Minimum Connection Time madness

[Mattg]

I have an upcoming Oneworld Award booking that included a FRA-MAD-GRU segment with Iberia. When I booked there was a 2 hour and 5 minute connection in Madrid, which was not a problem.

A couple of days ago there was a schedule change - the same IB flight now departs Frankfurt 10 minutes later and arrives in Madrid at exactly the same time. There's no change to the MAD-GRU flight. I contacted Qantas to confirm the schedule change and was told that they could not re-issue the ticket because the connection time (which hasn't changed) no longer meets the Minimum Connection Time in MAD. Apparently the MCT is now 2 hours, 45 minutes.

I wasn't keen on taking the earlier FRA-MAD flight which would leave me with a 9+ hour layover in Madrid, so asked if I could fly with Iberia out of Hamburg instead. The agent was able to rebook me on HAM-MAD-GRU, which has a 1 hour, 10 minute connection in Madrid. Apparently this connection has a MCT of only 55 minutes.

Who writes these rules?!

TL;DR version: Iberia doesn't allow a connection in Madrid of 125 minutes, but does allow a connection time of 70 minutes. I'm thoroughly confused.

 

[equus]

Looks like IB has a huge range of MCT - all depending on the respective terminals. I would suggest that maybe with the time change, they have changed the arrival terminal - making a potentially huge change in allowed MCT.

 

[Mattg]

Looks like IB has a huge range of MCT - all depending on the respective terminals. I would suggest that maybe with the time change, they have changed the arrival terminal - making a potentially huge change in allowed MCT.

I wondered this too, but there was no change in terminals and the HAM and FRA flights both arrive at the same terminals.

 

[equus]

My one and only transit through MAD on IB is probably not indicative. Transiting for XRY-MAD-FRA-SIN-BNE with XRY-MAD-FRA on IB, and FRA-SIN-BNE on QF (this was a while ago - 2006 I think).

Departure from XRY was delayed for several hours due to tech issues. What had been comfortable connections became extremely tight (well, worse than tight).

What saved things was that we were travelling with a large tour party - 60+ pax all heading as far as SIN on the same flights.

Coming into MAD, announcements that those connecting to FRA would disembark first - everybody else to stay on board. They parked the plane at a remote gate, put all the transits on a bus that simply went straight to the connecting flight - which was being held. Thought there was zero chance of the luggage making it, but they were frantically unloading, and must have done the same. We basically went up the stairs on to the plane, they closed up, and went - luggage all made it.

Similar story at FRA except that QF was holding the 747, and there was no remote gate - airbridges both. Escorts for everybody through miles of deserted FRA corridors straight to the next plane (except for the diversion when we came to a locked door and no way through).

Connection time in MAD was probably 10mins, and FRA ended up being about 20.

Not really a real comparison, as the pax numbers were sufficient that it made sense for the flights to be held - given they knew exactly where everyone was, and what the timings would be like.

 

[madrooster]

Who writes these rules?!

TL;DR version: Iberia doesn't allow a connection in Madrid of 125 minutes, but does allow a connection time of 70 minutes. I'm thoroughly confused.

It's mostly 55 mins on average. I suspect you got someone who didn't know what they were doing.

 

[Mattg]

It's mostly 55 mins on average. I suspect you got someone who didn't know what they were doing.

That’s what I also assumed at the beginning, but 3 different people at Qantas told me the same thing. The last person that I spoke to was from the HBA call centre and seemed competent.

 

[serfty]

I had a look at this and ... Dang! It is complicated. With a surprising number SUPpressed!

Which one is the actual connection:

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Results from https://www.ExpertFlyer.com
Minimum Connect Times: Connecting at MAD, Incoming airline IB, Outgoing airline IB, Flight type International to International

