myself further hassle, and book as a separate redemption.

 

[jpp42]

But the inconsistent and conflicting reasons given by the call centre is rather frustrating. I guess it comes down to a lack of training and having to deal with relatively complex fare rules, a lack of coherent policy, a bad IT system and a bunch of probably demanding customers who are (entirely legitimately) trying to extract maximum value.

Yes, one of the most maddening things is when you find that agents aren't trained on the actual limitations of their system, or allowed to admit their own limitations, and try to cover it up by any of the various tactics you mentioned. It would be a much more customer-friendly system if the Mindpearl agents were taught about things their system can't do, and were authorised to transfer such cases to an escalations line (like Hobart etc) with the correct access levels. The policy of requiring all agents to do everything, even incredibly complex tasks which they might encounter only occasionally, is not helping anyone. For every hour that the low-level agent spends trying to do something they can't ultimately handle, they could have transferred your call to a higher-skilled agent and perhaps handled 5 more simple queries which they'd do a good job at. Qantas' reaction seems just to hire more low-level agents with minimal training to keep call wait times down, rather than implementing a reasonable escalation system, which would actually save *everyone* time and money.

 

[Mr H]

I've asked two agents in Hobart/Auckland how they were able to see the availability when the other call centres couldn't so I could relay this info next time it happened and they both gave me the same answer: they told me that they also see no availability so what they need to do is ignore the current booking, then check for availability, then add the desired sectors to the booking.

I seldom run into the agents being unable to see availability that I can see.

@dylarr's post makes me realise I have been basically instructing agents to do exactly what he/she suggests. I ask for the agents to add specific flights to an existing booking and do not discuss routing/destinations even when asked to do so. I adopted this approach when I found that agents had difficulty when I mentioned routes/cities, but then found the availability when I asked them to search on flight numbers/dates.

 

[ChrisMars]

I seldom run into the agents being unable to see availability that I can see.

@dylarr's post makes me realise I have been basically instructing agents to do exactly what he/she suggests. I ask for the agents to add specific flights to an existing booking and do not discuss routing/destinations even when asked to do so. I adopted this approach when I found that agents had difficulty when I mentioned routes/cities, but then found the availability when I asked them to search on flight numbers/dates.

Just want to make sure I got this right:
You not WP or above
You call to add segments to a reward, you not talking to hobard or auckland call center.
You just ask to add a flight number (with a date), dont discuss cities / airport
And this strategy works to overcome this limitations where agents don't see the reward?

 

[Mr H]

Just want to make sure I got this right:
You not WP or above
You call to add segments to a reward, you not talking to hobard or auckland call center.
You just ask to add a flight number (with a date), dont discuss cities / airport

Correct. I am NB and mostly get through to Suva - occasionally I get Cape Town and I have had Manila once or twice. If I am asked for origin and destination, I just say that I have found specific flights and I give them the flight number and date - then when they have found the flight(s) I confirm the airports using the three letter IATA codes and the scheduled times of departure and arrival.

And this strategy works to overcome this limitations where agents don't see the reward?

I do not seem to run into this problem. But who knows whether I have inadvertently stumbled on the magic solution or I have just been lucky. I usually find it straightforward to make changes to the booked itinerary.

It all unravels, of course, when it comes to calculating the fare difference and getting it re-ticketed.

 

[BruceBris]

Has anyone encountered this on a date change instead of trying to add a leg? (I guess it's functionally similar). I already have a flight booked but want to change the leg. I'm being told this is only available for new bookings.

I'm trying to change the date of a leg from Singapore to Paris. I'm gold status and I can see two days with seats that suit but the agent today came up with all the excuses described here for not being able to see them. Put me on hold for a while to talk to someone else (I suspect it was to make me think he was doing something). End story - gave up. I have the points to book the seats myself and then cancel the existing flights but my previous experience with Qantas Service makes me nervous that I would lose more than the penalty points (12,000 for two seats). Has anyone else successfully tried this? All advice gratefully accepted.

 

[TheInsider]

I'm trying to change the date of a leg from Singapore to Paris. I'm gold status and I can see two days with seats that suit but the agent today came up with all the excuses described here for not being able to see them. Put me on hold for a while to talk to someone else (I suspect it was to make me think he was doing something). End story - gave up. I have the points to book the seats myself and then cancel the existing flights but my previous experience with Qantas Service makes me nervous that I would lose more than the penalty points (12,000 for two seats). Has anyone else successfully tried this? All advice gratefully accepted.

Why not change the existing one online?

 

[serfty]

Why not change the existing one online?

Generally you can't.

I have three QF award bookings involving OAs and the Change option is unavailable on any of them.

None have had any changes since the initial ticketing.

 

[BruceBris]

Why not change the existing one online?

Unfortunately, says contact service centre.

 

[BruceBris]

Unfortunately, says contact service centre.

 

[TheInsider]

Unfortunately, says contact service centre.

Wasn't sure.

 

[1022]

My plus one (NB and new to all this) just rang twice to try to change a leg of a classic award. Got Suva twice. First call hung up on after a 20 minute hold. Second time told that the CI leg visible online is unavailable to book. Has anyone tried emailing the classic rewards escalation team in this situation and had any luck with it?

 

[levelnine]

Has anyone tried emailing the classic rewards escalation team in this situation and had any luck with it?

They won't help. They don't assist with bookings. They only deal with ticketing issues like a failure to reticket after a schedule change.

 

[ChrisMars]

My plus one (NB and new to all this) just rang twice to try to change a leg of a classic award. Got Suva twice. First call hung up on after a 20 minute hold. Second time told that the CI leg visible online is unavailable to book. Has anyone tried emailing the classic rewards escalation team in this situation and had any luck with it?

It has been reported a few times that the best strategy with offshore call centers is to only give the flight number and date that needs to be added to the existing award, without mentioning cities / time. This somewhat force the agent to a different booking path that might yield better result, and let them confirm the city time. I would suggest to try that a few times, huaca a few times. Maybe this works? Let us know.

 

[MelbFlyer]

only give the flight number and date that needs to be added to the existing award, without mentioning cities / time. This somewhat force the agent to a different booking path that might yield better result, and let them confirm the city time. I would suggest to try that a few times, huaca a few times.

Been there, done that many, many times without success.

We can see the flight, but many agents can't. It's a lost cause.

 

[1022]

They won't help. They don't assist with bookings. They only deal with ticketing issues like a failure to reticket after a schedule change.

Lo and behold the escalation email team responded positively to a request to look into changing a leg of a classic reward that the Suva call centre claimed they couldn’t see over the course of a couple of calls. Whether it was a one off favour or within scope for that team I don’t know. My plus-one is a NB and got a phone call from Hobart a few days after sending off an email asking to add a CI leg to an existing booking. E-ticket delivered within the hour.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So has this finally resolved the inability to add an Australian domestic sector to an international award?

I’ve previously asked to add a SYD-MEL onto an xx_-SYD and get all the excuses outlined above. I’ve even asked them to search for the SYD-MEL alone - which they then can see, of course - but they still can’t add it to my original booking.

Perhaps they don’t even try? they just say ‘new bookings only’?

Mr H’s suggestion also didn’t used to work in the very specific circumstance of adding a domestic connector.

Has that changed since late last year?