Clarification of Int First Lounge Access and Eligibility

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timbods

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On Friday I will be flying on QF127 to Hong Kong in PE. My QF status is Gold. From Hong Kong I will catch CX289 in First to Frankfurt (classic award booking).

I had assumed that I could only use the J lounge in Sydney, but I notice the eligibility rules state:
International First oneworld Customers
Next onward flight that day must be on a oneworld operated and marketed flight.#
One guest allowed and must be travelling on a oneworld operated and marketed flight.#

My onward flight is in first on a oneworld carrier - can I use the first lounge? Does it matter if it leaves at 0.25 the next day so not technically the same day?

And on a separate but related issue... Will I be able to check my bags all the way through?
 
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Princess Fiona

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On Friday I will be flying on QF127 to Hong Kong in PE. My QF status is Gold. From Hong Kong I will catch CX289 in First to Frankfurt (classic award booking).

I had assumed that I could only use the J lounge in Sydney, but I notice the eligibility rules state:
International First oneworld Customers
Next onward flight that day must be on a oneworld operated and marketed flight.#
One guest allowed and must be travelling on a oneworld operated and marketed flight.#

My onward flight is in first on a oneworld carrier - can I use the first lounge? Does it matter if it leaves at 0.25 the next day so not technically the same day?

And on a separate but related issue... Will I be able to check my bags all the way through?

Tricky but I don't think you will get access to the QF F Lounge as the SYD-HKG flight is over 5 hours so technically speaking LH-LH connection per published OW rules
"Connecting between oneworld marketed and operated flights:
First and Business Class customers connecting on the same day of travel, or before 6am the following day, can access the lounge when travelling between an international long haul (a oneworld international long haul flight is defined as an international flight marketed and operated by any oneworld carrier with a scheduled flight time longer than 5 hours) and an international short haul or domestic flight (and vice-versa)."
 

defurax

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On Friday I will be flying on QF127 to Hong Kong in PE. My QF status is Gold. From Hong Kong I will catch CX289 in First to Frankfurt (classic award booking).

I had assumed that I could only use the J lounge in Sydney, but I notice the eligibility rules state:
International First oneworld CustomersNext onward flight that day must be on a oneworld operated and marketed flight.#
One guest allowed and must be travelling on a oneworld operated and marketed flight.#

My onward flight is in first on a oneworld carrier - can I use the first lounge? Does it matter if it leaves at 0.25 the next day so not technically the same day?

And on a separate but related issue... Will I be able to check my bags all the way through?

I'm not 100% sure, but if you remove your QFF number from your booking you would then become an "International Oneworld First Customer" (you can always add your QFF number back before leaving the lounge).

I guess that QF127 would be the "international short haul", note that connecting before 6 AM is considered same day. Edit: just realised that 5+ hours is long haul...

From oneworld website:

  • Connecting between oneworld marketed and operated flights:
    • First and Business Class customers connecting on the same day of travel, or before 6am the following day, can access the lounge when travelling between an international long haul (a oneworld international long haul flight is defined as an international flight marketed and operated by any oneworld carrier with a scheduled flight time longer than 5 hours) and an international short haul or domestic flight (and vice-versa).
    • Lounge access will be determined on the international long haul ticketed flight (either First of Business Class) regardless of the ticketed class of travel on the international short haul or domestic flight.
    • You must be prepared to show your boarding pass or itinerary showing travel in First or Business class on the international long haul flight, in order to access the lounge before your international short haul or domestic flight.

You will have absolutely no problem getting your bag checked through your final destination.
 
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MEL_Traveller

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On Friday I will be flying on QF127 to Hong Kong in PE. My QF status is Gold. From Hong Kong I will catch CX289 in First to Frankfurt (classic award booking).

I had assumed that I could only use the J lounge in Sydney, but I notice the eligibility rules state:
International First oneworld CustomersNext onward flight that day must be on a oneworld operated and marketed flight.#
One guest allowed and must be travelling on a oneworld operated and marketed flight.#

My onward flight is in first on a oneworld carrier - can I use the first lounge? Does it matter if it leaves at 0.25 the next day so not technically the same day?

no.

there is no access to the First lounge in Sydney.

when you are physically standing at sydney airport, your next onward flight will be the QF127 to HKG. As that is in premium economy, and you have gold status, that entitles you to the business lounge.

next onward flight doesn't cover the flight after the one you are about to take. it literally means 'your very next' flight.
 
