Why doesn't travel in premium cabins excite me as much as it should?

[anat0l]

Even better idea.

So I book economy on SQ for only 21,250 Amex MR points and I get lounge access and extra baggage allowance with my VA Gold status! I knew VA status was going to come in handy one day.

So now I can afford to spend the money and request exit row seat.

The only downside to booking on SQ is the fuel surcharges. Hopefully by the time that is factored in, it doesn't look like you're better off paying the ticket in cash.

This is the universal disadvantage of redeeming Y awards on most programmes, because they have fuel surcharges. Redeeming J is not so bad because the auxiliaries still make using the points worth offsetting the rest of the fare. In Y, the points offset sometimes a negligible difference between the cash price and taxes etc. only component.

Had you booked the SQ award with VA points, there would be no fuel surcharges (IIRC); however of course you would need more VA points (but I believe not too much more for simple itineraries).

Not sure about spending for an exit row. If the plane isn't too full maybe you could request it at the airport (of course, the difference between spending and requesting at the airport is the guarantee).

 

[JohnK]

JohnK, if you have the points and are likely to continue to accrue them, then travel in J and enjoy the flight that little bit more. A bit more room, a better seat and food. And better luggage allowance.

You can't take them with you!

I know I can't take them with me but I also need to plan carefully. There is a reason I have been accumulating points and not splurging them on premium travel or Any Seat awards etc.

Yes I can accrue points easily now but the plan is to stop working in the next year or so. If not to retire then to at least have 12 months off and casually look for another job opportunity.

Either way I would still like to be able to travel and having points in the bank is a sensible idea. Sure one needs to consider devaluation of points but unless something drastic happens the Amex MR points I have now are good for ~7 return trips to Thailand on SQ and my QFF points are good for ~8 Oneworld economy awards. I also have close to 400,000 IHG points which will come in handy in the USA and Europe.

 

[TiredOldFlyer]

Being in a position where we earn lots of points we have been able to take a couple of International flights each year.
For a long time our prefered carrier was SIA and being old and tired we are fortunate to have been able to fly F.
As the change to suites occured and it became harder to book we have changed our alliance to VA. No F but just as exciting - in the
best cabin VA have and therefor we get the best treatment that they can offer. Have not been Y internationaly sine our children left home
but I well remember the old days when we were able to have several seats each on UA to the States - made Y acceptable.
Do I miss F on SIA, no not really. Upside 15 hours to LAX as opposed to nearly 30 hours with SIA, no layovers in Singapore, less points,
less taxes etc.
I don't miss the Private room, the extra seat (suite) for sleeping etc.
I suppose I am trying to say that there is more to airline travell than the best cabin - the excitment is the journey, the planning and the anticipation.

 

[DaveB]

I agree about not having to travel for business helps keep the appetite for travel. My wife though is trying to put a cap on trips so that they continue to be special.
We both have been very busy lately and neither of us were too thrilled when our 3 night trip to Adelaide booked in April came up on us two weeks ago. Even on a short domestic trip, J in QF sure helps to put you in the right mood that had begun in the lounge. Will pay for a limo service next time in lieu of the taxi to replicate the fab experience we had with the EY service to and from the airport.

 

[JohnK]

I think it's a quantity vs quality argument, for those with restricted means (points or money). Say you can do one trip every 2 years in J to say, BKK, or would you rather do one a year in Y (or whatever frequency).

With me frequency is the important factor.

I made a decision when I started working in Brisbane that I was going to take ~10 weeks leave a year to get away and recharge the batteries so to speak. I am not going to have a ~10 week holiday of a lifetime and then wait another 10 months for next holiday.

I am much better off splitting the time into 3-4 trips a year and to do that then one needs to also consider travel and accommodation costs. I cannot reduce the costs for golf as that is almost a fixed cost unless I play less often which is not desirable.

Of course all this changes when you are no longer single but I would not want to be with a person who has been spoiled with premium travel and luxurious accommodation.

 

[CMak]

Having just returned from a 7 week trip to South America where we flew Y internally and J to and from Australia - I really appreciate being able to travel in business (especially as the flight was 32.5 hrs each way)
We flew with SIA to get there and back and LAN/TAM crisscrossing the continent.
Most of the internal flights were on A319 & A320 and they were at least 95% full. After our first flight we knew to get on early as bin space filled up quickly as most people were allowed on with extremely large amounts of cabin luggage.
Cmak

 

[tuapekastar]

My position hasn't chnaged in a while on what cabin I wish to fly which is the 'top' cabin available, but being practical about this:

Most domestic I'm happy with Y...in fact, all domestic, though Coast to Coast I'll often upgrade.

To NZ, also content to fly Y, doesn't seem worth upgrading on QF's 738s. EK may present some opportunities though.