STANDARD.D/D...D/I...I/D...I/I.
ONLINE .20 1.00 1.00 1.00
OFFLINE .20 1.00 1.00 1.00
** OR * ARE ALL
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 1 - 3999 LHR - ALL
EQP ALL - BUS TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 1 - 3999 LHR - ALL
EQP ALL - BUS TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 2063 - 2087 LHR - ALL
EQP ALL - BUS TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1 - 3999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
EQP BUS - ALL TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1 - 3999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
EQP BUS - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2063 - 2087 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
EQP BUS - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 400 - 600 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 400 - 600 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 400 - 600 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 400 - 600 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 3000 - 3999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 3000 - 3999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 3000 - 3999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 3000 - 3999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 6000 - 6999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 6000 - 6999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 6000 - 6999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 6000 - 6999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 8000 - 8999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II 1.05 FLT 8000 - 8999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 8000 - 8999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .55 FLT 8000 - 8999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 ALL - LHR
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .55 FLT 6000 - 6999 - FLT 5000 - 5999 ALL - FCO
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 4000 - 4999 - FLT 2390 - 2399 ALL - TLV
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 400 - 600 LHR - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 400 - 600 LHR - ALL
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 400 - 600 LHR - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 400 - 600 LHR - ALL
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 3000 - 3999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 3000 - 3999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 3000 - 3999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 3000 - 3999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 6000 - 6999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 6000 - 6999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 6000 - 6999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 6000 - 6999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 8000 - 8999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 8000 - 8999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.05 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 8000 - 8999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 8000 - 8999 LHR - ALL
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .55 FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 6000 - 6999 FCO - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 2390 - 2399 - FLT 4000 - 4999 TLV - ALL
TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .55 FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .45 FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 7300 - 7799 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7300 - 7799 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 6000 - 6999 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 7900 - 7999 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 8000 - 8999 TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 8000 - 8999 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 8000 - 8999 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - FLT 8000 - 8999 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 6000 - 6999 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7900 - 7999 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 8000 - 8999 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 8000 - 8999 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 8000 - 8999 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 8000 - 8999 - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.10 ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 PVG - CMN TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.10 ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 NRT - CMN TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 ALL - CMN TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 ALL - CMN TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .55 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 ALL - GYE TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 ALL - GYE TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 ALL - FLT 350 - 399 ALL - HEL TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 ALL - FLT 350 - 399 ALL - HEL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 ALL - LIM TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 ALL - LIM TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .55 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 ALL - SCL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 ALL - SCL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 2390 - 2399 ALL - TLV TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1970 - 1979 - ALL CMN - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 1970 - 1979 - ALL CMN - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL GYE - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL GYE - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .45 FLT 350 - 399 - ALL HEL - ALL TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 FLT 350 - 399 - ALL HEL - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL LIM - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL LIM - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II .55 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL SCL - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .45 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL SCL - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 2390 - 2399 - ALL TLV - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 2390 - 2399 - ALL TLV - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 350 - 399 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 350 - 399 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1780 - 1789 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1780 - 1789 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1790 - 1799 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1790 - 1799 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1790 - 1799 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1860 - 1869 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1860 - 1869 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1860 - 1869 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1970 - 1979 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1970 - 1979 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1970 - 1979 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1980 - 1989 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1980 - 1989 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 1980 - 1989 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2380 - 2381 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2380 - 2381 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2380 - 2381 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2385 - 2389 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2385 - 2389 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2385 - 2389 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2390 - 2399 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2390 - 2399 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 2390 - 2399 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 4000 - 4999 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 4000 - 4999 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 4000 - 4999 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7300 - 7799 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7300 - 7799 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7300 - 7799 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7900 - 7999 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7900 - 7999 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP FLT 7900 - 7999 - ALL EQP ALL - BUS
