Does anyone still think VA is superior?

[Bundy Bear]

Virgin is good to keep Qantas honest.

Virgin is easier to upgrade.
Row 3 as a Platinum was good.
Slightly easier to keep Gold 400SCs instead of 600SCs.
If you were flying to New Zealand then Virgin Gold was useful on Air New Zealand.
Priority boarding(Qantas it isn't that hard)
I found the Virgin lounges in Brisbane and Melbourne are better than the Qantas Brisbane and Melbourne lounges, ignoring the business lounges.
Option to choose the best fare and or timing if you could keep status with both.

 

[Dannyism]

VA is a HYBRID carrier, they are competing with both full service and low cost airlines. They have sensibly identified a gap in the Australian market, this is great strategy IMHO.

Hybrid offerings are the holy grail of strategic market segmentation, essentially offering 'good quality and low price' This website has a reasonable description.
Low Cost and Hybrid Airline Business » Prologis

Here is the 'but'....

VA's execution of this strategy is POOR!

 

[Marty_]

The thread title is based on a false premise that invites a certain tone of feedback. *Very* few people would ever have said VA was "superior."

That said, I flew both airlines weekly for some time in 2014 before choosing VA over QF for loyalty. It was mostly because of notably better service at the time.

Whilst VA have since had a couple of hiccups, I do find the snobbery against them a bit nauseating. Objective reasons for their supposed inferiority a rarely given. Recently I've done a few QF flights to make sure I'm not missing out on something amazing and well... I am not... They are very similar.

 

[Jack_OC]

Slightly easier to keep Gold 400SCs instead of 600SCs.

For a lot of people it's actually way easier to both reach and retain Gold or Platinum with VA - the thresholds with QF are significantly higher - 600 is 50% more than 400, for example. Additionally, family pooling means that some people don't even need to accrue anywhere the required number of SCs in their own right, so someone who can't make Silver with QF might make Gold with VA, and someone who can't reach Gold with QF might be able to reach Platinum with VA. Furthermore, SC earn with VA's international partners is in most cases much better than SC earn with QF's international partners. On the downside, VA's recent changes to SC earn on Getaway fares mean that some people will see their SC earn virtually cut in half, and for those people it might now actually be harder to retain status with VA than with QF. For example, if you can't take advantage of family pooling and you just fly MEL-SYD on the cheapest fares, you now need 40 return flights per year to retain Gold with VA compared to just 30 with QF. This is one of the many strange aspects of VA's shambolic recent changes - they've made it harder for people to retain status and devalued status at the same time.

I found the Virgin lounges in Brisbane and Melbourne are better than the Qantas Brisbane and Melbourne lounges, ignoring the business lounges.

I agree with that, but clearly the answer flips around if you can reach Platinum with QF and can therefore access the QF Business lounges (and First lounges when going overseas).

The biggest question for me is "what does status actually do for me?" and when it comes to VA Platinum, the answer is not very much compared to Gold with either QF or VA. So in summary, I would say if you don't fly enough to get to Gold with QF, but you can get to Gold (or Platinum) with VA, VA is probably a better option (assuming they try to stop exceeding fares charged by QF). However, if you can get to Gold or above with QF, then IMHO I don't see any compelling reason to make VA your go to airline any more.

 

[Jack_OC]

Whilst VA have since had a couple of hiccups, I do find the snobbery against them a bit nauseating. Objective reasons for their supposed inferiority a rarely given. Recently I've done a few QF flights to make sure I'm not missing out on something amazing and well... I am not... They are very similar.

The (free) food and drink served by VA is unquestionably inferior to that served by QF - in both Y and J IME.

That was fine by me when VA's fares were a lot cheaper, but it's certainly not ok with their current fares, which in many cases are now the same as or higher than QF's.

 

[njba]

To me, VA feels like a LCC with marketing that dramatically overpromises. That was OK when pricing was competitive but now they're often more expensive than QF.

The most accurate statement of affairs I've read.

