Involuntary downgrade anyone?

[gypsyinabigtown]

After having read several posts on FT on how shockingly common/usual it is to have an involuntary downgrade of paid J to Y in QR long-haul with DOH connections (usually because a Qatari sheikh decides last minute to fly J with his large family out of DOH, since his uncle owns the airline nobody can say no, so the paid J pax. are bumped down :evil with no or negligible (a few hundred euros) compensation, I wanted to hear people's experiences, if any, with QF involuntary downgrades. [I assume the reasons in QF would be more related to changes to operating flight rather than local VIPs ]

I've seen previous discussions about involuntary seat changes on Qantas, but they mostly referred to change of seat within the same class, rather than a downgrade to a different class.

Have you ever been bumped down from PE to Y, or even worse, from J to Y?
What is QF's standard policy to handle this? What compensation do you receive as a result?

 

[defurax]

Never happened to me, but if you are not in a hurry to get to destination I think the best thing is to refuse the downgrade and compensation. You then fly on the next available flight. I would never accept a downgrade without the compensation being almost 100% of the fare.

 

[cove]

Flying over the Arab nations has worked well for us. We have not ever been downgraded but with AA we did have to fight for our paid for First Class seats due to a high status flyer trying to expropriate them.

 

[maninblack]

I would never accept a downgrade without the compensation being almost 100% of the fare.

I would never accept a downgrade without the compensation being at least 200% of the fare!

Moreover they would lose my business for a long long time, come to think of it, they already have anyway

 

[markis10]

Have you ever been bumped down from PE to Y, or even worse, from J to Y?
What is QF's standard policy to handle this? What compensation do you receive as a result?

Qantas downades at the gate are fairly rare by comparison to most other airlines, and is usually a result of an aircraft change or unservicabilities.

http://www.qantas.com.au/agents/dyn/qf/policies/involuntaryDowngradePolicyJAN09

I would never accept a downgrade without the compensation being almost 100% of the fare.

Not going to happen with QF:

http://www.qantas.com.au/agents/dyn/qf/policies/FareRefundTableEff051113.pdf

 

[serfty]

Qantas downades at the gate are fairly rare by comparison to most other airlines, and is usually a result of an aircraft change or unservicabilities.

http://www.qantas.com.au/agents/dyn/qf/policies/involuntaryDowngradePolicyJAN09

Not going to happen with QF:

http://www.qantas.com.au/agents/dyn/qf/policies/FareRefundTableEff051113.pdf

Of course, while giving an indication, those more relate to downgrades with significant notice - not so much "at the gate".

If such were to happen at the LHR gate (QF2/10) the PAX would looking to compensation of 75% of the total ticket cost.

 

[gypsyinabigtown]

Of course, while giving an indication, those more relate to downgrades with significant notice - not so much "at the gate".

If such were to happen at the LHR gate (QF2/10) the PAX would looking to compensation of 75% of the total ticket cost.

I am glad to hear that as the table otherwise made horrific reading: you could buy a business ticket to TKY for $4,500, and end up having to fly economy both ways with only $1,500 compensation, 33% of total ticket cost!! :shock:

The fact people haven't had horror stories to tell so far also gives me hope that these events are indeed very rare.

 

[markis10]

I am glad to hear that as the table otherwise made horrific reading: you could buy a business ticket to TKY for $4,500, and end up having to fly economy both ways with only $1,500 compensation, 33% of total ticket cost!! :shock:

The fact people haven't had horror stories to tell so far also gives me hope that these events are indeed very rare.

The table applies everywhere except where law states a different amount be paid, which is why Serfty mentioned LHR, without mentioning that the amount quoted is part of the law there.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_261/2004

In your example the table would be applicable.

 

[Mwenenzi]

Qantas are good at yield management – overbooking. Helps that Qantas has a limited number of aircraft types- seating plans, so very late aircraft substitutions that could cause problems are uncommon. And unlike in the USA, weather does not disrupt Australian flights that often.

Some years ago I was phoned several hours before a QF flight and asked if I would change flights: not possible for me at that time. A cousin flying BNE AKL accepted an extra night in BNE, at QF’s cost ~5 years ago.

 

[amaroo]

BA tried to downgrade one of us from paid F to J (BKK-SYD) received the call poolside at BKK Peninsula.....anyway, long story short - some other poor sucker got the bunt.

