Is it the job of airport security to weigh passenger's cabin baggage?

[ozbeachbabe]

This morning SO was going through the security screening point at BNE Domestic terminal (QF end) when one of the security people picked up his carry on then passed it to a colleague and asked them to weigh it.

As it was 12 kilos he was told by security than he could only have 7 kilos & he had to go back and check it in. Anyone who travels regularly ex BNE would appreciate that news like that would go down like a lead balloon.

Fortunately it was still outside baggage close off time however I know there are some AFFers who like sailing through security at the last minute so this might be a potential problem for them if inside 30 minutes prior to departure.

Whilst he didn't know exactly how heavy the bag was, for the past 6 months he has travelled every fortnght ex BNE with the same stuff which is paperwork and contracts to do with the building of a house ie things not easily replaceable, & at no time as security ever done his before.

My point is that is it really the job of airport security to take it upon themselves to be hand luggage naz_s?

Suppose you're travelling with JQ who allow 10 kilos of carry on? Try winning that argument with security "no it's got to be 7 kilos, you'll need to check it in". Too bad if you were on a JQ lite fare that doesn't include checked luggage.

I guess the way around this situation in the future is to have another carry on bag inside the first one that you can whip out and divide the contents equally between both assuming of course this will satisfactory for airport security.

 

[Aussie_flyer]

sometimes they do it at MEL Intl departures as well, I find it quite ridiculous as how on earth does security know about every airline that departs MEL carry-on baggage restrictions (which can vary based on class of service). It's ridiculous! Fortunately if you have an express departures card they tend to leave you alone a bit more.

 

[djfuzz]

sometimes they do it at MEL Intl departures as well, I find it quite ridiculous as how on earth does security know about every airline that departs MEL carry-on baggage restrictions (which can vary based on class of service). It's ridiculous! Fortunately if you have an express departures card they tend to leave you alone a bit more.

Sometimes not even then - they used to leave me alone when I had a J BP but these days even that doesn't seem to deter them. And they have a bit of a stick up their ars*s about the second bags too. It doesn't seem to bother them that you're under the total allowance per your airline or class. If they feel snarky, you've pretty much got to repack into the two bags in front of them and have them both weighed. Naturally, you'll probably have to repack again for convenience once you passed security.

So my position would be an emphatic NO! Let the airlines enforce their own carry on regs at the gate. Frankly the airports should be spending their shareholders' money elsewhere, like improving their god-awful pickup and parking arrangements.

 

[rwatts]

So my position would be an emphatic NO! Let the airlines enforce their own carry on regs at the gate. Frankly the airports should be spending their shareholders' money elsewhere, like improving their god-awful pickup and parking arrangements.

I thought at some (at least) airports the security screening people were contracted by the airlines.

Richard.

 

[Will]

In the case of BNE domestic, simply tell the security officer you aren't travelling - simply visiting the lounge, or buying lunch at the noodle shop

At international, you could say you have a friend/husband/wife etc who is already through security and is going to receive an item from you (of significant weight )

Otherwise, I think I would probably ask to speak to a supervisor. Not their right to restrict access based on weight of bags (I have previously referenced the statutory regulations delineating their powers, don't have time to find it again at the moment, sorry)

 

[docjames]

Otherwise, I think I would probably ask to speak to a supervisor. Not their right to restrict access based on weight of bags (I have previously referenced the statutory regulations delineating their powers, don't have time to find it again at the moment, sorry)

Please post if you can find it later - this is one of my annoyances - the airline is responsible, not the security who should be worrying about prohibited items, not carryon weights.

Note a BNE you could always try your luck and go through another screening point.

 

[Dave Noble]

I am all for the cabin baggage limits being enforced and the security checkpoint is the best place to do it imo. Avoids people "hiding" the luggage from check in staff and the overhead of having it dealt with by the boarding staff

I would be most happy to see weight and size limits being enforced.

If the person had a 12Kg hand baggage , it was overlimit

 

[markis10]

Please post if you can find it later - this is one of my annoyances - the airline is responsible, not the security who should be worrying about prohibited items, not carryon weights.

Note a BNE you could always try your luck and go through another screening point.

The airport is responsible for providing a screen service under Aviation Transport Security Regulations 2005 which requires a screening point to ensure all passengers beyond that point have met ALL regulations and requirements for them to board the aircraft. This includes airline policies in respect to articles to be carried onboard in terms of prohibited/dangerous items by content, dimension or weight. Cabin baggage exceeding the designated limits set by each airline is considered dangerous goods under the said act.

The screening point is empowered to police all laws and policys in effect for boarding an aircraft.

 

[Aussie_flyer]

I am all for the cabin baggage limits being enforced and the security checkpoint is the best place to do it imo. Avoids people "hiding" the luggage from check in staff and the overhead of having it dealt with by the boarding staff

I would be most happy to see weight and size limits being enforced.

If the person had a 12Kg hand baggage , it was overlimit

I am more talking about the fact that each airline has its own set of rules and there is no way on earth those security people know about each and every one, particularly as some airlines allow multiple items for premium pax.

It should be up to the airline either enforcing it at check-in or during boarding.

 

[SeaWolf]

Note a BNE you could always try your luck and go through another screening point.

That's probably what I'd do, or try the "I'm not travelling today" line. There's little point in getting into an argument with security, they certainly don't see themselves as customer service and you as customer, you're a suspect in their eyes. I tend to try and just work around these problems rather than confronting them, so the "Not travelling" line would seem the ideal way to go. Then go and file a complaint card later on.

 

[simongr]

I would be most happy to see weight and size limits being enforced.

Dave you have made this comment before. Whilst I understand your wish for the size and number to be enforced I am not sure why the weight is such a concern to you. Have you ever been injured by an overweight carry on?