 

[QF WP]

I still love VA over QF for the following reasons:

1. Family pooling - I am the only one that needs status, so we always go on family holidays with VA. That helps me maintain Gold and for some years in the past, achieve Plat (when my flying was greater)
2. Fly Ahead - after a trip away, I always want the flexibility of getting home early to be with my wife and kids. Had that on my last trip to SYD, I got home 4 hours early
3. Premium entry SYD - a godsend. I am normally HLO so getting through to the Lounge quickly is needed at the end of a trip there.
4. Staff - whilst I know staff on both sides in BNE, I have always found the VA staff friendlier. I used to get walked to my flights by the Lounge Manager as we continued our conversation. But not everyone gets to know staff as I have been able to do
5. Status level achievement - lower targets and a different way of calculating (rolling 12 months versus fixed period)
6. Points for upgrades - I buy Flexi economy where possible (with AFF sourced discounts codes) thus cost is less versus QF. Commensurately, getting upgrades to J cost less. I love Row 2 and am rarely not able to secure

I forgot to include:

7. Onboard meals (particularly C2C in J) - VA are hands-down better (just check the 2 threads on J meals).

 

[xtra]

I'm curious - for those who are platinum for both QF and VA, how many times have you been op-up on each provider?

I've never been op-uped on Virgin (not even when they launched J and promised to "surprise and delight") but am probably 1-in-10 on Qantas. They've tended to be on longer sectors.

 

[scwappy]

Having just flown coast to coast on both VA and QF, whilst both fantastic domestic products, VA was the winner for me, just slightly. Pre flight champagne offered, seat configuration much better for travelling with someone else, more regular top ups.

 

[Marty_]

The (free) food and drink served by VA is unquestionably inferior to that served by QF - in both Y and J IME.

I reject this comment insofar as it applies to J for the same reasons as scwappy - which accord with my experience and the experience I have read from other sources:

Having just flown coast to coast on both VA and QF, whilst both fantastic domestic products, VA was the winner for me, just slightly.

 

[Jack_OC]

I reject this comment insofar as it applies to J for the same reasons as scwappy - which accord with my experience and the experience I have read from other sources:

The new coast to coast J product with either QF or VA is indeed awesome (as long as you don't end up on a 737), but let's be honest, with either airline, that is not in the slightest bit representative of their domestic J product in general, never mind their Y product. If most of your flying is coast to coast J, then by all means base your assessment on this, but I suspect most of us aren't so lucky.

On shorter routes I've had extremely disappointing food and service from VA in J. I've also flown in J with VA on 737s from both MEL-PER and AKL-MEL, and both were pretty ordinary. In any case, the vast majority of my domestic travel is in Y, so I probably shouldn't have clouded the issue by mentioning J. You said there were no objective reasons why VA is inferior, so let's revise my comment as follows: "The (free) food and drink served by VA in Y is unquestionably inferior to that served by QF".

I don't think that's debatable, do you? QF offer fairly reasonable free meals in Y on many (most?) flights, plus free alcohol (usually at least 2 drinks) on every flight from 4pm onwards (earlier on some routes). With VA, at best you get a so-called "snack" and one free drink, but on departures after 7pm it's a case of getting your wallet out if you want anything other than water, tea or coffee to drink, and if you don't have time to eat before boarding you're almost certainly going home hungry.

 

[grounded]

I book travel for myself, my family and three interstate staff members.

With VA I can keep myself, the three interstates and my wife in SG.

If we flew QF, despite > 25k in annual company spend, none of us would have any status above silver (some only red).

So, service level doesn't really come into it - it's a binary decision.... SG or no SG.

I think this is probably true for lots of SMEs and that's the opportunity Virgin are addressing with the lower SG threshold family pooling.

IMHO Virgin flights can generally be had for less, and SG is easier to obtain... but there's no OW/ *A and when planes become unserviceable VA are very slow to find a replacement. QF do much better here.

Lack of alliance is a big drawback, but I always get a lounge even if via Amex Plat Charge.

