Unrestrained service dog

[RooFlyer]

Interesting experience yesterday. I was on Alaskan YVR-LAX in the F (AKA J) cabin, and the guy sitting next to me had a "service dog" with him (it said so on the jacket thingy the dog was wearing). The guy (in his 30s) didn't seem to be impaired at all, so I guess the dog was in training or something.

I couldn't identify the breed, but it was a 'medium' sized dog, maybe 20 to 30kg? It was a bit restless, but didn't bother me in the slightest. As we taxied out, it climbed up onto the guy's lap and snuggled down. Cute. It returned there for various periods during the flight.

But it wasn't restrained or 'buckled down' in any way; the FAs were walking past and definitely saw it, in fact they cooed over how cute the dog was.

As I said, it didn't bother me in the slightest, but I couldn't help wondering about the safety implications. We can't have anything bulky or heavy in our hands on take-off or landing as they could fly about and injure some-one in turbulence etc. But a 20 to 30kg dog seems OK. Strange.

BTW it wasn't terribly well trained. Several times it wandered down the aisle a little way and had to be retrieved; no-one was bothered except the guy sitting opposite the pax with the dog who didn't want it anywhere near him.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Interesting experience yesterday. I was on Alaskan YVR-LAX in the F (AKA J) cabin, and the guy sitting next to me had a "service dog" with him (it said so on the jacket thingy the dog was wearing). The guy (in his 30s) didn't seem to be impaired at all, so I guess the dog was in training or something.

I couldn't identify the breed, but it was a 'medium' sized dog, maybe 20 to 30kg? It was a bit restless, but didn't bother me in the slightest. As we taxied out, it climbed up onto the guy's lap and snuggled down. Cute. It returned there for various periods during the flight.

But it wasn't restrained or 'buckled down' in any way; the FAs were walking past and definitely saw it, in fact they cooed over how cute the dog was.

As I said, it didn't bother me in the slightest, but I couldn't help wondering about the safety implications. We can't have anything bulky or heavy in our hands on take-off or landing as they could fly about and injure some-one in turbulence etc. But a 20 to 30kg dog seems OK. Strange.

BTW it wasn't terribly well trained. Several times it wandered down the aisle a little way and had to be retrieved; no-one was bothered except the guy sitting opposite the pax with the dog who didn't want it anywhere near him.

Service dogs in the USA can cover a much wider range than we are used to here in Australia. You can have a service dog for 'anxiety' if you want, and can consequently carry those animals in the cabin with you. It is entirely possible (perhaps normal) that the person may appear fine, and it is also not unknown for people to designate their favourite pet as a 'service' animal just so they can carry them with them free of charge.

In general, my understanding was that largish dogs are often sat at a bulkhead, to restrain them in the event of an emergency. This is what i have seen in Australia for example. I guess even on the floor in a normal seat they would be restrained against the seat legs (but i would hope they are by a window so as not to impeded an evacuation).

 

[dalereardon]

This is an inssue very dear to my heart because I have a guide dog and travel with him quite regularly.

In Australia the airlines are entitled to ask for ID and proof of the dog's training / certification but normally just accept guide dogs when they are in harness.

There was actually an incident, last year I think, where rough turbulence coming into Sydney caused the guide dog to hit the roof of the Qantas or Qantas Link plane - can't remember which. Luckily the dog and the owner weren't seriously hurt and the airline to their credit helped with some follow up training to make sure the dog wasn't scared of flying.

In terms of wandering about the cabin that is just completely unacceptable. It is a privilege to have your dog on board and that is just not on. I would hope in Australia that you would be spoken to and behave from then on.

But you're right that with Qantas at least you aren't required to tether your dog. And you're right that we aren't allowed to sit in exit rows or obstruct exits. If you are in economy then the airline provides an extra seat for no charge and in business there is plenty of room.

Don't get me started with Jetstar though - they are an absolute nightmare to travel with and always muckup the booking and they absolutely hate having to give you another seat and often try to take it off you. I stick to Qantas whenever possible.

Dale.

 

[RooFlyer]

As I mentioned, I was relaxed about the whole thing, except thought it strange that the guy could have the dog on his lap, rather than confined to the floor. If I'm not allowed to have my laptop on my lap during take-off and landing because of its mass and the potential for it to become airborne during turbulence (witness you can have phones and tablets in your hands now during take-off, but not the larger stuff), then I reckon 30 or so kgs of animated biomass would be really bad news!

ps I didn't mention in the original post ... when the guy sitting adjacent to my neighbour (with the dog) objected to the dog wandering past, the dog owner really gave him a spray (normal voice tones, not loud) - f bombs and all. THAT I thought was going too far and I was waiting for the FA to intervene, but no. Everything calmed down pretty quick.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

As I mentioned, I was relaxed about the whole thing, except thought it strange that the guy could have the dog on his lap, rather than confined to the floor. If I'm not allowed to have my laptop on my lap during take-off and landing because of its mass and the potential for it to become airborne during turbulence (witness you can have phones and tablets in your hands now during take-off, but not the larger stuff), then I reckon 30 or so kgs of animated biomass would be really bad news!

ps I didn't mention in the original post ... when the guy sitting adjacent to my neighbour (with the dog) objected to the dog wandering past, the dog owner really gave him a spray (normal voice tones, not loud) - f bombs and all. THAT I thought was going too far and I was waiting for the FA to intervene, but no. Everything calmed down pretty quick.

