Avianca LM, 28 Degrees card charge back - problem

[RooFlyer]

An important word of caution for LM users. Don't have your bank charge back anything related to an Avianca issued ticket! If anyone else had had similar experience, i'd like to hear about it, because at the moment I have a problem.

Last December booked an itinerary using LM, involving Asiana and Turkish, paying the fees with a 28 Degrees MC.

About the same time, I saw some strange US$1.00 charges on my 28 Degrees card, so queried them; the agent agreed they were problematic so reversed them, pending query which of course came back no reply.

A couple of weeks later i got an e-mail from 28 Degrees, saying that my charge back to Avianca was unsuccessful, and they attached the reply from Avianca showing that the charges were legit.

Of course they were - I never queried them. I called 28 Degrees to enquire what was going on and they agreed there was a stuff up, but no harm done (it seemed).

A week later I called Turkish to do seat selection. The agent told me the booking was 'locked by your travel agent' - meaning Avianca.

I e-mailed 'support' at Avianca, quoting the PNR and asking if there was a problem.

Boy, was there a problem.

The e-mails were very odd at first, not making much sense (telling me I had to contact my 'bank'), but then they said that the ticket was cancelled!! I phone immediately and the agent, who of course is on the LM booking side, couldn't help me much - saying I had to deal with 'support'; and they couldn't transfer me to anyone there.

A few more e-mails to 'support' (including me sending a screenshot of my card statement showing that the fee was paid, reversed and paid again, same day); then they said bank had charged back the fee, and notwithstanding it was re-instated same day (consecutive on my statement), the ticket is cancelled at that point. I called again, and someone in the phone side said they would 'escalate' it.

I then called Asiana, who allowed me to select seats and saw nothing wrong with the booking.

'Support' have e-mailed again, saying I have to take it up with the bank.

So, at the moment I'm in limbo. The tickets may be OK, but need action on LM part to unlock the Turkish tickets, at least. 'Support' seem pretty useless, but I will persevere.

I haven't made any binding arrangements at the other end of the flights, so I think my best outcome would be if Avianca cancels the tickets and refunds me the points and (maybe) the cash. A bit less travel this year which frankly would not be a bad thing.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The key here is whether you have a valid ticket number, and whether the ticket number is against your TK and OZ flights. If you have a ticket number you should, in theory, be ok... at least for now while they sort things out. (A ticket can be cancelled at any time through 'no payment'.) Being able to select seats on OZ is no indicator, by itself, that there is a valid ticket number.

Were the $1 charges billed or pending? I'm assuming they were actually billed and appeared on your statement rather than the 'grey' space? Mine always sit in the grey space and drop off after a few days.

LM is one of the companies that does a 'test' $1 transaction on cards. Either way, even if they had billed you, I would have advised against doing a chargeback with someone like LM - the risk is that they will cancel the ticket if they suspect there is any problem with the card. And trying to get it re-instated can be a problem.

Will be interesting to see how you go on this.

 

[RooFlyer]

Thanks. The $1 charges were not Avianca. 28 degrees decided themselves, for some reason, to do the Avianca charge back. They admitted in the phone that it was a mistake.

Yes, I have a valid ticket number, full e-ticket etc. While that, and what Asiana etc say sounds good, Im not going to risk making all my trip arrangements, then turn up at the airport and be denied boarding.

So my best outcome at the moment is to have it formally cancelled and to get my points back.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Yeah. That sucks. Sounds like 28 Degrees are in error here. Don't understand how they did a charge-back when you didn't request one.

Perhaps a final email to LM support asking for the status of your ticket might be in order?

 

[Mattg]

The key lesson here for me is to contact my bank before making LifeMiles purchases.

Hope it gets resolved quickly for you.

 

[RooFlyer]

Perhaps a final email to LM support asking for the status of your ticket might be in order?

That's how the current email exchange started. Just an enquiry to confirm status ( after Turkish said the ticket was 'locked' - I didn't know what the issue was at that stage). It went downhill from there.

 

[RooFlyer]

The key lesson here for me is to contact my bank before making LifeMiles purchases.

Hope it gets resolved quickly for you.

That sounds fine, but with offshore call centres, there is the risk that they will turn your proactive call into a 'problem, I want a charge back'. That's what happened to me. It was the $1 fraud testers that I queried, and they turned that into an Avianca charge back!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

That sounds fine, but with offshore call centres, there is the risk that they will turn your proactive call into a 'problem, I want a charge back'. That's what happened to me. It was the $1 fraud testers that I queried, and they turned that into an Avianca charge back!

Were the fraud testers actually billed? not just pending? very strange

 

[potm]

It’s not just Avianca, a lot of companies do test $1 charges. It is completely normal. Only ever query them if it’s from a company you have not given your card details to.

 

[RooFlyer]

It’s not just Avianca, a lot of companies do test $1 charges. It is completely normal. Only ever query them if it’s from a company you have not given your card details to.

Agree. But the ones on my card were not Avianca. Completely different. It was 28 degrees charging back Avianca's fees and taxes charges, on different days, that caused the problem.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Agree. But the ones on my card were not Avianca. Completely different. It was 28 degrees charging back Avianca's fees and taxes charges, on different days, that caused the problem.

But were the $1 charges actually billed to your account? Or still pending?

if they were actual charges to your account you should probably cancel the card and get a new one as the same merchant might try again - not worth the hassle of having a card blocked.

 

[RooFlyer]

But were the $1 charges actually billed to your account? Or still pending?

if they were actual charges to your account you should probably cancel the card and get a new one as the same merchant might try again - not worth the hassle of having a card blocked.

I can't remember if they were charged or pending. But I got the card replaced. (I only mentioned the $1 charges thing as context as to why 28 Degrees then (mistakenly) challenged the legitimate Avianca charges.) Hmmm ... maybe the card replacement contributed to the Avianca thing - but the Avianca charges definitely got paid. Am still in discussion with Avianca, but its looking hopeful.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I can't remember if they were charged or pending. But I got the card replaced. (I only mentioned the $1 charges thing as context as to why 28 Degrees then (mistakenly) challenged the legitimate Avianca charges.) Hmmm ... maybe the card replacement contributed to the Avianca thing - but the Avianca charges definitely got paid. Am still in discussion with Avianca, but its looking hopeful.

Ah - the cancelled card could do it!

I had something similar with BA many years ago. Turned up at the airport and they called the police while I was standing at check in! I had reported the previous card lost and they thought they'd nabbed a thief! (It was all resoved and I got a free upgrade, which was nice.) But yeah, a cancelled card against a booking can lead to cancellation.

 

[RooFlyer]

Ah - the cancelled card could do it!

Maybe, but like I said, 28 Degrees reversed, then re instated the Avianca charges, same day. What I did after that should have no bearing on Avianca.

I think the ticket 'suspension' was automatic after the charge back, irrespective that it was subsequently paid. It's taken a while for me to clarify that 'cancellation' in one part of LifeMiles means suspension, and what I have to do to get it unsuspended.