AFF Member in Mid-Air Medical Emergency

[Sprucegoose]

Hey All.

I was in J and at the beginning of the meal service when I was offered a choice of Nuts or Olives I mentioned to the FA that I had an anaphylactic allergy to nuts.

Yes I AM VERY thankful to Qantas for doing the emergency landing in Sydney. I am also thankful that Qantas got me onto a flight this afternoon back to Melbourne.

HOWEVER...... I am well aware of my allergies and how to manage them. I ALSO ask EVERY time a menu is unclear. The meal I had was lamb shanks and made NO mention of nuts but I did ask the FA.

I have an ICE card in my wallet containing details of my allergies AND I also have it written on my epipen holder.

A Qantas Dr has been in contact with my partner twice and late this afternoon confirmed the meal contained "pine nuts" which was not disclosed on the menu.

Glad to hear you are better Bossreggie. Not a pleasant experience. A family member has the same issues and they avoid food altogether or just eat fruit. The front line staff either dont now or cant be relied upon to accurately understand the importance of these seemingly 'innocent' questions.

We assume all meals not prepared by ourselves has nuts or traces of nuts, especially when the downside is hospitalisation.

I believe even Virgin dont guarantee a nut free envionment these days after trying to do so for some time. It would be very hard to achieve with third party providers these days.

hope that provides another perspective.

SPRUCE

 

[medhead]

When an Australian citizen is potentially going to die, it is sickening to think that a petty task such as handling immigration and finding a passport is more important than the imperative need to try and save a life. That's tantamount to manslaughter. Absolutely sickening thought.

Umm, not exactly they would have to die to be manslaughter

They could have pulled off most of the info they needed by paging ground and quoting any detail on the manifest. If they find you're an Australian citizen

Trouble is there have been plenty of case that show this is a massive "IF". Experience tells me they are likely to decide your illegal if you can't speak english, and being unconsious is not going to be any excuse.

 

[anat0l]

I believe even Virgin dont guarantee a nut free envionment these days after trying to do so for some time. It would be very hard to achieve with third party providers these days.

I don't believe anyone could realistically provide a nut free environment. I think Air Canada might be trying (me thinks they were ordered by the courts to do so), but I think they're on a fool's mission.

It's hard for me to appreciate what could be done better as someone without a food allergy, however I do believe at a minimum all crew should be aware (or made aware) of any possible allergens in the food served. Even if it means putting that information in the crew's guide to serving the food. Or they should do something very similar to many restaurant menus in Germany, where small annotations next to menu items provide an indication of possible allergen ingredients.

Umm, not exactly they would have to die to be manslaughter

Fine. Attempted manslaughter, then.

Trouble is there have been plenty of case that show this is a massive "IF". Experience tells me they are likely to decide your illegal if you can't speak english, and being unconsious is not going to be any excuse.

Fair enough. So can you imagine if precious seconds were to tick away for the OP if Immigration had been sickly stubborn to say, "This ambulance is going no where until we clear this passenger to enter Australia. I don't care that he is dying - no clearance, no entry."? Touch wood!

 

[oz_mark]

Fine. Attempted manslaughter, then.

Is there such a thing?

 

[anat0l]

Is there such a thing?

Well, what do you term the crime of subjecting someone who is hurt to further harm, but that can't be connected to intent on the part of the accused?

Whatever that is, if that isn't a crime, then the world is going to hell.

 

[repete]

Also very glad to hear all worked out in the end (including clearance to hospital!). As someone else who's always enjoyed flying, I now have a 'fear' to face when travelling with the family with a son who has a nut reaction. Thanfully it's at the level just below anaphylactic so should be treatable by medication we always carry with us... just hate the thought of a mid-air scenario as reported here.

Anyhow, I was just going to suggest what others may already know/do but about the option with Sing Air to call and request nut free meals. We are mid-way through a SYD-LHR return trip and could not find the option amongst all the choices with the online check-in system. When we called up though the call centre advised they could do it and that was reportedly what we were served all the way here.

Just in case anyone's in a similar position with Sing Air. Cheers.