When you say 'on his lap' and '30kg' what sort of dog are you talking about?

 

[RooFlyer]

When you say 'on his lap' and '30kg' what sort of dog are you talking about?

I've been trying to find a pic that matches ... can't find one that does the job (suspect cross breed / mongrel) When we were sitting, the back of the dog was level with my knees; head was higher. Even call it 20kg, as it was hairy; still a lot of mass if it became airborne! But again, its more the inconsistency in the safety message rather than the dog per se.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Someone on Flyertalk posted these pics of a service dog Max onboard an AA flight ORD/LAX. Poor fella needs a widebody jet so he can stretch out. I can't see how the F/A's could get the cart down the aisle as the dogs legs are too long not to stick out. There mustn't be any stipulation on what breeds can be service dogs but I guess it would be unfair to say that a Great Dane couldn't be because they might do a better job than one of those yappy little things in Prada handbags.

 

[mannej]

Someone on Flyertalk posted these pics of a service dog Max onboard an AA flight ORD/LAX. Poor fella needs a widebody jet so he can stretch out. I can't see how the F/A's could get the cart down the aisle as the dogs legs are too long not to stick out. There mustn't be any stipulation on what breeds can be service dogs but I guess it would be unfair to say that a Great Dane couldn't be because they might do a better job than one of those yappy little things in Prada handbags.

That is a safety hazard if I have ever seen one. It is a pity that the litigious nature of said society quite possibly stopped the crew from allowing that to occur.

 

[JohnM]

Gee, RF, you sure can start some good threads! .

Heading home?

 

[Febs]

I flew DFW-LAX years ago in 3F (bulkhead window seat) and the guy next to me in 3E had a big chocolate Labrador on the floor in front of his feet. Not a seeing eye dog, not a service dog...just this bloke's pet dog, flying home.

I love dogs, and the guy was a nice bloke, so I had no issues with it whatsoever. The dog was incredibly well behaved and you barely knew he was there for the whole flight.

One of my more interesting flight experiences though.

 

[D747]

Years ago I was flying out of Adelaide and I was in about row 6, in a middle seat, when a lady boarded with a dog and was taking her correctly allocated window seat next to me. The dog was small / medium size and I had no issue until..... She insisted that the dog be allowed to take up residence in my foot space! I politely pointed out that perhaps it could go in her foot space. She started screaming and yelling and saying I was against people with disabilities. I sat there dumbstruck for about a full minute as she abused me very loudly at which point we were joined by a member of the cabin crew. When asked what was going on my neighbor repeated her claim that her dog had to go in my foot space. The cabin crew member told her that the dog had to go in her foot space or she could leave the aircraft, simple as that. At this point both her and her dog settled down for the journey to Melbourne peacefully.

I never did work out what her disability was.

 

[RooFlyer]

Gee, RF, you sure can start some good threads! .

Heading home?

Home! Best place there is

 

[tuapekastar]

Years ago I was flying out of Adelaide and I was in about row 6, in a middle seat, when a lady boarded with a dog and was taking her correctly allocated window seat next to me. The dog was small / medium size and I had no issue until..... She insisted that the dog be allowed to take up residence in my foot space! I politely pointed out that perhaps it could go in her foot space. She started screaming and yelling and saying I was against people with disabilities. I sat there dumbstruck for about a full minute as she abused me very loudly at which point we were joined by a member of the cabin crew. When asked what was going on my neighbor repeated her claim that her dog had to go in my foot space. The cabin crew member told her that the dog had to go in her foot space or she could leave the aircraft, simple as that. At this point both her and her dog settled down for the journey to Melbourne peacefully.

I never did work out what her disability was.

Brain-related I suspect.

 

[TomVexille]

Yeah, the ADA basically says that if you can get a Doctor to write you a certificate saying that you need your "emotional support animal". The airline has to allow you to travel with said animal.

 

[SeatBackForward]

I don't see any issue. Unless they recline during the flight, then all hell will break loose.

 

[AL1CE]

I thoroughly enjoyed the shock of a soft, velvety wet nose of a service dog sneak under my chair. I had no idea he had been there for 2 hrs. I found it to be a beautiful experience meeting Africa.

 

[Zampari]

I recently flew Virgin America LAX-BOS and across the aisle from me was a couple with their dog. It was a cross bred & weighed around 8kg or so at a guess. They too had it out of its carrier & sitting on their laps. I had a short chat with them & they said it was the dogs first flight & it was their pet. The dog was exceptionally well behaved & allowed several small children on the flight to pat it. Unless you'd walked past it you never would have known the dog was there. I too was very surprised to see it allowed to be seated on its owners laps though & did question(in my head of course) what could happen in the event of turbulence or if the animal had had behavioural issues.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I never did work out what her disability was.

She had a bad back. Comes from carrying a large chip around on a shoulder for too many years.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I don't see any issue. Unless they recline during the flight, then all hell will break loose.

The dog???

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I'm curious about the unrestrained part as well. I know every time I fly, I ensure my belt is done up the whole time (except when I need to visit the lavatory, which is not often). I do that, not so much because I worry about other pax should I become a flying missile in the event of an incident, but more because I fear my head being forced through the luggage bins may just hurt a little. In that vein, if I had my best mate (and constant companion) beside me, I'd be keen to ensure he/she was strapped in as well (to prevent injury to the animal).

Is it just selfishness or lack of thought on behalf of the owners, or is there a real reason for disability dogs to be unrestrained?