Just saying. QFFP does not equate to loyalty or status.

[turffy]

Hi
For some/many people FF points are no indication of loyalty to flying that brand. With the multi-tier marketing where you are encouraged to use the FF credit card at this FF connected supermarket or eat at this restaurant our balance of FF points for many of use has no reflection on how often we fly with the airline. If you own a small business and follow the brand marketing you can amass a heap of FF points. Therefore i believe that SC that are only acquired when you fly with brand are a truer reflection of your frequency of flying with the airline and the basis on which the perks should be issued. What i strongly disagree with is that having followed the brand FF marketing and using their CC at their endorsed supermarket etc that when i do use those points to fly that i don't get status credits. In many cases you have actually paid a surcharge to earn those points.
Please don't write back and tell me the difference between a classic reward and an any seat any time reward that does come with SC's, i know that, for mine that is just a way for the airlines to extract more money/points out of you for the flights as is the selective figure of taxes and additional charges that vary dramatically between airlines.
thanks

 

[amper]

I believe it's only fair that FF points reflect the cost of the flight. So on par with FF points being proportionate to distance they should also be proportional to the value of the ticket. This way people who have urgent reason to fly and pay high price for tickets should earn more point. Some airlines do not award any FF points on specially discounted tickets - and this is only fair. I would much more prefer the discounted fair than FF for future use.

 

[RAM]

On international that just scrapes above Silver (couple of returns to europe, around 190 SC each using the middle fair (ie. no cheapest not PE)), so not that great outcome in any case - one entry to the QP and faster check in (which is nice, I admit). Even if using early bird fares and getting 3 returns, still at least 100 SC short of gold.

Someone mentioned the qantas club membership, I don't think it's that great - I took it when they waived the joining fee because I could spare the money (and ironically I'll be making gold for the 1st time through unplanned work trips, so I won't even need it until mid 2016 ...).
But on domestic it's not worth that much (how many pints can you drink in 30 minutes before your flight to make up the money ...), and on international you can buy lounge access for way cheaper than that, for ex $50-70 in Dubai, you'd need 10 of those to match the QP membership (and if you need 10 then you'll be gold anyway), more if you didn't get a discount on joining fee. I think you can also buy access in HK. Not to mention of course QF banning QP from the lounge in Dubai if not on QF flights, even if there is no actual QF code-share with EK for the next leg ...

Also honestly, the QF business amenities bag is rubbish ... looks like a pencil pouch for pre-schoolers ...

Disclaimer: fly mainly for work, got comped PS this year, never made gold so far, got a MEL-DXB upgrade to business on points, but was flying mid week on a half empty plane, so probably would have got it as NB.

Any business is in it for itself, not the customer - their main purpose is to extract money from us with the minimum amount of effort on their part. Doesn't matter if it's QF or QFF, same goals.

Totally agree about cost of QP. A cheaper (or possibly free option) depending on how often you use it o/s is through the Prioritypass.com and free if you get one of the Citibank CC offers.

The way QFF has been 'managed' (read manipulated) to push Y onto JQ instead of Q is no accident. The increasing 'other fees & charges' on a Q booking vs a JQ at similar time to same destination (sometimes on a plane that uses more fuel per passenger to boot) then makes a reward booking significantly cheaper in cash by going JQ. That was no accidental result.

 

[jessesd]

thats true.. but the points have been accruing in some cases for years. Qantas has these points (cash) to do with as they see fit, until the QFF decides to cash them in.

This in effect, is an interest free loan to Qantas, or a prepaid flight if you prefer.

 

[mannej]

thats true.. but the points have been accruing in some cases for years. Qantas has these points (cash) to do with as they see fit, until the QFF decides to cash them in.

This in effect, is an interest free loan to Qantas, or a prepaid flight if you prefer.

Technically no considering that the QFF T&C's specifically state that QFF points do not have a monetary value.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

i think the terms and conditions were somewhat relevant when initially drafted... when award seats were what they said on the box! (awards, with only actual taxes payable).

The situation we have today is very different - Qantas imposed charges can be half (or more) of the 'award' but there is no recognition of this monetary co-pay.

 

[Fantic125]

Although I accrue many thousands of QF FF points, I never seem to gain much in the way of SCs.
Not that I really care as whatever I have had, disappeared before I could get enough to get away from "Bronze".
So why do people covet them so much ?
Wouldn't it be worthwhile for members to give them a choice of either getting their SCs or more FF points ?
<snip>
I used to be a QF Club member, but found I did not use it all that much as I arrived on time to depart and as soon as I arrived, I was off to business and not hang around. The Club is too nice a place most of the time and it is tempting to waste time there & a trap for the busy business executive.
<snip>

bertair, the reason SC's (for OW, and miles for other programs) are coveted IMHO is because for the very frequent traveller they give you respite from the airport terminals via Lounges. Flying domestically inter-city on a daily or even Mon/Fri commute there's not much value in spending hours there. I've just done domestic flight # 61 for this year, and still have 6 to go.

The value really is in multiple international flights. In the last 7 years I visited 23 different countries a total of 82 times, with (approx) 330 flights.

I've flown through HKG 53 times, SIN 40 times, and LAX 38 times, (and multiple others) and pretty well each time with onward connecting flights with varying connecting times of 90 minutes to 9 hours. Where available, the Lounges gave me an opportunity to have a shower, get a meal, have a drink, relax or catch up on work.