I expect if VA were to join *A ,status and points upgrades wouldn't be as easy to obtain.

 

[GDSman]

I'm VA Plat (won't requalify) and QF LTG. For domestic I slightly favour VA over QF as timings out of HBA often suit me better and the direct flights to BNE are a huge advantage, in spite of no VA lounge in HBA.
International I use QF and then other OneWorld in most cases. NZ an exception.
Op ups - 1 ever with VA but a few with QF and other OW carriers over the years. I find I generally get a great welcome on a QFi flight and have been happy over the years - VA's lack of international network puts me off them...

 

[bullerdude]

I forgot to include:

7. Onboard meals (particularly C2C in J) - VA are hands-down better (just check the 2 threads on J meals).

In Y qantas wins hands down during breakfast/lunch/dinner windows as they actually service food.

J in more recent times I’ve had better meals on VA domestically when compared to Qantas.

 

[Marty_]

If most of your flying is coast to coast J, then by all means base your assessment on this, but I suspect most of us aren't so lucky.

I don't fly J on the east coast. Only transcon and international (mostly SYD > LAX and BNE > LAX). I would argue that I am not so lucky that my employer would let me book J for such short flights

You said there were no objective reasons why VA is inferior

To clarify - I said the VA hate is rarely substantiated with objective reasons. Not that there are none. I think that there are some objective reasons on which to base a critique.

so let's revise my comment as follows: "The (free) food and drink served by VA in Y is unquestionably inferior to that served by QF".

I accept this as an objective reason and a wholly accurate objective reason. I'd still want to ask - is the level of QF snobbery really warranted on this basis? I find the general similarity between the products offered on the whole to be out of step with the level of anti-VA sentiment getting around.

 

[straitman]

I accept this as an objective reason and a wholly accurate objective reason. I'd still want to ask - is the level of QF snobbery really warranted on this basis? I find the general similarity between the products offered on the whole to be out of step with the level of anti-VA sentiment getting around.

I agree totally. The products are very similar.

Sometimes QF crews are the happier ones and sometimes it's VA. Often the QF food is better but just when you think it's totally one sided VA pull one out of the bag and surprise us.

I really don't think there is that much in it.

 

[cove]

Yes straitman it is a very close contest in the two business class A330s that run coast to coast.

 

[Pleb Status]

I agree totally. The products are very similar.

Sometimes QF crews are the happier ones and sometimes it's VA. Often the QF food is better but just when you think it's totally one sided VA pull one out of the bag and surprise us.

I really don't think there is that much in it.

I disagree. The QF A330 J transcon service is structurally inferior to that provided by VA on their A330 J services.

I have travelled on both extensively over the past year (see the trip reports) and the gap is staggering.

http://www.australianfrequentflyer....s-and-trip-photos/va-qf-dom-a330-j-77007.html

The food is the biggest difference. It has been almost inedible at times on QF, menus change rarely (I have had the same one more than five times in a row) and the best QF can do for dessert is a Maggie Beer 'paddlepop' on MEL-PER.

The A330 J transcon service is definitely superior on VA without question...

 

[Cool Cat Phil]

I disagree. The QF A330 J transcon service is structurally inferior to that provided by VA on their A330 J services.

I have travelled on both extensively over the past year (see the trip reports) and the gap is staggering.

http://www.australianfrequentflyer....s-and-trip-photos/va-qf-dom-a330-j-77007.html

The food is the biggest difference. It has been almost inedible at times on QF, menus change rarely (I have had the exact one more than five times in a row) and the best QF can do for dessert is a Maggie Beer 'paddlepop' on MEL-PER.

The A330 J transcon service is definitely superior on VA without question...

Ok, now Lets discuss the Economy cabin as well, where the majority of Passengers sit. Not everyone can obviously afford to pay Business class fares or snare Award seats.

How does VA compare against QF on the A330 services in the economy cabin?

Please feel free to discuss...

 

[Marty_]

Ok. Food is usually not as good. Otherwise about the same on balance.

Already said that.