Lionair 610 crash

[Captain Halliday]

Lionair 610 missing. Unconfirmed reports it has crashed.

 

[Denali]

737, so approx 200 onboard? Terrible news and hoping for the best.

 

[Cossie]

News reports are stating it was PK-LQP and only delivered in August this year.

Lion Airlines PK-LQP (Boeing 737 Next Gen - MSN 43000) | Airfleets aviation

 

[TheInsider]

I'm not an expert, but seems strange they stayed at the same altitude (approx 5000ft) from 23:24 to 23:31, especially right after take-off.

 

[kpc]

From a twitter feed: Sutopo Purwo Nugroho on Twitter
I hate news stories like this!

 

[AIRwin]

Nothing yet on their website:
HOME

Ironically, the top news item was:
Lion Air and Batik Air Achieve Top Safety Rankings

 

[Dmac6345]

189 on board. This is terrible.

 

[VPS]

Not looking good at all - very sad

 

[Flying Fox]

Updated bad news -

Debris including plane seats are reported to have been spotted floating in the Java Sea.

Indonesia's disaster agency confirmed a Lion Air passenger jet crashed into the sea shortly after take-off from Jakarta and was carrying 188 passengers and crew.

Lion Air crash: Flight JT610 goes down in ocean off Indonesia after Jakarta take-off

 

[Must...Fly!]

I'm not an expert, but seems strange they stayed at the same altitude (approx 5000ft) from 23:24 to 23:31, especially right after take-off.

It might be indicative of a problem that crew were dealing with but why the sudden descent after what seems like a pretty steady hold...

 

[moa999]

737 Max8
So first incident for the new Max series

 

[jb747]

I'm not an expert, but seems strange they stayed at the same altitude (approx 5000ft) from 23:24 to 23:31, especially right after take-off.

Actually it's a normal response to a problem. Level off, and point the aircraft in a safe direction. Sort the issue out and land.

It might be indicative of a problem that crew were dealing with but why the sudden descent after what seems like a pretty steady hold...

If you look at the FR24 data (Flightradar24 Data Regarding Lion Air Flight JT610 – Flightradar24 Blog), it's not all that steady at all. If you compare the trace with that of the same flight the previous day, it starts to diverge very shortly after take off, with excursions in both speed and altitude (and rate, which would indicate pitch excursions).

At the end (and assuming the FR data is correct), he's doing 30,000 feet per minute vertically. That's the sort of thing you'd expect if the tail fell off (which, by the way, I'm not suggesting). I don't understand any of this, given the information we have so far.

 

[defurax]

An Indonesian official was quoted as saying that the water where the debris were spotted is only 30-40m deep...hopefully finding the black boxes won't be too hard.
Very sad news...

 

[moa999]

Airliners has a large thread.
Lion Air 737MAX8 Crashed Jakarta to Pangal Pinang - Airliners.net

One report that the pilots had reported control issues.

Pilots also appear relatively experienced versus comments of Lion using 18yo rookies.
Captain. Indian national, US trained, 6000hrs
Copilot. 5000hrs

At 30-40m depth youd expect a full aircraft recovery will be possible.

 

[Saab34]

Looks like more something as suggested above, something fell off or pilot induced control was cut off.

It seems they were onto it, at what was a struggle to even maintain level flight in an effort to resolve, but something failed at that point they started rapid decline with no way of arresting that decent.

I’m not on the Boeing but it appears as jb suggested with better knowledge, Tail/Fin/Elevator related.

Then you have the predicament of how a factory fresh 737 tail falls off.

On the other hand..... Loss of a engine and poor attempt at return to base/stall like QZ8501.

 

[jb747]

Looks like more something as suggested above, something fell off or pilot induced control was cut off.

It seems they were onto it, at what was a struggle to even maintain level flight in an effort to resolve, but something failed at that point they started rapid decline with no way of arresting that decent.

I’m not on the Boeing but it appears as jb suggested with better knowledge, Tail/Fin/Elevator related.

Then you have the predicament of how a factory fresh 737 tail falls off.

I'm not suggesting that at all. It's just that you need something as major as that to give that sort of sink rate, and speed, all of a sudden.

The airliners thread is even worse than pprune. Avherald is also full of people with no idea.

An aircraft can be flown with blocked pitot covers. It isn't all that hard, especially in daylight. It might be untidy, but there is no reason to see the outcome from the last minute or so. There is no reason to see this as anything related to the engines.

 

[flyer89]

Avherald is also full of people with no idea.

Unfortunately I completely agree. The websites content is wonderful but not the comments. I’ve had to stop myself from biting back on more than one occasion involving this very airline.....

 

[Justinf]

Unfortunately I completely agree. The websites content is wonderful but not the comments. I’ve had to stop myself from biting back on more than one occasion involving this very airline.....

With comments like: "Brand new aircraft gone bye bye..."
I won't be visiting that site again.

 

[Danger]

DFAT isn't waiting for an investigation:

Following the fatal crash of a Lion Air plane on 29 October 2018, Australian government officials and contractors have been instructed not to fly on Lion Air. This decision will be reviewed when the findings of the crash investigation are clear (see Local travel).​

Smartraveller.gov.au - Indonesia​

 

[Must...Fly!]

DFAT isn't waiting for an investigation:

Following the fatal crash of a Lion Air plane on 29 October 2018, Australian government officials and contractors have been instructed not to fly on Lion Air. This decision will be reviewed when the findings of the crash investigation are clear (see Local travel).​

Smartraveller.gov.au - Indonesia​

One wonderes if this includes their subsidiaries, Malindo/Batik which have RPT in to Australia.