 

[MrJetset]

After having read several posts on FT on how shockingly common/usual it is to have an involuntary downgrade of paid J to Y in QR long-haul with DOH connections (usually because a Qatari sheikh decides last minute to fly J with his large family out of DOH, since his uncle owns the airline nobody can say no, so the paid J pax. are bumped down :evil with no or negligible (a few hundred euros) compensation, I wanted to hear people's experiences, if any, with QF involuntary downgrades. [I assume the reasons in QF would be more related to changes to operating flight rather than local VIPs ]

Is this a joke?

Regardless, all airlines downgrade. QF tends to do this less so, but it does happen.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Is this a joke?

Regardless, all airlines downgrade. QF tends to do this less so, but it does happen.

It appears not
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/qata...55-full-fare-business-class-bump-economy.html

 

[gypsyinabigtown]

Is this a joke?

Regardless, all airlines downgrade. QF tends to do this less so, but it does happen.

No, it is not a joke.
I don't think I ever claimed that some airlines categorically refuse to do any downgrades. However, it is easy to see, from posts both in this forum and others like FT, that QR seem to do it more frequently than other airlines.

If you read my original post, my question is about how common it is with QF, what people's experiences are, and what the written policy is. (which markis10 helpfully provided info on).

 

[MrJetset]

It appears not
Full fare business class bump to economy - FlyerTalk Forums

PF, I was referring to the hysterical Qatari Sheikh part...

If you read further down that FT thread you'll see they didn't bump members of a family in J. Most airlines will not involuntarily separate a family for obvious reasons.

I have been downgraded, but always because of an aircraft change when F is no longer offered.

 

[gypsyinabigtown]

PF, I was referring to the hysterical Qatari Sheikh part...

I have to admit that the Qatari sheikh point was more conjecture based on what I read on FT and other forums on possible causes of QR's notoriety on involuntary downgrades.

I do not claim this to be definitive. Perhaps predictably, QR has not published an official policy to the effect "you will be bumped if a local VIP wants your seat".
If there are other ideas as to why QR seems to downgrade involuntarily more often than others, I'm all ears.

 

[serfty]

...

If you read further down that FT thread you'll see they didn't bump members of a family in J. Most airlines will not involuntarily separate a family for obvious reasons.

...

I had the gist of a common subject of the unforeseen(/late booked/extra) presence of "Large Families" in the premium cabin that causing said cabins to be overbooked with the subsequent attempted downgrades to other passengers.

Originally Posted by bluegreentravel
Don't get me started on this... Just flew in the J cabin, and the FAs looked as if they are about to cry because of an extremely demanding and rude family. They took up half the J and F cabin, and wanted to evict the other guests in F, because they refused to sit in J.

Delayed for about an hour. I was fuming throughout the flight

 

[gypsyinabigtown]

If you read that forum more closely it is an apparent there is a common subject of the unforeseen(/late booked/extra) presence of "Large Families" in the premium cabin that causing said cabins to be overbooked with the subsequent attempted downgrades to other passengers.

Exactly, and this, along with discussions with some ground staff I know on airports, is the basis of my "Qatari sheikh" theory.
There is no hard evidence but it sounds very plausible.

 

[Daver6]

My bank account tends to regular downgrade me to Y even they my heart is booked into F

 

[Fruitcake]

Have you ever been bumped down from PE to Y, or even worse, from J to Y?
What is QF's standard policy to handle this? What compensation do you receive as a result?

I wasn't "bumped" in the strictest sense (and it wasn't long haul), but I did receive a call about five hours before departure once apologising for an oversell, and offering me either Y on the affected QF flight or J on an NZ flight a couple of hours earlier.

I took the NZ option - then arrived at AKL and find NZ knew nothing about me. However the NZ checkin agent took complete ownership of the problem, called QF herself to work through whatever airlines do in these situations, got the reservation sorted, checked me in, and sent me on my way.

 

[MrJetset]

Exactly, and this, along with discussions with some ground staff I know on airports, is the basis of my "Qatari sheikh" theory.
There is no hard evidence but it sounds very plausible.

Sounds more like xenophobic nonsense to me and belongs in the same thread as Arab airlines don't pay for fuel.