Durability of New Australian Passports

[Bang4Buck]

I applied for a passport renewal today.

My PA called Australia Post's information line this morning around 10am and made an appointment at my local PO for 2pm (all previous times were booked apparently). However when I arrived they seem unconcerned with this; I just waited in line like everyone else and they processed the application without asking whether I made an appointment or requesting a reference/ appointment number e.g.

I needed photos taken, so I arrived about 1.45pm given apparently I should do so as the passport photos were separate from the renewal process. It became a comical experience for me, though I doubt the other people waiting in line (about 20) saw the humour in it.

My friendly photographer/ PO worker (of asian origin, I'd guess Vietnamese) told me I couldn't "smell" for the photo. I suggested she meant smile or smirk but she reassured me that I shouldn't smell.

So I had the photo taken, trying my best to look "serious". Afterwards though, there was a problem. She consulted with her superior and indeed apparently I had a faint smirk on my face. She didn't exactly scold me, but she said "this photo no good, you are smelling".

Rather bemused, I checked with her superior (standing next to her) whether indeed the pic was unacceptable. She told me even the slightest hint of a smile/ smirk changes the "structure of the face". With all these people waiting, I was ordered back to the photo point, in the middle of the PO and in front of (I imagine) several customers whose patience was wearing.

I gave her my best "prison look" and she proudly confirmed "is good" just like that old sausage commercial (Hans?). But then she started smiling and apologising; oh cough, there was no film in the camera.

So back to the desk for more film and now the usually relaxed holidaymakers that share my hometown sometimes are suddenly giving me looks that kill. I announce sheepishly "sorry".

We go back to the camera point and I laugh. Now imagine for a moment, when someone says you can't do anything like smile, that's all you want to do. Anyway, I didn't want anyone in the PO to bash me so I gave my full "prisoner look" which seemed to make her happy. So photo done; now for the application (BTW, she let me keep the four "smelling shots" free).

I was assured I needed to take my driver's license and birth certificate to prove identity (of course with my current passport by my PA who had spoken to PO infoline) but was told "no need" by my new friend, who I couldn't help smiling with and who seemed equally amused by the experience.

"We have another problem - it's too big". Now I know I've put on maybe a couple of kilos since my last photo around 9.5 years ago and she wasn't wearing Xray glasses so I was perplexed by what she meant. Ahhh, my signature was slightly outside of the designated box. I signed the box next to it (for such purposes I believe), no need to use the extra copy my faithful assistant had diligently prepared.

Now it's time to pay. I don't intend to travel much this next 10 years so ordered the standard passport. That cost $208. The expedited fee where they promise to have it done in two days cost another $78 (I lodged today 2.10pm Tuesday, so I can expect my new passport Friday or Monday apparently). The passport photos cost $13.95, so in total it cost $299.95. If you need a FF passport e.g. then other fees are here: https://www.passports.gov.au/Web/Queries/Fees.aspx

I left the place relaxed and happy. I had expected some farcical interrogation but was left smiling and bemused. I bought some '99 Dom for a party tonight and I ran into my "photographer" on the way out. Big smiles with "so where are you going"?

I replied, and thanked her for her help. Someone commented before that they wouldn't trust their passport renewal to the PO. Well, I can't answer that, but I'll know by Monday.

 

[FlyboyAl]

We have let customers have a slight smile, and they have passed. The main thing is that the mouth is closed, and most people open their mouth when they smile.
We have a photo of the mona lisa next to where we place our customers for their photo, and it has a note on it saying that is all the smile you can have.
It cracks most of them up when they see it.

The most interesting are the (usually female) clients who want their hair in such an such a position, then they want to smile, and turn side on to the camera to get the right profile. It takes considerable tact sometimes to get them to just do a "mugshot".

The other good ones are those who take the photo at home and assure us it is correct with the wrong background, wrong lighting, wrong resolution and more. We print them after warning them that we will not redo them for nothing if they are rejected. we have probably seen about 40 or 50 come back over the last 2 years to have them redone.