Anything longer (e.g. Asia and beyond) if I can avoid Y I will - and have for the last 6 years, a mix of JQ*, J and F.

I'm sure long haul Y won't kill me, but it would be interesting to see what I thought of it these days (I have done quite a bit in the past). But not interesting enough that I really want to find out!

 

[JohnK]

The only downside to booking on SQ is the fuel surcharges. Hopefully by the time that is factored in, it doesn't look like you're better off paying the ticket in cash.

I think the taxes and fuel surcharges are ~AUD250 one-way.

Had you booked the SQ award with VA points, there would be no fuel surcharges (IIRC); however of course you would need more VA points (but I believe not too much more for simple itineraries).

Would VA be comparable to the Saver awards or the Full awards?

Not sure about spending for an exit row. If the plane isn't too full maybe you could request it at the airport (of course, the difference between spending and requesting at the airport is the guarantee).

That would all depend on where I can pre-allocate a seat.

 

[phily]

Until I reached my middle ages I could ever only afford Y fares, but now that I'm benefitting from a range of good decisions , I'm now able to afford premium cabins. Who enjoys cattle class long-haul flights? Not me! So I've been fortunate to be able to afford to pay for J for long-haul flights, and with increasing status with QF I've been fortunate to get points upgrades to F on QF1 & QF2 etc.

And here's the problem. Once one has experienced a premium cabin, especially on long-haul flights, it's awfully hard to go back to Y. As one poster here outlined, Y provides basic food, basic wine, basic seats, basic everything. But once you have experienced travel in F, even considering long-haul in J is a challenge.

And I say all this with a mind to costs. J fares are expensive, and F is very expensive. But if you've had the opportunity to travel in such classes, whether by paying or by points upgrades, it's a serious challenge to accept a downgrade on your next flight.

 

[anat0l]

I think the taxes and fuel surcharges are ~AUD250 one-way.

So $500 for a return (probably a little bit less than that actually, because of a few taxes which won't apply on the other direction).

That said, for a typical $800 return ticket to SIN (not counting the Brazilian method), you can't get a bona fide one-way for $400...

Would VA be comparable to the Saver awards or the Full awards?

It's not that simple. VA have two different scales for SQ awards. You can find them here: Points Tables | Velocity Frequent Flyer

One table applies to SQ awards between SIN and Australia, the other is for SQ awards for any other SQ operated sector.

You also have to keep in mind that redeeming SQ using Velocity is based on distance; different to KrisFlyer where redemptions are by geographical zone. BNE/SIN, SYD/SIN and MEL/SIN are all in the same distance class; ADL/SIN is in the lower distance class and thus is slightly cheaper. BNE/SIN is 32,500 points in Y one-way; last time I checked a quote with the VA call centre, taxes were under $100. SQ awards must be booked by calling VFF - no online redemption option and no 15% discount. J is 70k one-way.

Although the points values are higher, remember that there is (as far as I can tell) no YQ on VFF redemptions, and most people here would rack up VFF points faster than KF points (notwithstanding different goals using credit card rewards).

 

[JohnK]

So $500 for a return (probably a little bit less than that actually, because of a few taxes which won't apply on the other direction).

That said, for a typical $800 return ticket to SIN (not counting the Brazilian method), you can't get a bona fide one-way for $400...

I know the value is not that great but at least it is something. BKK-SIN-SYD for 21,250 Amex MR points and THB6,830 (~AUD235) is OK. It means I am only paying ~AUD235 from my pocket and I can take advantage of the expedia.br deals for next trip in May/June if I so choose.

Appears though my plan has hit a snag.

The SQ website is only offering 2 flights BKK-SIN the 9:45am and 12:30pm and there are 2 suitable flights SIN-SYD at 8:40pm and 00:45am.

The snag is SQ now not offering Saver award on the 2 BKK-SIN flights to connect to the 8:40pm SIN-SYD flight but is offering Saver on both of those flights to connect to the 00:45am SIN-SYD flight which means I am going to be in SIN for at least 8 hours. Not what I had hoped as the later flight gets into SYD at 11:40am and does not leave a lot of time at home before I come back to BNE that afternoon.

Business is the same.

 

[MH_fan]

My rules for international travel:
All flights to Europe or the US have to be in a minimum of J whether I'm travelling alone or with a companion. This is not negotiable.
Flights to Asia >8hrs has to be in J whether I am alone or with a companion. Also not negotiable.
Flights to Asia <8hrs needs to be in J if it is overnight when I am alone but is negotiable if I have a companion who can't afford to fly in J.
Flights to Asia <8hrs during the day preferably would be in J if I am alone but is negotiable in Y if there is a spectacularly cheap price. Definitely in Y if my companion cannot afford to fly in J.

