QF 991 Brisbane to Karratha - single class

[samh004]

Well, from someone who spends 35K+ per year on travel, Int J, Int Y, and Dom Y, I think my spend dollar on average is more important than the occasional full Y ticket or someone who spends considerably less per year than me!

And, on that note, on my way to a meeting / jobsite, I usually travel scumbag cheapest flights wherever possible or Y class on J* - as anyone who reads my posts will know. Does that then make me a bottom feeder who does not deserve to be OPUP'd whenever possible or feel he "should" have the good seats in rows 1,2 or 3?

I'm not disagreeing with you or saying you shouldn't be OP UP'd, but (don't take this the wrong way) as others have said, don't expect as a WP that you should always get OP UP'd. Sometimes circumstances will warrant that you get that privilege, sometimes it wont, it's a cough when it doesn't happen, but that is life.

As someone else said, one day you'll get a great flight with Qantas, the next you'll get a shockingly bad one. It's the way it goes. Don't feel they were taking it out on you personally.

I have a weird feeling that future Brisbane drinks nights will be organised from Flyertalk. But only from Community Buzz so I don't get insulted as a bottom feeder in the QF or BA forums there as well....

I'm not a member of FT, so if this does happen, please send me a PM. Tah!

 

[Evan]

In my opinion they should make status the higher determining factor over fare paid, after all if QF thought or you thought that the way QF measures status was bad then maybe they should adopt the SQ PPS club way.... (Of course QF would not longer be my prefered but thats beside the point)

I believe firmly that although a single fare is important QF make there money of people like us that pledge repeat business to them because we are looked after regardless of our fare price.

And like i am sure almost the majority here including Mr & JohnK, I also have to fly the el-cheapo whY fares, no full flexi etc for us. Thats a reality for most emplyees i believe.

 

[Dave Noble]

In my opinion they should make status the higher determining factor over fare paid, after all if QF thought or you thought that the way QF measures status was bad then maybe they should adopt the SQ PPS club way.... (Of course QF would not longer be my prefered but thats beside the point)

I believe firmly that although a single fare is important QF make there money of people like us that pledge repeat business to them because we are looked after regardless of our fare price.

And like i am sure almost the majority here including Mr & JohnK, I also have to fly the el-cheapo whY fares, no full flexi etc for us. Thats a reality for most emplyees i believe.

A single fare can be important and if it is someone on a Y/B type fare , non dicsounted, then they are, imo ones to treat well since the fares can be very high. some airlines are quite open about these one-off passengers being important..

e.g. AA gives them some of the benefits that they allow they staus passengers such as access to exit row seating and domestically being able to upgrade

BA includes Y passengers in the group that are allowed to pre-select seats ( with W and C/J for WT+/business )

Overall, these are typically a small number of passengers per flight

Some carriers adjust online checkin seat availability/pre-seating depending on fare paid

Im not saying that staus should be ignored, but I also would not ignore the few high full fare passengers . ( Note: I rarely travel on full fare Y basis myself so not using my travel as the basis for what Id want it to be)

As far as the question of whether it is normal that the flight is Y only, looking ahead at the availability, there doesn't seem to be any J being sold on that route and does seem to normally be a 73H. Speculating, maybe they only open the J seats up for use once number of passengers exceeds a certain level and so at time a seat was allocated, 4 was the furthest forward available

Dave

 

[ANstar]

My understanding is that their has never been a J cabin offered on this flight.

I remember when it was announced there was no J.

 

[Oneworldplus2]

wow, l didn't mean to stir you up munitalP.

But, IMO, if you paid for a whY ticket, you got one. As a WP, I guess that Qantas tries to give you more privilage as a WP, but it can't be guaranteed all the time. Circumstances change.

As samh004 said, one day you could get a great flight with Qantas, the next, could be complete opposite. Take the good with the bad.

OT and for the record, l'm a SFSC and l buy red-e deals only. If my employer pays then it's full flexi, but work has only paid for me 2 times in the past 2 years. Even the last 3 times l've been to Europe has been in whY on red-e deals. Plus l've got QP through my work at corp rates. Big deal. I don't see the point in spending any more than is necessary on Qantas. They overcharge so much compared to other airlines with taxes+surcharges and exploit Aussies with the whole patriotism/Aussie spirit con they have going on. But that's another story and already in another thread.

 

[oz_mark]

In my opinion they should make status the higher determining factor over fare paid, after all if QF thought or you thought that the way QF measures status was bad then maybe they should adopt the SQ PPS club way.... (Of course QF would not longer be my prefered but thats beside the point)

I believe firmly that although a single fare is important QF make there money of people like us that pledge repeat business to them because we are looked after regardless of our fare price.

And like i am sure almost the majority here including Mr & JohnK, I also have to fly the el-cheapo whY fares, no full flexi etc for us. Thats a reality for most emplyees i believe.