Invaluable on a 30 ~ 40 hour end to end transit, and invaluable IMHO for 2~5 day business trips to EU, Americas or even Asia.

 

[boomy]

I believe it's only fair that FF points reflect the cost of the flight. So on par with FF points being proportionate to distance they should also be proportional to the value of the ticket. This way people who have urgent reason to fly and pay high price for tickets should earn more point. Some airlines do not award any FF points on specially discounted tickets - and this is only fair. I would much more prefer the discounted fair than FF for future use.

Welcome to AFF amper!
I agree that the more expensive the ticket is, the more points it should earn but I also think a minimum points guarantee is necessary mostly because even the most discounted fares on QF are not always very cheap and the airline needs to provide some incentives for it's loyal members to keep booking with them even when the competition offer cheaper fares.

 

[jessesd]

Hi
For some/many people FF points are no indication of loyalty to flying that brand. With the multi-tier marketing where you are encouraged to use the FF credit card at this FF connected supermarket or eat at this restaurant our balance of FF points for many of use has no reflection on how often we fly with the airline. If you own a small business and follow the brand marketing you can amass a heap of FF points. Therefore i believe that SC that are only acquired when you fly with brand are a truer reflection of your frequency of flying with the airline and the basis on which the perks should be issued. What i strongly disagree with is that having followed the brand FF marketing and using their CC at their endorsed supermarket etc that when i do use those points to fly that i don't get status credits. In many cases you have actually paid a surcharge to earn those points.
Please don't write back and tell me the difference between a classic reward and an any seat any time reward that does come with SC's, i know that, for mine that is just a way for the airlines to extract more money/points out of you for the flights as is the selective figure of taxes and additional charges that vary dramatically between airlines.
thanks

Thats exactly what i am talking about Turffy...!

 

[Deleted member]

Let's not forget that QP membership doesn't provide lounge access only. There are other benefits which can be worthwhile (a greater luggage allowance for one can come in handy)

And it's even better when you have LTQP.

 

[Deleted member]

Bertair said:

Although I accrue many thousands of QF FF points, I never seem to gain much in the way of SCs.
Not that I really care as whatever I have had, disappeared before I could get enough to get away from "Bronze".
So why do people covet them so much ?




Because points are two a penny. I earn way more points from partner programmes than I do from flying.
Flying however is how I earn status, (higher) status means access to more award seats, better luggage and lounge access etc. and of course higher points earn when flying.
With the simpler fairer rules, and the loss of ASA's I shall still earn points at previous levels, but will struggle with SC's earn , so I will end up not chasing status, reduce my frequency and concentrate on long term planning for long haul travel as a way of using my points.
I may make LTS in two years, some small reward for the frequency flying QF over the last few years.

 

[Deleted member]

Years in advance? I didn't think you could book an award flight more than a year in advance

I suspect the op was referring to how long the points have been banked for before use, rather than the ability to book into the future

 

[Deleted member]

Hi
For some/many people FF points are no indication of loyalty to flying that brand. With the multi-tier marketing where you are encouraged to use the FF credit card at this FF connected supermarket or eat at this restaurant our balance of FF points for many of use has no reflection on how often we fly with the airline. If you own a small business and follow the brand marketing you can amass a heap of FF points. Therefore i believe that SC that are only acquired when you fly with brand are a truer reflection of your frequency of flying with the airline and the basis on which the perks should be issued. What i strongly disagree with is that having followed the brand FF marketing and using their CC at their endorsed supermarket etc that when i do use those points to fly that i don't get status credits. In many cases you have actually paid a surcharge to earn those points.
Please don't write back and tell me the difference between a classic reward and an any seat any time reward that does come with SC's, i know that, for mine that is just a way for the airlines to extract more money/points out of you for the flights as is the selective figure of taxes and additional charges that vary dramatically between airlines.
thanks

I have always maintained that the loyalty programme is more of a frequency programme.
That being said, judicious use of the (old) ASA was a great way to accumulate status ( and you received points as well) but you needed to know how to search for the right seats at the right time, it was also important to have the option to be flexible with travel dates. Mrs GPH , would look for great deals (300 + days out) and then plan our travel / holiday around that. But we have the ability to take time out when we want as we are self employed.
However I am IMO a true loyal to the brand QFF , I only fly with the competition if QF doesn't have an option for me.
So I for one have never felt guilty about using ASA's to achieve and retain WP .
But as I am not a "younger" flyer, I shall content myself with ( hopefully while i am able) achieving LTS and then use points to fly albeit, less frequently.

 

[mannej]

And it's even better when you have LTQP. 

Considering what the opposition are charging for lifetime membership, those who were able to purchase lifetime QP did pick up a very good deal.

Bit before my time though.

 

[por930]

Considering what the opposition are charging for lifetime membership, those who were able to purchase lifetime QP did pick up a very good deal.

Bit before my time though.

Yeah, I am an old sod who took out lifetime membership for myself and wife in the early 80's. The few hundred dollars it cost was the best 'investment' I have ever made. I recall when we used to use the Qantas(TAA then) airport managers office (and his fridge) as the lounge prior to the Flight Deck Club kicking off and his secretary used to sort out our tickets. We fly less now, being retired, but I would never use VA or others where Qantas had a flight. It seems almost impossible to get a J award ticket unless you are 12 months out...maybe with assistance of ASA's, one day we can get to Plat