I am as concerned about the loose duty free spirits as I am about a heavy rollaboard above me - except the rollaboard is less likely to roll out of overhead onto my head...

 

[Will]

@markis10:

From Aviation Transport Security Regulations 2005:

4.04

(2) The things that are to be detected by screening are:
(a) on a person, or in a person’s belongings, or in stores
entering a sterile area — weapons and prohibited items;
and
(b) in checked baggage — explosives.

Where a prohibited item is defined under subsection 1.07
Includes such items as:

Sporting goods, kitchen utensils, tools, and other things with
sharp edges or points capable of injuring a person
Axes, hatchets and similar things
Metal cutlery
Open razors
Sharp things that are not weapons, but are capable (with or
without modification) of causing harm by penetration
Blunt things able to be used to bludgeon or threaten to bludgeon
a person
Things capable of being used to restrain a person and not
otherwise permitted under the Act or these Regulations

I can't see where it authorises or empowers the screening point to ensure all regulations are followed.

Happy to be shown wrong, if you can point me to the section concerned that provides that power, or that specifies overweight/oversize items as prohibited.

 

[markis10]

I am more talking about the fact that each airline has its own set of rules and there is no way on earth those security people know about each and every one, particularly as some airlines allow multiple items for premium pax.

It should be up to the airline either enforcing it at check-in or during boarding.

Each airline sets its own rules for dangerous goods as well as cabin baggage dimensions and weights, and it is up to the security people to know the differences by law, and lets use some common sense, I would be surprised if it could not easily be put down on two A4 pages at mostfor the airport with the biggest variety of airlines - Sydney International .

 

[markis10]

@markis10:

From Aviation Transport Security Regulations 2005:





Where a prohibited item is defined under subsection 1.07
Includes such items as:



I can't see where it authorises or empowers the screening point to ensure all regulations are followed.

Happy to be shown wrong, if you can point me to the section concerned that provides that power, or that specifies overweight/oversize items as prohibited.

That act defines the screening point and its powers and is referenced by other parts of aviation law in the context of this discussion such as the CAR's and CASR's, it defines the powers they have but should not be reference in isolation, as I mentioned they are required to enforce airline policies etc as well as other regs (CASR Part 92 in particular), note a screening authority has the same meaning as defined in the Air Navigation Act 1920.

 

[medhead]

Each airline sets its own rules for dangerous goods as well as cabin baggage dimensions and weights, and it is up to the security people to know the differences by law, and lets use some common sense, I would be surprised if it could not easily be put down on two A4 pages at mostfor the airport with the biggest variety of airlines - Sydney International .

Sorry but dangerous goods regulations are set nationally and internationally but government and multi government agencies not airlines. The only say an airline (or pilot) has is to decide whether or not they will carry dangerous goods.

You say that carry on luggage is classed as dangerous goods under some act. Which act? Because there is no provision under the ADG code to arbitrarily classify something as dangerous goods that isn't dangerous goods. In fact it is prohibited to falsely classify something as dangerous goods.

 

[drron]

Why I always carry a jacket.books etc go in the pockets when this happens-only once so far.

 

[markis10]

Sorry but dangerous goods regulations are set nationally and internationally but government and multi government agencies not airlines. The only say an airline (or pilot) has is to decide whether or not they will carry dangerous goods.

Yes Governments do set a list of prohibited and dangerous goods, however an airline also has the power to set its on policies based on what it considers dangerous, for instance DJ does not consider a Cello to be dangrous while Qantas does and requires it to be checked in as oversize baggage?

Let me keep it simple for you, the government makes rules, airlines add to them, and the security screening point is the place the makes sure they are followed. If you dont think they are empowered to stop you then by all means confront them and report back (when you get access to AFF again, not sure internet access is provided in lock ups) .

 

[markis10]

Dave you have made this comment before. Whilst I understand your wish for the size and number to be enforced I am not sure why the weight is such a concern to you. Have you ever been injured by an overweight carry on?

Have a read of the ATSB report on the QF incident over WA and think about what might happen with much heavier baggage floating around in such an environment, once airborne there is nothing to prevent that heavy bag not being in the locker! A 20Kg bag hitting you in such an environment would have the same effect as a 100kg bag on the ground depending on the g forces at hand.

 

[djfuzz]

Have a read of the ATSB report on the QF incident over WA and think about what might happen with much heavier baggage floating around in such an environment, once airborne there is nothing to prevent that heavy bag not being in the locker! A 20Kg bag hitting you in such an environment would have the same effect as a 100kg bag on the ground depending on the g forces at hand.

markis10 - Your point is well taken, the limits are there for a reason. However, I think the question raised in the OP is whether airport security should be enforcing them.

Your earlier post notes that under CASR Part 92 requires security screeners to enforce airline policies - I was under the impression that related to dangerous goods only?

To be honest, IMHO it ultimately makes little difference where it's enforced - it's an inconvenience, but there are plenty worse (such as being an AA PLT / OWS who is turned away from the Dom J lounge ).

 

[markis10]

markis10
Your earlier post notes that under CASR Part 92 requires security screeners to enforce airline policies - I was under the impression that related to dangerous goods only?

To be honest, IMHO it ultimately makes little difference where it's enforced - it's an inconvenience, but there are plenty worse (such as being an AA PLT / OWS who is turned away from the Dom J lounge ).

CASR 92 deals with Airport security entirely including dangerous goods, airside access etc, I read it as empowering the security point to police all policies in place for passengers and what they can take on board, others may and probably will disagree . Until airports are prepared to put gate screening in place for all flights and we are prepared to pay for it in our airfares as part of that airports security charge, then I dont see how it could be done better or cheaper.

I long for the pre 2001 days when the world was an easier place to move in, sadly those days are long gone, along with some freedoms we took for granted.!