How Qantas determines your value as a customer is probably quite involved, but three measures:

1) Your past value to Qantas - effectively this is what Status is a measure of
2) Your current value to Qantas - effectively what fare you are on for your flight
3) Your future value to Qantas - presumably what CL signifies, and also what forward bookings you may have

It is a bit of a balancing act between these three as to who gets what privileges, and without knowing what the situation was with those in the J seats, it is hard to know how they juggled the three possibilies, or it was just random.

Given the particlaur flight, it is possible that they had some status as well. While it would be nice if statused folk had first dibs at seats, who knows what the actual situation was.

As an aside, I don't think there is any need to insult folk on red-e-deal fares by implying they are bottom feeders. It is a valid fare, that has its place in yeild management,just as much as the more expensive flexible tickets are.

 

[equus]

How many passengers on a flight actually pay for a fully flexible airfare, or should I say how many passengers on a flight are lucky enough that their company has forked out a small fortune just in case they want to go home an hour earlier?

In my experience, flexible returns are actually a risk mitigation factor, and in a lot of cases, work out more cost effective in the long run. To put it another way, for the company, it actually ends up costing more for the cheapest fares because of the lack of flexibility.

The reason for this is not so much wanting to change to an earlier flight, as getting caught up (work demands, traffic etc), and missing the booked flight. For someone booking (and paying) for themselves, booking an 8pm flight might be an acceptable way around this, but for companies, extra overtime, time-off in lieu or just general impact on employees in general preclude this option - so booking closer to "expected" travel time - say 6pm or in that vicinity is more necessary.
As an example, to look at the costs involved, I have looked at a one-way flight SYD-BNE on QF, looking at a Friday evening, about 2 weeks out (so looking now for Friday 1 May.

There are no red-E available at approximately the right time, but ignoring that, I will consider the fare for slightly earlier in red-E as the comparison - $156. The flexible alternative is $306 - so $150 saved by taking the cheaper fare.

The question is, what happens when sometime on the Friday, the employee realises (or doesn't) that they are not making the flight, and ends up being changed? The employer basically has no choice but to pay to get their employee home (or pay hotels, compensation etc - a whole lot of money). Now within 24 hours, the red-E fare is basically foreited - so a whole new fare is paid for. At that late stage, it is likely to be the full fare flexible (around $431). This means that the "cheap" fare (which was going to save $150), has now cost a total of $587 (the lost red-E, plus the new fully fare), or $281 more than the flexible option would have if that was booked in the first place.

On these figures, it works out about the same sort of cost to pay for 3 flexible returns, as to book 3 cheapest available, and have 1 of those missed. To that, you then have to add the non-monetary intangibles of the flexibility involved.

Sometimes, it is not so much the cost of the flexibility, as the potential cost of not having it (and that's why those fares get purchased).

 

[QF WP]

equus, my thoughts exactly on the reasoning behind fare basis purchasing - but then again, I have both hats on (as employer and employee).

ozmark, that's also my understanding of how they look at customer value (to my way of thinking, they should skew more to a combination of the first two, than number 3, as they need to look at current profit). Of course, we look at our own value to QF in a totally different light - as pointed out by a number of posters, it's either number of flights, or cost, or a combination of the two.

 

[harvyk]

equus, personally I disagree with your reasoning, at least with my situation.

I usually book red-e and bar one case where I simply forfeited the fare ($90 gone), I personally have saved thousands (possibly more) by choosing in-flexible fares for myself and my contractors.

The way to work the red-e's is by knowing what you can and can't do, and keep in mind that they are usually in-flexible. Also keeping in mind that red-e's are usually cheap enough so that in the example given unless your talking say CBR to SFO type flights where it's not possible to drop into the city for the day it often works out cheaper to fly in and out a couple of times. (plus it can work out nicely for SC + Points ) I should add that I consider BNE, SYD, MEL or ADL as day drop in cities, and I have no problems doing an O'nighter to PER and I'm from CBR.

I guess it all comes down to choice and personal preference. If you don't mind working within specific rules, red-e's are perfect, if you can't then full fare is appropriate.


In regards to the bottom feeder comments made by Dave Noble I personally don't see myself as a bottom feeder by any stretch of the imagination as I fly fairly frequently (both int and dom) and QF would absolutely be making money from me (even as a red-e flyer). It's just I'm not willing to pay for the flexibility which other flyers feel they need, and whilst I love flying business, I am not willing to pay for the chance to upgrade. (I'll pay for it myself or use points if I want business)

 

[JohnK]

I guess it all comes down to choice and personal preference. If you don't mind working within specific rules, red-e's are perfect, if you can't then full fare is appropriate.

And in my case I really have no choice as I pay for the weekly SYD-BNE return flights out of my own pocket so red-edeals are the only way to go and I cannot afford anything more expensive and it cannot be justified even taking into consideration flight cancellations and delays.

Yes I would sometimes like to have the flexibility but the cheapest Super saver is $186 compared to a normal red-edeal of $94 ($75 or $79 during sale periods).

 

[moongirl]

I'm not a member of FT, so if this does happen, please send me a PM. Tah!

same here !!