People do not understand that a passport photo is a LOT more than just a photo:evil:

 

[Mal]

Someone commented before that they wouldn't trust their passport renewal to the PO. Well, I can't answer that, but I'll know by Monday.

Your story did make me laugh, but is the reason why I would go to Australia Post for the whole process - ie photos and application. They aren't going to reject one of their own photos (vs you turning up with a photo from someone else) and their rejection rate is very low (apparently).

 

[SBOB]

Had issues with taking my own passport photos this week as the background was too dark...
Was tempted to photoshop a solution but I instead took them again...
While rebooking a time for the next interview they were checked as being 'ok'...

Hopefully when the passport arrives I wont have to worry about its durability

 

[taswegian77]

Have had my chip e-passport now for 3.5 years and it is holding up well. Kept in that sleeve they give you when it arrives, kept in hotel safe when in hotel, and otherwise also kept in my QF "man" wallet, yes I call it that but it serves a good purpose. Th eonyl issue I have is that it is only a 32 page one and I have only 8 pages left, with many trips coming up to Indonesia plus my Indian and Thai visas expre in July/Sep so might need one soon.
Only issue I have i stryign to use the self scanner at immigration, it hardly works. I think becauase I am too tall, but have been told that should not be the case. I am 194 cms and wondering of others have similar issues?

 

[Mal]

On a slightly different tangent - how could they make them more durable?

 

[taswegian77]

On a slightly different tangent - how could they make them more durable?

I think someone needs to design a credit card passport that stores all your information and maybe have a paper passport as backup for hard copy visas etc. The whole stamping of the passport, is it really necesarry considering they have ti all stored in a computer. I guess seeing is believing!

 

[Bang4Buck]

We have let customers have a slight smile, and they have passed. The main thing is that the mouth is closed, and most people open their mouth when they smile....

My mouth was closed and "a normal person" I'd suspect would judge that I was neither smiling/ smirking/ or smelling in said photograph.

To appease them, I had the photos done again, but to me it was a bit ludicrous.

Are you a PO worker or Australian consular staff?

 

[FlyboyAl]

No, I run a photographic lab in Adelaide

 

[Bang4Buck]

No, I run a photographic lab in Adelaide

I'm tempted to ask "run" or own?

Sorry, I've had two passports issued overseas in the last ten years, all using the same photos of 9.5 years ago (because of no available pages), and I was smiling/ smirking/ smelling. I always just sent the papers and it was automatically renewed. No questions asked.

Now, not being able to smile in Aus was kind of funny but what was kinda cool this time was that they let me keep my old pasport, although they "clipped it".

 

[taswegian77]

I'm tempted to ask "run" or own?

Sorry, I've had two passports issued overseas in the last ten years, all using the same photos of 9.5 years ago (because of no available pages), and I was smiling/ smirking/ smelling. I always just sent the papers and it was automatically renewed. No questions asked.

Now, not being able to smile in Aus was kind of funny but what was kinda cool this time was that they let me keep my old pasport, although they "clipped it".

I think the keeping of the old passport is quite common. When mine was renewed in late 2006, they clipped and gave my old one back. I was glad as I had a Thia visa still in it that Thai allows as being valid.

 

[Bang4Buck]

I think the keeping of the old passport is quite common. When mine was renewed in late 2006, they clipped and gave my old one back. I was glad as I had a Thia visa still in it that Thai allows as being valid.

My last two passports were (re)isssued in Germany. They certainly didn't let me keep the previous one (they were lodged via the consulate) but YMMV. Thus I was surprised yesterday.

 

[coco50]

Ditto re shirt pocket when in transit and safe when in hotel. Have a nearly 2 year old 64 page passport - which does get a lot of use - and the passport and it is holding up OK, although it doesn't stand up too well to the humidity can get almost a little "saggy" in constant humidity (which living in Singapore means that it is often in better condition when travelling than at home ...)

