Australian Reports of the Virus Spread

[RooFlyer]

Just because you test negative 48-72 hours before, it doesn't mean you don't have the virus. That's been proved true many times.

Sure, but if you are referring to the comments above re a "pre flight negative test required", it will eliminate the carriage of definitely actively positive pax, who may infect others during the repatriation process and pose a risk during quarantine. Its never been claimed that this screening will eliminate all carriers.

Tasmania has the 'pre flight negative test' and we had 4 pax go positive very shortly after arrival. The is was received with a shrug of the shoulders by our (very conservative) Chief Health guy, because they knew it would happen.

 

[Pushka]

Sure, but if you are referring to the comments above re a "pre flight negative test required", it will eliminate the carriage of definitely actively positive pax, who may infect others during the repatriation process and pose a risk during quarantine. Its never been claimed that this screening will eliminate all carriers.

Tasmania has the 'pre flight negative test' and we had 4 pax go positive very shortly after arrival. The is was received with a shrug of the shoulders by our (very conservative) Chief Health guy, because they knew it would happen.

Which is what we had in SA yesterday (must have been tested a day before) because he tested positive on his first day of quarantine, but is now negative after perhaps four days in Australia. So he had a long standing infection likely caught a week before he flew to Aus.

 

[Flashback]

Sure, but if you are referring to the comments above re a "pre flight negative test required", it will eliminate the carriage of definitely actively positive pax, who may infect others during the repatriation process and pose a risk during quarantine. Its never been claimed that this screening will eliminate all carriers.

Tasmania has the 'pre flight negative test' and we had 4 pax go positive very shortly after arrival. The is was received with a shrug of the shoulders by our (very conservative) Chief Health guy, because they knew it would happen.

Indeed, however reading some of the posts that's not everyone's interpretation of how it works / its purposes.... just saying!

 

[Lynda2475]

however reading some of the posts that's not everyone's interpretation of how it works / its purposes.... just saying!

Hope you are not referring to me, I never stated it would eliminate all risk, but reduce risk of travelling with a known positve case.

 

[Flashback]

Hope you are not referring to me, I never stated it would eliminate all risk, but reduce risk of travelling with a known positve case.

There's been several posts from several readers over the course of this thread; I'm no singling anyone out. I do the same with masks too, reminding people that it's mainly to protect others from yourself rather than the other way around as that's another common misconception.......

 

[dajop]

Well certain flight from NZ are exempt from Quarantine altogether but only if everyone ont he flight had been in NZ for 14 days before departure.

Hard to apply those rules to flights coming from other places as many of the passengers have connected form elsewhere. i.e. cases in Sinagpore are low but many people from Europe and India transit SIN to get to Australia.

Yeh, I wasn't talking about exempting from quarantine (as much as I'd love that ..... I'm past the half way mark of my current quarantine), as you are right the flights do have connecting pax (although IMHO the greatest risk is on the bus transport to hotel), although notably SIN does not allow connections from India. Incidently it wouldn't be a problem, if people who'd been in the country for at least 14 days before departure were exempt from quarantine, as SQ and even QF in an instant would happily add flights that exclude connecting pax, like those from NZ.

That aside, my point was coming from SIngapore, there is little point in a pre-departure COVID-test, as the risk is by far the highest on the plane and arrival ground transport, mixing with passengers from Europe etc. The day 2/3 and 10/11 tests better serve the need of managing that risk.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

My logic is as follows:
- making desperate Aussies pre-test, which would push them further back to wait for a flight home on a positive (or false positive/old positive) result, feels unfair
- pre-tests are not foolproof
- 14 day mandatory quarantine is considered foolproof/gold standard
- make everyone wear masks on flight back

In essence creating a control measure which is not foolproof in addition to a foolproof measure doesn’t make sense in respect of desperate Aussies, some who may have been on waiting lists for months.

Yes the pre-test reduces risk but if everyone wearing mask on flight home I feel (not sure about scientific observations) a pre-test is about a similar measure as masks in reducing spread/new cases.

I probably would have a different view if pre-tests were (edit: good, gold) standard, but in reality they are not, so why use it to filter cases/delay repatriation and/or split families???

 

[RooFlyer]

- pre-tests are not foolproof
- 14 day mandatory quarantine is considered foolproof/gold standard
- make everyone wear masks on flight back

- I don't think any tests are fool proof are they?
- 14 day quarantine is good, but not "foolproof" I think - we've been there
- the risk isn't just on the flight.

Anytime you have an infected person in close proximity to a non infected one you increase the risk of spread. Hopefully hotel quarantine is much better than it was, but I'd prefer to keep the number of infectees in the system lower, if possible.

Is it unfair to deny an infected person boarding? Maybe, but I doubt anyone would be allowed on board any aircraft with a proven case of a notifyable infectious disease, masks or no masks.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

- I don't think any tests are fool proof are they?
- 14 day quarantine is good, but not "foolproof" I think - we've been there
- the risk isn't just on the flight.

Anytime you have an infected person in close proximity to a non infected one you increase the risk of spread. Hopefully hotel quarantine is much better than it was, but I'd prefer to keep the number of infectees in the system lower, if possible.