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 350 - 399 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 350 - 399 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1780 - 1789 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1780 - 1789 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1790 - 1799 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1790 - 1799 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1860 - 1869 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1860 - 1869 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1900 - 1989 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1980 - 1989 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 1980 - 1989 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 2380 - 2381 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 2380 - 2381 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 2385 - 2389 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 2385 - 2389 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 2390 - 2399 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 2390 - 2399 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 4000 - 4999 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 4000 - 4999 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 5000 - 5999 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 5000 - 5999 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 7300 - 7799 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 7300 - 7799 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 7900 - 7999 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 7900 - 7999 EQP BUS - ALL
TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 350 - 399 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 350 - 399 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 350 - 399 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1780 - 1789 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1780 - 1789 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 1780 - 1789 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1790 - 1799 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 1790 - 1799 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 1790 - 1799 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1860 - 1869 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1860 - 1869 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 1860 - 1869 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 1970 - 1979 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1980 - 1989 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 1980 - 1989 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 1980 - 1989 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 2380 - 2381 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 2380 - 2381 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 2380 - 2381 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 2385 - 2389 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 2385 - 2389 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 2385 - 2389 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 2390 - 2399 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 2390 - 2399 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 2390 - 2399 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 4000 - 4599 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 4000 - 4999 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 4000 - 4999 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7299 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 7300 - 7799 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 7300 - 7799 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 7300 - 7799 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 7481 - 7999 TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 7900 - 7999 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 7900 - 7999 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 ALL - FLT 7900 - 7999 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 350 - 399 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 350 - 399 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 350 - 399 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1780 - 1789 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1780 - 1789 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 1780 - 1789 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 1790 - 1799 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1790 - 1799 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 1790 - 1799 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1860 - 1869 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1860 - 1869 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 1860 - 1869 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1970 - 1979 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1970 - 1979 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 1970 - 1979 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1980 - 1989 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 1980 - 1989 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 1980 - 1989 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 2380 - 2381 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 2380 - 2381 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 2380 - 2381 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 2385 - 2389 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 2385 - 2389 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 2385 - 2389 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 2390 - 2399 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 2390 - 2399 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 4000 - 4599 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 4000 - 4999 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 4000 - 4999 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 7000 - 7299 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 7300 - 7799 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 7300 - 7799 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 7300 - 7799 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 7481 - 7999 - ALL TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 7900 - 7999 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II 1.30 FLT 7900 - 7999 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.15 FLT 7900 - 7999 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-IB II 1.10 ALL - HKG TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II 1.10 HKG - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP EQP ALL - BUS TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP EQP ALL - BUS TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II SUP EQP BUS - ALL TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II SUP EQP BUS - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 TRM 4 - 4
IB-IB II .55 TRM 4S - 4
IB-IB II .55 TRM 4 - 4S
IB-IB II .45 TRM 4S - 4S
**-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 4000 - 4999 TRM 4 - 4S
**-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 4000 - 4999 TRM 4S - 4S
**-IB II 1.30 ALL - FLT 7000 - 7230 TRM 4S - 4S
**-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4 - 4
**-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4
**-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4 - 4S
**-IB II SUP ALL - FLT 5000 - 5999 TRM 4S - 4S
IB-** II 1.30 FLT 4000 - 4999 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
IB-** II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - ALL TRM 4 - 4
IB-** II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - ALL TRM 4S - 4
IB-** II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - ALL TRM 4 - 4S
IB-** II SUP FLT 5000 - 5999 - ALL TRM 4S - 4S
**-** II .45 TRM 1 - 1
**-** II 1.00 TRM 2 - 1
**-** II 1.00 TRM 3 - 1
**-** II 2.30 TRM 4 - 1
**-** II 2.45 TRM 4S - 1
**-** II 1.00 TRM 1 - 2
**-** II .45 TRM 2 - 2
**-** II .45 TRM 3 - 2
**-** II 2.30 TRM 4 - 2
**-** II 2.45 TRM 4S - 2
**-** II 1.00 TRM 1 - 3
**-** II .45 TRM 2 - 3
**-** II .45 TRM 3 - 3
**-** II 2.30 TRM 4 - 3
**-** II 2.45 TRM 4S - 3
**-** II 2.30 TRM 1 - 4
**-** II 2.30 TRM 2 - 4
**-** II 2.30 TRM 3 - 4
**-** II 1.15 TRM 4 - 4
**-** II 1.30 TRM 4S - 4
**-** II 2.45 TRM 1 - 4S
**-** II 2.45 TRM 2 - 4S
**-** II 2.45 TRM 3 - 4S
**-** II 1.30 TRM 4 - 4S
**-** II 1.15 TRM 4S - 4S

