OWE Rule Check - Land Sector

[Homer]

I suspect my TA is right about this but as it will cause me some pain I just wanted to double-check...

As part of my upcoming DONE4/status run I am doing ...LHR-DXB-LHR-FCO-(land sector)-VCE-LGW...

Now I counted that as 4 Europe sectors, however my TA has pointed out that the land sector counts as a sector, even though I am making my own arrangements on this sector.

As I said, I suspect she is right, but I would be grateful if any OWE rules experts cared to weigh in...

 

[Homer]

I believe I have answered my own question. I found this on the OneWorld site:

• You can fly up to 16 flight segments on your trip. Travel between two airports by surface transportation will count as one flight segment.

So rather than buy an extra Europe segment just so I can accumulate miles/status by hopping over to DXB, I think I will just cancel the DXB trip. Marge wasn't very keen on it anyway...

 

[NM]

The surface segment counts as a segment towards the total itinerary count of a maximum of 16 segments. It does not count towards the maximum of 4 included segments for the continent of Europe. The continent segment count (max of 4 everywhere except north America which is a max of 6) only include flight segments.

 

[Homer]

The surface segment counts as a segment towards the total itinerary count of a maximum of 16 segments. It does not count towards the maximum of 4 included segments for the continent of Europe. The continent segment count (max of 4 everywhere except north America which is a max of 6) only include flight segments.

NM you are a guru! Thank you!

 

[codash1099]

The surface segment counts as a segment towards the total itinerary count of a maximum of 16 segments. It does not count towards the maximum of 4 included segments for the continent of Europe. The continent segment count (max of 4 everywhere except north America which is a max of 6) only include flight segments.

Does it apply when two airports are in the same city? For example, arrive at JFK but depart from LGA?

 

[NM]

Does it apply when two airports are in the same city? For example, arrive at JFK but depart from LGA?

Yes, it does. Once upon a time you could have the ticket issued using city names like LON or NYC, but the segments had to be OPEN and not dated. But the LON or NYC would be changed to LHR, LGW, FFK, LGA, EWR etc when the OPEN segment was dated and confirmed for a specific flight. So now it seems they insist on an a specific airport being included and two diff airport identifiers means a surface segment

 

[serfty]

Rules are clear: Surface segments:

• count against the 16 total segment limit, and
• do not count against the continental limit.

This is also specifically reflected in the xONEx rules:

...
4. FLIGHT APPLICATION/ROUTINGS
...

(h)

A minimum of 3 and maximum of 16 segments, including surface segments between any 2 airports, are permitted for the entire journey. Free flight segments within each continent are limited as follows:

Africa 4
Asia 4
Europe / Middle East 4 ...
North America 6
South America 4
South West Pacific 4
​

...​

Note: "... Free flight segments ..." - no mention of Surface segment in the continental limits.

BTW, Homer; What benefit are you getting for the additional cost of employing a TA?

 

[NM]

BTW, Homer; What benefit are you getting for the additional cost of employing a TA?

Obviously a full and thorough explanation of the fare rules .

Some of us have no choice but to book through a TA for business travel.

 

[Homer]

BTW, Homer; What benefit are you getting for the additional cost of employing a TA?

Not a heck of a lot serfty, to be frank. But there is no direct(ly identifiable by me) cost for the TA - it's part of the American Express Centurion service - and I have found it helpful to have her check flight loadings, hold seats, advise on connection times, etc.

 

[serfty]

Fair enough ... It would be interesting to compare how much they come up at the Nett fare against what could otherwise be booked. If you can give an idea of your routing including stopovers (no dates), I'll try out an estimate.

 

[docjames]

Fair enough ... It would be interesting to compare how much they come up at the Nett fare against what could otherwise be booked. If you can give an idea of your routing including stopovers (no dates), I'll try out an estimate.

Yes, that would be interesting. Please post up results! (even a net difference if homer doesnt want the actual costs posted please)

 

[Homer]

Fair enough ... It would be interesting to compare how much they come up at the Nett fare against what could otherwise be booked. If you can give an idea of your routing including stopovers (no dates), I'll try out an estimate.

Sure, thanks for the offer serfty. I hope this is what you need:

SYD-EZE-(Stop, but we are also doing AEP-IGR return as part of a separate Visit South America fare because it would be too many South American sectors to include it in the DONE4)-LIM-CUZ-(Stop, but we are doing CUZ-JUL again as part of the Visit SA fare, this land sector also counts towards the total 16)-JUL-LIM-EZE-LHR-DXB-(Stop)-LHR-FCO-(Stop, land sector which finishes up in Milan and counts towards the total 16)-LIN-LHR-SIN-NRT-(Stop)-HKG-(Stop)-SYD

I make that 16 sectors plus 3 sectors in the Visit South America pass (which is the minimum you can do apparently).