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Kangol

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As mentioned above, the OW website says that you are only allowed access if your long haul segment is in F (when connecting to/from short haul or domestic).

Lounge access - oneworld

It doesn't mention anything about connecting from LH-LH, so whilst it does not say you don't have access, neither does it say you do have access.

Doesn't hurt to ask, you could put forward the case that you are connecting to a "longer" haul F flight, but don't expect access because it does not explicitly say you have access. Please report back and let us know what happens.

Might throw a small spanner in the works for people wanting to use USDM or AS miles to travel CX F to the USA via HKG if QF F awards are unavailable..
 

ajw373

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I think this is one of those areas where their may not be hard and fast rules. What you should do is go to the first lounge and try. If you get in good for you, if they refuse don't be offended and head downstairs.
 

MEL_Traveller

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The OP was asking about the definition of 'next onward', which is unfortunately not relevant.
 

defurax

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What I find weird in this case is that let's say CX was offering first class to HKG from AKL, then the OP would have access to the F lounge in SYD because the SYD-AKL flight on QF would be short haul connecting to OW LH in First class. So it is hard to understand what woud be the reason to exclude LH-LH?
 

MEL_Traveller

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What I find weird in this case is that let's say CX was offering first class to HKG from AKL, then the OP would have access to the F lounge in SYD because the SYD-AKL flight on QF would be short haul connecting to OW LH in First class. So it is hard to understand what woud be the reason to exclude LH-LH?

in your example if the passenger was flying SYD-AKL-HKG, they would not have F lounge access in SYD anyway. The connecting rules are exactly that, they apply only in the connecting city. Not the city of origin.

why no LH-LH? because it is exactly that - long-haul. If you wanted to fly First you generally can.... if first class lounge access is that important.

I think the rule is there to protect F/J class pax who may have no other option than to connect to business or economy on shorter sectors after you arrive long-haul into a hub.
 

defurax

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in your example if the passenger was flying SYD-AKL-HKG, they would not have F lounge access in SYD anyway. The connecting rules are exactly that, they apply only in the connecting city. Not the city of origin.

why no LH-LH? because it is exactly that - long-haul. If you wanted to fly First you generally can.... if first class lounge access is that important.

I think the rule is there to protect F/J class pax who may have no other option than to connect to business or economy on shorter sectors after you arrive long-haul into a hub.

Makes sense. I was reading "connecting" as having a connection sometimes in the same day, not specifically lounge access exclusively at the connecting airport.
 

MEL_Traveller

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Makes sense. I was reading "connecting" as having a connection sometimes in the same day, not specifically lounge access exclusively at the connecting airport.

i dunno! maybe you are right. the 'and vice verse' makes the oneworld rules unnecessarily unclear.
 
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knightman7

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Just try. It's the luck of the draw really. But it can't hurt presenting yourself at the F lounge reception and asking politely for admittance. A short walk down to the J lounge is not a bad second prize :)
 

serfty

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Makes sense. I was reading "connecting" as having a connection sometimes in the same day, not specifically lounge access exclusively at the connecting airport.
I dunno! maybe you are right. the 'and vice verse' makes the oneworld rules unnecessarily unclear.
If travelling *O say from melbourne to sydney in economy to connect with a business class flights to hong kong, then by this connecting rule, the passenger without status would get lounge access in melbourne. The same would work in reverse.

The only gray area here is the long haul to long haul situation.

As already posted I would present myself at the First lounge armed with both BP's.
 

MelUser

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Does the flight from Sydney have a first class cabin? If not then both boarding passes is a good idea - you can just say that your travel agent was unable to get you a first class seat from Sydney.

I have successfully used this argument for baggage in Europe - ie internal European flight was an economy seat because no business class on the aircraft but connecting transcontinental was in business. Therefore I wanted the business class luggage allowance to apply to the connecting flight. The checkin person accepted this argument without question.
 

mannej

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Baggage allowance and lounge entry rules are two different kettle of fish. The argument you are presenting may not really cut it.
 
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