 

[Cocitus23]

I have followed this thread with interest since the very first posting. My initial reaction was somewhat different to the comments coming in, and I thought it diplomatic to hold fire, given the distressing nature of the case. Knowing that I would be dining last Saturday night with a group of 8 doctors and frequent flyers, I printed out multiple copies of the original post, passed them around the table and asked for reactions. They echoed my own feelings almost exactly. In brief, we considered that Bossreggie was not taking sufficient responsibility for his own poor decision to eat the food. Only he knew how sensitive he was to nuts and how very conservative he had to be in making that decision. The flight attendant could not possibly have given a 'no nut' guarantee, just a best guess that there were no nuts. Yet an absolute guarantee was what Bossreggie needed. Mid-flight is not the place for a person with his condition to be making decisions based on optimistic wishes.
Comments made by my dining colleagues included:

• "This guy should take a good hard look at himself. His cavalier decision not only damn-near killed him, but it involved Qantas in huge cost, caused real anxiety to the crew, and created major inconvenience for 200 other passengers."
• "Gee, NZ to Melbourne is only a few hours. You are not going to die of hunger if you skip the meal. Why would a person who knows he has the condition take such a risk?"
• "Why doesn't he just take a brown bag with his own sandwich and some fruit?"
• "It's not Qantas who should be apologising to him, but he who should be apologising to Qantas and to each of his fellow passengers."

I concede that some of those comments are rather blunt. I notice that some posters, notably MunitalP, Cyclogensis and Sprucegoose, hinted at similar feelings, although couched in much more diplomatic language.
Heck, Bossreggie, we are all certainly glad you survived, but please, take your own brown bag and fruit on your future flights.

 

[bossreggie]

I must say I don't consider my actions "cavalier" by choosing to eat a meal. My allergic reaction, whilst SEVERE does not occur with only a TRACE of nuts. I am 41 years old and so far in my 1000+ flights have managed to avoid ANY allergic reaction. I am very mindful of what I eat and I always ask before eating anything. If I was given an answer which was uncertain then I would NOT eat anything. I also eat out regularly and so far have NEVER had to use my epipen.

I would consider myself to be very aware of my allergies and how to manage them which is evidenced by my lack of requiring any urgent medical attention for allergies in the 13 years prior to that flight.

The QANTAS Dr who has been following up on this matter, Whilst NOT admitting any liability has confirmed to me that the meal I was provided did indeed contain nuts although it was not stated on the menu OR the ingredients list provided by QF catering.

I have reached a confidential agreement with QANTAS which finalises this matter to my satisfaction.

 

[drron]

Bossreggie I also dont consider your actions cavalier as a medico,frequent flyer and who has travelled with a granddaughter with severe nut,egg and shellfish allergies who has had an ICU admission due to a reaction to what was listed in a menu as egg free ice cream.
The labelling laws are way too lax.Mrsdrron has a sensitivity to chilli,capsicum fortunately this only means severe nausea.On Tuesday she ordered a dish served on a pumpkin and asparagus risotto.It turned up with copious amounts of capsicum as well.

 

[anat0l]

There is a real problem with how to deal with preparing allergy free food, because some people are so sensitive that even a trace of the errant food will cause a severe reaction. (Hence the warnings like "This item was prepared on equipment that also processes nuts" and so on.) The same kind of restrictions would have to apply all the way... as the Qantas First Menu would put it... "from paddock to plate" (and the environment of the aircraft would have to be relatively allergy free, too!)

A real dilemma for any airline or any business, for that matter. How does one deal with it? Of course, not everyone is that sensitive.... (certainly not our OP, who really just needed to know that indeed the dish he had contained nuts.)


And to those of you that view the OP's actions as cavalier, the suggestions like "it's a 3 hr flight, he can go without food" just shows mild inconsideration of the OP and the issue at hand. If it were only that simple - "you can't guarantee that the food is allergy free, so don't eat" - but we know that is a dumb suggestion and doesn't address the problem.

 

[HardieBoys]

As someone who's attended a couple of medical calls in-flight, I think that comments about Bossreggie's culpability seem a little harsh. I think that a commonsense approach to risk management is not the same as elimination of all risk. Even if one were to attempt to eliminate risk by not eating, it's possible that inadvertent exposure may still occur, from utensils, crockery, pillows, bedding and seat cushions that have been inadequately cleaned. (Probably not in Bossreggie's case, but possibly in other people's cases of anaphylaxis.) If we were to extend the logic of 'don't eat', then the logic of 'don't touch', or alternatively, 'supervise all cabin cleaning', should also apply.