I remember about 3 years ago while on a day trip from HKG to Shenzen and Guangdong and then back to HKG by rail, there was a US gentleman who got detained for about 20 minutes by the Chinese border police because his passport was well worn. When I asked him what was the problem he told me that they thought that his passport could have been a fake because of the fact that it was so worn. He always kept it in his jacket pocket.

 

[SeaWolf]

On a slightly different tangent - how could they make them more durable?

I'd like to see the chip better protected. The UK passports have a page of clear plastic that the chip and its antenna are embedded into. It would protect it against water, being bashed with a stamp and being accidentally bent.

 

[FlyboyAl]

own and run!!!!!

 

[Bang4Buck]

...As someone who owns and runs a photo lab, I can tell you that the quality of the photo, as well as dimensions, shadow (none), resolution and lighting are all more complicated than just standing in front of a 3mp camera and getting a photo taken...

My apologies; I've just seen this previous comment in the thread.

 

[ziggyboy]

I'd like to see the chip better protected. The UK passports have a page of clear plastic that the chip and its antenna are embedded into. It would protect it against water, being bashed with a stamp and being accidentally bent.

Malaysian passports are worse. My gf is a permanent resident with Malaysian citizenship and their chips are at the back of the passport. It's literally the back outer page so she cannot staple the old and new passports together. It's a bit annoying as her PR visa is on the old passport and has to carry both passports when she travels.

Not sure if the people holding passports over 1 year old realise that the current passports being released are new. They're black and the pages contain watermarks of different Australian landmarks.

 

[anat0l]

This is all interesting to read.

My dad is applying to renew his Philippino passport. The application does include the guidelines as to how the photos must be submitted, but I have to admit that all the samples (the "correct" ones) on the guideline sheet broke all the rules with regards to size and spacing (even if the photos were "scaled" to fit on the guideline sheet or due to our printing it on paper and the document being resized to fit the printer margins, even if you took this into account and remeasured the sizes the photos were still in violation of the rules they stipulated).

Dad was a cheapskate and didn't want to pay the $15 at the PO to get his photo taken (not sure if they could do Philippine passports, but I'd assume so anyway), so he made me take his photo on a blue background (matched the colour with that online) and carefully crop it so it fit regulation. I think I did a "pretty good job", but I guess we'll find out when dad submits his application.

*flame shield on*

Thankfully, I don't have to worry about passport renewal myself until 2013. I've still got the L series passport which is flexible enough - it is usually carried in its plastic sleeve and has been through various environments (but not too humid) and still doing alright. I'm the only one in my family that doesn't have a new e-Passport. I'm blindly assuming that I can still travel anywhere in the world (visas aside) with my passport.



Is it against the law in most (all) countries to - accidentally or wilfully - damage or destroy one's or another person's passport? For example, if a bouncer bends your e-Passport and breaks/invalidates your RFID chip, can you seek legal redress from the bouncer / their employer to get them to pay for your replacement?



Finally - can you protect the RFID chip? Ultimately, not really, unless passports are made of tough, almost inflexible material (or tough, robust flexible material with a somewhat flexible RFID chip). Think travel cards (e.g. BNE go card, MEL myki, LON Oyster, HKG Octopus, etc.) with RFID chips in them - whilst it's difficult to snap a plastic card with a strength similar to (or greater than) a run-of-the-mill credit card, it's not entirely impossible. Not to mention that you don't actually have to snap the RFID-chip-containing card to do irreversible damage to it (rendering it non-functional). But I agree that some protections easily could and should be afforded, e.g. resistance to liquids, heat, humidity and impact.

 

[Bang4Buck]

...Thankfully, I don't have to worry about passport renewal myself until 2013. I've still got the L series passport which is flexible enough - it is usually carried in its plastic sleeve and has been through various environments (but not too humid) and still doing alright. I'm the only one in my family that doesn't have a new e-Passport. I'm blindly assuming that I can still travel anywhere in the world (visas aside) with my passport.

Perhaps except Dubai; it is the L series Aussie passports which were recently used/ stolen by Israeli security forces in a recent alleged assassination attempt.

 

[Bang4Buck]

Hmmm, still no passport for moi. Come on PO!