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[dodgeyhack]

A quick search of the ABN will suggest that it is not a community organisation by definition...

Personally the ABN doesn't tell me much, other than it has one. To me, It certainly feels like a community before anything else. Are you saying AFF does try to turn a profit?

 

[mannej]

Personally the ABN doesn't tell me much, other than it has one. To me, It certainly feels like a community before anything else. Are you saying AFF does try to turn a profit?

An ABN listed tells you the type of body the group/business is, so has more information available compared to what you imply.

Whilst I don't know exactly the owner's purpose for AFF, it isn't a NFP/Incorporated body to answer your question.

 

[TheRealTMA]

My view on this whole debate is simple - all organisations, even if mainly run by volunteers, need some cash. For a web-based entity such as AFF, the two main options are always going to be ads or membership fees.

I dislike ads, so I choose to pay the membership fee.

There's no problem with a site such as AFF having ads. And I pay an annual subscription as well. There's no problem in the company AFF making a profit, it's not a non profit community organisation (AFAIK).

However...

. There is a problem if it blocks users who protect their personal data using available technology in such a way that it makes the site unusable.

. There is a problem in the number of personal information trackers foisted on the unsuspecting reader in the background by AFF without specific permission of the reader.

. There is a problem when all the background garbage slows the site and imposes double the bandwidth on the reader. (ABT went this way and is almost unbearably slow without AdBlockPlus, Ghostery and other tech which return control to the end user.)

 

[juddles]

This thread has touched on a raw nerve it seems with some, or at least has brought out an underlying debate that I suspect is common to most such online forums/groups.

Each person has their own usage, but I suspect mine is not very different from many of the more enthusiastic members.

I probably spend almost an hour a day on this site, partly to learn tricks, partly to "socialise" from afar with intelligent people who share passion for travel, partly to see where I can "give back" to the AFF community by sharing my own experiences. It is my relaxation, my hobby. And I know that if I have a question, people will have me an answer/experience/tricks/advice on this forum of a quality that I could not dream about getting any other way.

For a yearly membership of $50 or whatever it is, this works out to 13 cents per hour. ABSOLUTE PEANUTS for what I gain from it in knowledge and enjoyment.

A few years ago, only due to this site, I managed to fly with my family in the "first" seats in that old beautiful Wunalla Dreaming 747 as we made our historic family move to South America. It was FANTASTIC! Wrangling those special seats is something my wife and children will never forget. I would never have achieved that without AFF knowledge.

Put a value on that? THOUSANDS $

Made me want to be a member (paid) for life.

And that was just one thing....

 

[russ]

Yes, but that value is being created by the users, not admin.I'm still not sure why there is need to charge for membership when there is an offer of free web hosting on the table. Even if that offer doesn't work out, the membership fee seems disproportionately high compared to the likely hosting costs.

 

[juddles]

I understand that some have some sort of ideological rejection of paying anything, but seriously, it comes down to the members needs. I do not post any of my experiences in the spirit of "paying" for my membership. That would, IMHO, reduce my enjoyment. Quite frankly, I value my time and knowledge so much more than an equivalence of membership fees that that concept pales into insignificance. I think we are all like that.

I see it in much more simple terms. I get to enjoy the site, impart and gain knowledge, and generally have fun, while at the same time I do not have to worry about all the things that make such a website viable. There are people that make this possible and I pay a tiny contribution. Could not be happier.

 

[samh004]

Yes, but that value is being created by the users, not admin.I'm still not sure why there is need to charge for membership when there is an offer of free web hosting on the table. Even if that offer doesn't work out, the membership fee seems disproportionately high compared to the likely hosting costs.

We get it, you don't want to pay/ don't see the value. Others do.

While the value might not be directly created by admin, he is providing the location. He has done since 1998. I wasn't a member in 1998 but I assume there were ads even back then, or at least some way to recoup costs.

 

[juddles]

....the membership fee seems disproportionately high compared to the likely hosting costs.....

I relate that sort of comment to an equivalent "I could have bought this steak in this restaurant for half the cost from Woolies"

 

[russ]

But this restaurant wants the patrons to bring their own steak but still charge for the steak.

 

[juddles]

No, this restaurant encourages allcomers to mingle and have a good time.

 

[mannej]

But this restaurant wants the patrons to bring their own steak but still charge for the steak.

You forget that the cost of membership also opens up discounts for travel related product/services, so that dilutes your analogy here to a degree.

 

[TheRealTMA]

We get it, you don't want to pay/ don't see the value. Others do.

While the value might not be directly created by admin, he is providing the location. He has done since 1998. I wasn't a member in 1998 but I assume there were ads even back then, or at least some way to recoup costs.

hosting costs max of $100 pa... (I'll host it for less.)
Sure admin has a right to make money but it seems to be bordering on excessive...
The obsession with ads will destroy the whole concept of the AFF community who willingly volunteer their content.

No, this restaurant encourages allcomers to mingle and have a good time.

No it doesn't. It's just started to put a sign on the door that you will not be allowed entry unless you bring your own steak and your own chef.

 

[samh004]

hosting costs max of $100 pa... (I'll host it for less.)
Sure admin has a right to make money but it seems to be bordering on excessive...
The obsession with ads will destroy the whole concept of the AFF community who willingly volunteer their content.

I don't believe there has been any increase in ads?

I think this argument that you'll (and anyone else) will host it for less or free is getting old. If you have a legitimate offer you should perhaps get in touch with admin privately instead of twittering on with it here. This thread is off topic.

 

[frankie]

No it doesn't. It's just started to put a sign on the door that you will not be allowed entry unless you bring your own steak and your own chef.

I really fail to see how putting up a notification that essentially says please don't take away what helps support us is the same as not encouraging users to mingle and have a good time.

 

[TheRealTMA]

I don't believe there has been any increase in ads?

I think this argument that you'll (and anyone else) will host it for less or free is getting old. If you have a legitimate offer you should perhaps get in touch with admin privately instead of twittering on with it here. This thread is off topic.

Moderators should not personally attack the poster. Argue the point with rational logic, not the poster. Hosting is a trivial cost to running a site, as anyone with tech knowledge knows.

 

[admin]

OK. Time to close this thread.

It's had a good run for the last few days and the full range of opinions of our members is here for all to see. Not sure what more can be added without going off topic.