How can AFF contribute towards relaxation of bilateral agreements between Australia and other countries?

[LionKing]

I kinda know that this topic may cross the fringe of the rules of this discussion board, however I must point out that this may affect how we are to travel in the future.

I was wondering if AFF (us) as a collectual can do something to lobby, advocate and push for better billateral deals of air traffic rights in and out of Australia?

There are two countries particular of my mind: Indonesia and Hong Kong.

Indonesia: Everyone loves to go to Bali, however the lack of seats due to bilateral agreements is confining the ability for Qantas, Virgin and Garuda to expand, and is also affecting the ability for Indonesians to connect into Jakarta in Java.

I honestly hope the bilateral agreement can be changed in a way that open skies can happen with unlimited traffic rights, and potentially with conditions, such as minimum 50% of seats flying between Indonesia and Australia needs to be Business/First Class and Premium Economy, to avoid overtourism in Bali, or exclude Bali in the bilateral to allow more flights in/out of Jarkarta and open new cities such as Surabaya.

As our PM says there's no more important relationship than with Indonesia, yet there are not sufficient flights to/from Indonesia, which I think it is holding a back foot into Australia's relationship with them.

Hong Kong: The neighbouring region of Guangdong has become one of the most visited place for Australians, in particular of those tens of millions of Chinese ethincity.

Yet only allowing 83/91 flights per week into Australia is far from enough and is driving ticket prices sky rocket. Hong Kong is no difference to Singapore in terms of connectivity, and it is completely the fault of Australian Airlines who are unable to provide extra capacity into Hong Kong and now everyone is suffering from $6000 tickets return to HKG. Making it open skies would allow Hong Kong carriers to fly more often into Australian main cities, including WSI, which would drive down ticket prices and would be welcome to the main voter base of the current Australian Governing political party.

There could be many more examples, such as UAE, Taiwan etc., and I would like to know how us, as AFF, could do something to push the government to introduce more flights so that we can enjoy lower prices and more frequency overseas, so we don't need to fork out tens of thousands just to see our families?

 

[Forg]

The Hong Kong thing is interesting … what are the limitations there?
Never having even thought about it, the fact Cathay has 5 daily flights just to Sydney (well they did on the July days I was looking at) made me just assume every airline is running bulk flights through there … but for the above comment to be made, this must be an inaccurate assumption … is the CCP only allowing the airline they inherited (“it comes with the territory”) that number of flights?

What could the AFF community do?
I doubt much that’s real. You’d likely need to talk with your local federal member and ask what they could push for, along with a solid argument for whether it was going to be worth their effort - like, what does their constituency actually get out of it & about which anyone would care enough for it to sway a vote.
I guess if you work for an airline that might provide a different avenue; but chatting with senior management (ie. for them to whine to government) about stuff like this is probably harder to achieve that chatting to your local political representative.

 

[Mwenenzi]

I kinda know that this topic may cross the fringe of the rules of this discussion board, however I must point out that this may affect how we are to travel in the future.

I was wondering if AFF (us) as a collectual can do something to lobby, advocate and push for better billateral deals of air traffic rights in and out of Australia?

There are two countries particular of my mind: Indonesia and Hong Kong.
<snip>

Hong Kong is not a country. Part of a China. The end

China as a whole is not that profitable for western airlines. Based on big volumes at low margins.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I kinda know that this topic may cross the fringe of the rules of this discussion board, however I must point out that this may affect how we are to travel in the future.

I was wondering if AFF (us) as a collectual can do something to lobby, advocate and push for better billateral deals of air traffic rights in and out of Australia?

There are two countries particular of my mind: Indonesia and Hong Kong.

Indonesia: Everyone loves to go to Bali, however the lack of seats due to bilateral agreements is confining the ability for Qantas, Virgin and Garuda to expand, and is also affecting the ability for Indonesians to connect into Jakarta in Java.

I honestly hope the bilateral agreement can be changed in a way that open skies can happen with unlimited traffic rights, and potentially with conditions, such as minimum 50% of seats flying between Indonesia and Australia needs to be Business/First Class and Premium Economy, to avoid overtourism in Bali, or exclude Bali in the bilateral to allow more flights in/out of Jarkarta and open new cities such as Surabaya.

As our PM says there's no more important relationship than with Indonesia, yet there are not sufficient flights to/from Indonesia, which I think it is holding a back foot into Australia's relationship with them.

Hong Kong: The neighbouring region of Guangdong has become one of the most visited place for Australians, in particular of those tens of millions of Chinese ethincity.

Yet only allowing 83/91 flights per week into Australia is far from enough and is driving ticket prices sky rocket. Hong Kong is no difference to Singapore in terms of connectivity, and it is completely the fault of Australian Airlines who are unable to provide extra capacity into Hong Kong and now everyone is suffering from $6000 tickets return to HKG. Making it open skies would allow Hong Kong carriers to fly more often into Australian main cities, including WSI, which would drive down ticket prices and would be welcome to the main voter base of the current Australian Governing political party.

There could be many more examples, such as UAE, Taiwan etc., and I would like to know how us, as AFF, could do something to push the government to introduce more flights so that we can enjoy lower prices and more frequency overseas, so we don't need to fork out tens of thousands just to see our families?

There is still plenty of capacity on the AU-Indonesia market. It’s just that that capacity belongs to Indonesian carriers who have chosen not to take advantage of it.

That potentially suits Aussie carriers to some degree, limiting available seats and driving up prices/profits for them.

If there was sufficient profit for indonesian carriers, they’d be flying it.

Re HKG… I suspect there’s plenty of capacity there as well! Just QF/JQ/VA can see greater profits elsewhere.