 

[Himeno]

I'm convinced that whoever comes up with a given airports MCTs have never actually had to make said connections.

 

[docjames]

Having just been through Madrid, if the flight involved T4S then be prepared for a long connection.

If T4--> T4 then short and easy.

If needing to use T4S this effectively means "departing euro zone" flights (which in your case is GRU). There one exception is a small section at the end of T4 (gates 1-8 or thereabouts) that largely goes to UK destinations (but not always - sometimes they go from T4S).

In your case i would have thoguht about HUACA.

 

[Mattg]

I had a look at this and ... Dang! It is complicated. SUth a surprising number SUPpressed!

Which one is the actual connection

The connection they were telling me had a MCT of 2.45 was IB8617 FRA-MAD (operated by Air Nostrum), arriving at Terminal 4, connecting to IB6827 MAD-GRU, departing from Terminal 4S.

I was rebooked on IB3269 HAM-MAD, arriving at Terminal 4, connecting to IB6827 MAD-GRU, departing from Terminal 4S with a 1.10 connection time.

Having just been through Madrid, if the flight involved T4S then be prepared for a long connection.

If T4--> T4 then short and easy.

If needing to use T4S this effectively means "departing euro zone" flights (which in your case is GRU). There one exception is a small section at the end of T4 (gates 1-8 or thereabouts) that largely goes to UK destinations (but not always - sometimes they go from T4S).

In your case i would have thoguht about HUACA.

Hmm, this has me a little worried as I now only have 70 minutes in MAD.

FWIW, I did HUACA 3 times and everyone told me the same thing. So it was an actual problem with the MCT, not incompetent Qantas staff.

 

[madrooster]

The connection they were telling me had a MCT of 2.45 was IB8617 FRA-MAD (operated by Air Nostrum), arriving at Terminal 4, connecting to IB6827 MAD-GRU, departing from Terminal 4S.

FWIW, I did HUACA 3 times and everyone told me the same thing. So it was an actual problem with the MCT, not incompetent Qantas staff.

Straight from Amadeus, the same system that QF uses...

  1  IB8617 Y 25MAY 6*FRAMAD DK1  1915 2150  25MAY  E  0 CRK G
    OPERATED BY AIR NOSTRUM
    SEE RTSVC
  2  IB6827 Y 25MAY 6*MADGRU DK1  2355 0550  26MAY  E  0 346 BD
    SEE RTSVC

> dm1/2
DM1/2                                                                          
MAD-MAD      FROM      -             TO                                        
CC FLTN-FLTR ORGN EQPTM-CC FLTN-FLTR DEST EQPTM     HMM                        
IB                    4-IB                   4S I/I:055                        
ACTUAL CONNECTING TIME IS 205

You will note the * before the origin and destination of each flight - this means it's a married segment. Flights that fail MCT don't ever marry, meaning that this is a valid connection within MCT.

The second section is the MCT output from Amadeus specifically when querying these two specific flights. There is no exception rule case from the very long list that applies to this connection. The standard 55 minute MCT applies.

I'll leave it to you to decide whether QF staff were competent in this case...

Hmm, this has me a little worried as I now only have 70 minutes in MAD.

You only need to clear outbound immigration, which will likely be your biggest hold up at MAD due to them often not putting enough staff on, but on average this is too short.

 

[Mattg]

Well there you go! Thanks for investigating @madrooster. Every single Qantas staff member I spoke to said they could not re-issue the ticket due to the Minimum Connection Time not being reached. Perhaps the issue was that their system was telling them inaccurate information? Either way, there was no way any of them would re-issue my original ticket with the FRA-MAD-GRU connection.

I guess now I'm stuck with the HAM-MAD-GRU (until the next schedule change, anyway... there have already been 4).

The frustrating thing is that I had already checked on Expert Flyer and, in my discussion with Qantas, told them that I believed the MCT was 55 minutes. They wouldn't have a bar of it. I'm not sure what more I could have done?

 

[Berlin]

From quite recent and recurring experience, I always warn anyone connecting through Madrid to plan enough time in between. I had connections between one and the same pair of flights varying between 20 minutes and over an hour, depending on the day and gate used. Not at all surprised that even the airport itself doesn't know exactly what the minimum should be.

 

[madrooster]

From quite recent and recurring experience, I always warn anyone connecting through Madrid to plan enough time in between. I had connections between one and the same pair of flights varying between 20 minutes and over an hour, depending on the day and gate used. Not at all surprised that even the airport itself doesn't know exactly what the minimum should be.

As a rule of thumb, I don't permit my pax to do connections of less than 2 hours at MAD unless it's schengen to schengen in which case I permit 90 mins.

 

[Himeno]

The last 2 times I connected via MAD were cross PNR connections from short haul on to LHR (then Asia or DXB). IB/IB or IB/BA. Back when oneworld still had required through check to other oneworld.
Both times they were able to check me through without issue. Both times the computer refused to check bags through.
First trip, I had a 2.5hr connection. Had to collect bags and recheck. Barely made the cut off time.
Second trip, I had 85 mins. Not enough time to get off, collect bags, recheck and re clear security. They did a manual tag.
I made all the connections. Bag didn't. Got to my day trip in DXB to find no bag. Reported it and they arranged for it to catch up to me in SIN before I noticed that the aircraft the bag was currently on was the same aircraft taking me back to LHR. Got the plan changed to collect the bag off the belt when it arrived and take it back up to check in at DXB rather then trying to deal with the bags going to SIN on SQ and me going to SIN via LHR with BA/QF.


I would really like to know how they come up with the min connect times for each airport.