Is it unfair to deny an infected person boarding? Maybe, but I doubt anyone would be allowed on board any aircraft with a proven case of a notifyable infectious disease, masks or no masks.

What you say is fair - not taking someone confirmed with a notifiable disease - but the point of difference/unfairness is making someone take a test to, say, take a repatriation flight home (not like in Australia where the current general practice is to test when symptoms arise) - setting aside potential issues of false positive/old positive, which don't seemingly get resolved quickly.

The unfairness to me is also related to how long some of these Aussies (and their families) had hardship in getting suitable flights home.

PS I did mean to say the 14 day quarantine is considered (by the public health experts) as foolproof/gold standard - am already aware of cases in Australia and NZ arising after the 14 day period.

PPS Of course the risk isn't just on the flight - unless I misunderstood, this was raised upthread as a point/reason for pre-tests (ie to reduce the risk in flight).

Anyway, its just my point of view.....

 

[Toula92122]

Personally as someone who did come back to Oz on a regular flight, I am not a fan of the idea of having to get a negative CV test pre flight. I don't think there is appreciation as to how difficult that would be to get in some countries, coming from the US I would have struggled to produce that bit of paper. Even on the flight, I was not stressed about getting CV from other passengers as I kept my mask on for the majority of the 14 hours on the plane, only briefly taking it off to eat or drink. I changed my mask regularly. I was diligent about hygiene after bathroom use etc. There seems to be a lot of debate about the hotel quarantine as well which I do not understand how the process could be spreading the virus. Only people I saw or interacted with during the 14 days were medical staff for CV tests and police on day 13 to discuss departure. At times, to me, it feels like there is an over reaction in Oz to cases of CV that are identified in quarantine hotels. However, I do strongly belief that the hotel quarantine system needs to continue even though I would prefer home quarantine. I was a member of some FB groups for Australians in quarantine and based on some comments that were made, my take was given the opportunity rules would have been breached in a heartbeat.

 

[Lynda2475]

Wrt ability to get a test I was of the understanding proposal is to use the rapid saliva tests and test at the airport as partof check in. The rapid tests are beng used now for daily testing of quarantine staff hotel and in europe these are offered at airports.

You'd still get swab tests on day 2 and 12.

 

[Pushka]

Only people I saw or interacted with during the 14 days were medical staff for CV tests and police on day 13 to discuss departure.

It was the poor ventilation in Peppers Hotel in Adelaide that saw the most recent scare last month. The security guy had no personal contact whatsoever with the UK person who had it, other than be in duty in that corridor. He then moved to a different floor as part of his duties and then he infected a couple from Nepal who were quarantining there. That then spread to a cleaner and the cleaners family and created the Pooraka cluster that closed SA down. Everyone in quarantine then had to spend another 14 days from that date. A few were about to be released but had to stay there for an additional period.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

It was the poor ventilation in Peppers Hotel in Adelaide that saw the most recent scare last month. The security guy had no personal contact whatsoever with the UK person who had it, other than be in duty in that corridor. He then moved to a different floor as part of his duties and then he infected a couple from Nepal who were quarantining there. That then spread to a cleaner and the cleaners family and created the Pooraka cluster that closed SA down. Everyone in quarantine then had to spend another 14 days from that date. A few were about to be released but had to stay there for an additional period.

Question: so it’s confirmed it went from Nepalese family to cleaner via A/C, or from cleaning their room?

 

[Pushka]

Question: so it’s confirmed it went from Nepalese family to cleaner via A/C, or from cleaning their room?

They can’t seem to work out how the cleaner got it. But they did say the security guy passed it to the Nepalese family.

 

[drron]

Impossible just from genomics to say the virus went security guy - Nepalese family - cleaner or security guy - Nepalese family and cleaner.
Security vision may or may not help.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

NSW worker, sole job driving international crew to and from airport is positive.

Symptoms on Saturday, positive confirmed 7am today (if the blitz reporting is correct)

 

[jakeseven7]

NSW worker, sole job driving international crew to and from airport is positive.

Symptoms on Saturday, positive confirmed 7am today (if the blitz reporting is correct)

Lets hope NSW throws 3 rings around everyone stat so this doesn’t derail Xmas for folks.

 

[Pushka]

Impossible just from genomics to say the virus went security guy - Nepalese family - cleaner or security guy - Nepalese family and cleaner.
Security vision may or may not help.

The only link they could establish was work patterns. They reviewed days and days of security vision and the only link they could establish is the work activity of the security guy. They could not determine how the cleaner got it.

 

[nutwood]

The only link they could establish was work patterns. They reviewed days and days of security vision and the only link they could establish is the work activity of the security guy. They could not determine how the cleaner got it.

That is concerning and effectively casts doubt on the whole hotel process. If you can't locate the leak, you can't fix the leak!

 

[lovetravellingoz]

I was a member of some FB groups for Australians in quarantine and based on some comments that were made, my take was given the opportunity rules would have been breached in a heartbeat.

As has been demonstrated time again from the Portsea Couple to the SA Essential Worker who "guested" a 20 year old female in his isolation hotel (no real security) thus sparking the Thebarton Cluster and sending over a thousand people in isolation, or even to the ADF member in NSW who "guested" a lady in his quarantine hotel room overnight despite there meat to have been security.