 

[Lowjhg]

My travel position and budget has changed over the few years, but has seen a radical change within the past 2 years.

International travel for me <4 hours will be in Y. Any more than 4 hours in an international flight setting will be booked in at least W cabin.

This is notwithstanding taking into account SC earned per dollar spent, but on regular travel during term breaks between asia and australia.

For certain cases, travel is dependent on SC earned per dollar spent. In these cases cabin of choice will be at least J.

For domestic hops <3 hours, economy is preferred. Any domestic flight exceeding 3 hours, J seating will be ticketed, either as a cash ticket or cash + points ticket.

Ive had the privilege of commuting in J between SIN and australia semi regularly previously on SQ and QF, and the average flight time (~7 hours) does not warrant a need for a flat bed. Any further improvements to the class of ticket booked will be counted as a bonus.

Same for hotel choice, i have a budget of ~A$200 - A$350 per night. I will look for at least 5* category hotels, before making my way down the chain up to a maximum of 3*s. My hotels of choice are tied to the loyalty program with the highest tier on hand.

My travel pattern tends to be influenced by SC earn, and i tend to save my points up for a rainy day, or for one day if i ever redeem an ASA for SC earning purposes.

 

[cove]

To enjoy first class travel you should:
1. Not stock your home fridge with Krug nor Dom Perignon or any close equivalent
2. Leave the best caviar on the shop shelf and go home with cheese and biscuits
3. Keep the old uncomfortable reclining chair in your TV watching room
4. Leave those fine French reds at the shop and rush home to deal with your daily challenges
Now that you have done this travelling in style has its old magic from the sixties,seventies and eighties back into your travelling life.

 

[TiredOldFlyer]

Perhaps it is not only the cabin class that excites.
See this report from E Turbo News news :

Airline performance depends on flyer-focused retail customer service

 

[im.daniel]

My rules for international travel (regardless of length):
Y

My rules for Domestic travel;
Y; (unless it's between TSV-BNE-DRW - that one definitely has to be in J )

 

[dajop]

SIt's not that simple. VA have two different scales for SQ awards. You can find them here: Points Tables | Velocity Frequent Flyer

One table applies to SQ awards between SIN and Australia, the other is for SQ awards for any other SQ operated sector.

You also have to keep in mind that redeeming SQ using Velocity is based on distance; different to KrisFlyer where redemptions are by geographical zone. BNE/SIN, SYD/SIN and MEL/SIN are all in the same distance class; ADL/SIN is in the lower distance class and thus is slightly cheaper. BNE/SIN is 32,500 points in Y one-way; last time I checked a quote with the VA call centre, taxes were under $100. SQ awards must be booked by calling VFF - no online redemption option and no 15% discount. J is 70k one-way.

I'll pick you up on a couple of very minor points:
1) Using Velocity points on SQ has two tables, as you indicate. One is for travel between Singapore and the cities in Australia served purely by aircraft with (new) regional business class product (i.e. SIN-ADL/BNE/PER). The other table is for all other SQ flights (including SIN-SYD/MEL). Both as you indicate are distance based.
2) SQ (Krisflyer) used to have ADL/PER in one zone and MEL/SYD/BNE/AKL/CHC in the other. Now the zones are ADL/SYD/MEL/BNE/AKL/CHC in the more expensive zone and PER/DRW in the other.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Sure I'd rather be in J or F the whole time bit Y can be as satisfying a lot of the time.

it is possible to enjoy economy class... when I was living in London there was nothing better than heading out to heathrow on a Friday evening for a great weekend away in Amsterdam, Rome, Budapest or Barcelona... a drink and bite to eat in the lounge and then a short flight on BA with a tasty sandwich and a gin and tonic (or two) and then flying in with the city lit up beneath you. even better if you could score the AC seats immediately behind club. and better still if you were with a friend or two.

but compare that with Australian domestic and the excitement and enjoyment seems to disappear with a tatty 767 with tiny overhead bins, yellowing walls, and if you're lucky, a biscuit thrown at you and 'sorry coffee's not available because the flight is too short'.

there is no way I'd spend 5+ hours in the back of an AA 757 slaveship LAX-HNL in coach. by all accounts one of the most horrendous flights operating.

 

[JohnK]

it is possible to enjoy economy class...

It is all in the mind. Unless you have problems fitting in economy seat.

 

[Oneworldplus2]

Only 1 point per dollar on a basic Platinum credit card.

I have (had) ~300,000 which is enough for 3 returns BKK-SYD/BNE in business or 7 returns BKK-SYD/BNE in economy.

Economy does not scare me. Luggage is the only consideration.

Take the J seat John. No point going to the grave with x,xx_,xx_ points in the bank mate. Live it up while you can...