 

[serfty]

OK, I make the DONE4 out to be:

SYD-EZE-xLIM-CUZ,JUL-xLIM-xEZE-xLHR-DXB-xLHR-FCO,LIN-xLHR-xSIN-NRT-HKG-SYD

,=Surface x=Transit (<24H)

 

[Homer]

OK, I make the DONE4 out to be:

SYD-EZE-LIM-CUZ,JUL-xLIM-xEZE-xLHR-xDXB-LHR-FCO,LIN-xLHR-xSIN-xNRT-HKG-SYD

,=Surface x=Transit (<24H)

I missed some stops in my earlier post but using your method (which is far more elegant):

SYD-EZE-xLIM-CUZ,JUL-xLIM-xEZE-xLHR-DXB-xLHR-FCO,LIN-LHR-xSIN-NRT-HKG-SYD

 

[serfty]

Using QF to EZE:

Adult traveller(s)

Airline Fuel Surcharge               1,369.90 AUD
Tax description unavailable (UBCO)      98.40 AUD
Hong Kong Air Passenger Departure Tax   24.90 AUD
Tax description unavailable (SWAE)      36.40 AUD
Tax description unavailable (QODP)      16.00 AUD
Airline Insurance Surcharge             37.20 AUD
Tax description unavailable (EXAE)       4.30 AUD
Tax description unavailable (ITEB)      11.00 AUD
Tax description unavailable (HBCO)       9.30 AUD
Multiple Surcharges                     12.50 AUD
Australian Passenger Service Charge     42.84 AUD
Tax description unavailable (DYAE)      24.00 AUD
Tax description unavailable (TQSE)       4.00 AUD
Tax description unavailable (YRCB)      25.00 AUD
Tax description unavailable (AEAD)      12.50 AUD
Tax description unavailable (VTSE)       3.80 AUD
Tax description unavailable (MJAD)       1.20 AUD
UK Passenger Service Charge             49.20 AUD
Australia Passenger Movement Charge     47.00 AUD
                                        
                                     1,829.44 AUD
                      x 1 Adult(s) = 1,829.44 AUD

Base fare is $9,906.00 -> $11,735.44

Those fuel fines are Huge!

 

[Homer]

Base fare is $9,906.00 -> $11,735.44

Those fuel fines are Huge!

Yeah they sure are - and I'm paying for them three times over...

My TA has quoted $10,999 per person plus taxes TBA.

 

[NM]

Yeah they sure are - and I'm paying for them three times over...

My TA has quoted $10,999 per person plus taxes TBA.

Sounds like they have not included the current 10% discount for OneWorld products due to their 10 year birthday, available for 10 weeks. Might be worth asking them about it. Have a look here.

 

[Homer]

Sounds like they have not included the current 10% discount for OneWorld products due to their 10 year birthday, available for 10 weeks. Might be worth asking them about it. Have a look here.

I sure will! It looks as though this has just been announced in the past few days so I guess my TA's system may not have been updated and/or the itinerary that she has emailed me may require some sort of manual refresh to update the price (because we have been working on this for about three weeks). But if you hadn't told me about this then I am not confident that I would have been offered the discount anyway...so thanks again!

 

[serfty]

I'm assuming Homer's using the 10% sale by ticketing before April 12.

Now booking the First Segment as the LA4517 codeshare on QF metal (SYD-EXE) has a dramatic effect:

Now quoted in USD:

Base : USD6264.00 (~AUD 9,850)
 +++ : USD 241.55 (~AUD   375)
Total: USD6505.55 (~AUD10,225)

 

[serfty]

LAN +++ Quote (booking with 1st Segment a LAN Code share on QF metal):

Adult traveller(s)
Tax description unavailable (UBCO)      60.56 USD
Hong Kong Air Passenger Departure Tax   15.48 USD
Tax description unavailable (SWAE)      22.76 USD
Tax description unavailable (QODP)      10.00 USD
Tax description unavailable (EXAE)       2.63 USD
Tax description unavailable (ITEB)       6.82 USD
Tax description unavailable (HBCO)       5.73 USD
Australian Passenger Service Charge     28.86 USD
Tax description unavailable (DYAE)      15.00 USD
Tax description unavailable (TQSE)       2.50 USD
Tax description unavailable (AEAD)       8.17 USD
Tax description unavailable (VTSE)       2.30 USD
Tax description unavailable (MJAD)       0.74 USD
UK Passenger Service Charge             30.28 USD
Australia Passenger Movement Charge     29.72 USD
                                       241.55 USD
                        x 1 Adult(s) = 241.55 USD