Western Sydney Airport (WSI) Discussion

[jase05]

I note a poster earlier works in freight - is there publicly shareable info about how the major freight forwarders are expected to use WSI? Will it be additive to SYD or substitutive? You alluded to significant growth expected but what are the implications of SYD.

I don’t know about other companies but for us we will still need a facility and some operations out of SYD but the bulk of our operations will move out to WSI. The dedicated freight flights will all move out to WSI but >80% of QF and JQ daily pax flights around Australia carry our freight so will still need to maintain a presence at SYD to handle that plus the International flights carrying freight
SYD currently is a huge thorn in our side in preventing growth thanks to curfew and having the most delays and cancellations due to weather.

 

[SYD]

SYD currently is a huge thorn in our side in preventing growth thanks to curfew and having the most delays and cancellations due to weather.

and correct me if I’m wrong, even those dedicated big freight jets come and go late at night or other off peak times (much to the joy of inner west residence). Moving all that to WSI with cheaper / 24 hr ops ought to see air freight grow and hopefully cheaper.

Oz Post has already moved their main warehouse out that way to a place I’d never heard of until I saw a notice about some QF Wine heading in the opposite direction to me!

Meanwhile, yes freeing up some space at SYD T1 is a good thing. Combine that with some healthy competition between SYD and WSI for international PAX, we might actually see a win win for airlines and PAX (cheaper fares - lower fees and more planes overall).

 

[Quickstatus]

Those are areas of Sydney not individual suburbs

Regardless those "areas" you mentioned are (again) not the extent of Greater Sydney.
Additionally "Wealth" really has nothing to do with airline seat demand. In fact airline travel has never been more egalitarian even though the snob effect still persists. The explosion in airline travel is mostly attributed to the middle class

 

[moa999]

The dedicated freight flights will all move out to WSI but >80% of QF and JQ daily pax flights around Australia carry our freight so will still need to maintain a presence at SYD to handle that plus the International flights carrying freight

So does that include the curfew busting 146s.. or are they likely to be retired with the move to WSI.

 

[jase05]

So does that include the curfew busting 146s.. or are they likely to be retired with the move to WSI.

They are being retired but not nearly fast enough and as it stands they will still be in use when WSI opens. But yes they will all head out to WSI

 

[TomVexille]

and correct me if I’m wrong, even those dedicated big freight jets come and go late at night or other off peak times (much to the joy of inner west residence). Moving all that to WSI with cheaper / 24 hr ops ought to see air freight grow and hopefully cheaper.

Oz Post has already moved their main warehouse out that way to a place I’d never heard of until I saw a notice about some QF Wine heading in the opposite direction to me!

Meanwhile, yes freeing up some space at SYD T1 is a good thing. Combine that with some healthy competition between SYD and WSI for international PAX, we might actually see a win win for airlines and PAX (cheaper fares - lower fees and more planes overall).

I think there are some key takeaways here that some posters who seem to want WSI to fail are failing to grasp. WSI succeeding should make SYD better.

 

[Quickstatus]

WSI succeeding should make SYD better.

There are major cities with 2 vibrant international airports . The point is that each airport does not need to completely duplicate the other.

 

[Lynda2475]

The explosion in airline travel is mostly attributed to the middle class

And the areas I mentioned are all middle class. Sure there are tiny pockets of mega wealthy in lower North Shore and harbour side of inner east but overwhelmingly those areas are middle class.

In my last job we had Lower Socio Economic targets and those students were all in the South West and Outer West areas (many of which were not traditionally considered part of Sydney and used to be a long distance STD to call them).

I stand by my prediction that WSI will not be very successful for passenger traffic, it will be the domain of the budget airlines, non premium routes and most living in Sydney will continue to preferace SYD with its superior PT connections, proximity to city of Sydney and premium airlines.

 

[SYD]

There are major cities with more than 2 vibrant international airports . The point is that each airport does not need to completely duplicate the other.

Yep. The argument for NOT building a 2nd airport was lost in about 1970 something!

Removing the curfew, more runways etc was NEVER going float (especially the runway ) and SYD is pretty much at capacity now. The parallel runway bought some time but it just took some ba$$s to make a decision on where to put a 2nd airport (against the sea of NIMBYism).

WSI is built. It’s opening (far too late IMHO) and will be a success in due course and the current SYD isn’t going away anytime soon - if ever. It should only get better and be complimentary to WSI.

Yes, there are significant population centres and business in “Western Sydney” that will benefit immediately. But, for a lot of Sydney siders - it’s a bloody long way away and no practical, fast way to get there and back. Nor any real firm plans to address that. Which is a shame.

 

[SeatBackForward]

This will probably be the biggest immediate need and operational usecase from day1 of WSI and why WSI should be profitable from the get go. Not passenger and airline throughput but freight throughput.

I imagine most cargo freight companies will move their ops very quickly over to WSI (and possibly even increase ops).

This is the most important part that many are missing. This is an absolute game changer for the freight industry

and correct me if I’m wrong, even those dedicated big freight jets come and go late at night or other off peak times (much to the joy of inner west residence). Moving all that to WSI with cheaper / 24 hr ops ought to see air freight grow and hopefully cheaper.

Oz Post has already moved their main warehouse out that way to a place I’d never heard of until I saw a notice about some QF Wine heading in the opposite direction to me!

Meanwhile, yes freeing up some space at SYD T1 is a good thing. Combine that with some healthy competition between SYD and WSI for international PAX, we might actually see a win win for airlines and PAX (cheaper fares - lower fees and more planes overall).

Big news for Western Sydney!

We're thrilled to announce that Qantas Group and Menzies Aviation have signed up to operate from Western Sydney International (Nancy-Bird Walton) Airport’s brand new 24-hour Cargo Precinct – supercharging Sydney’s air cargo capacity by 33% on day one of operations

This is a game-changer for businesses and customers in Greater Sydney and regional NSW. Our farmers will now be able to get their fresh produce to overseas markets more efficiently, while customers will receive their e-commerce goods faster than ever.

LinkedIn

 

[markis10]

Will be interesting to see a real curfew and no dispensations or exceptions for 5AM arrivals kick in, I reckon the locals may have trouble sleeping for a while with the quiet sky’s.

 

[Quickstatus]

those areas are middle class

as are large parts of Greater Western Sydney

WSI will not be very successful for passenger traffic, it will be the domain of the budget airline

Budget airlines = low passenger traffic ?
Strange how in Europe, LCC have increased airport profitability and made secondary airports very important aviation hubs .
BCN is an example of an airport which derives half of its traffic from the leisure market. LTN is a very important hub for LCCs

It remains to be seen what type of traffic WSI will attract. Lets see....

 

[Quickstatus]

But, for a lot of Sydney siders - it’s a bloody long way away and no practical,

For some
For me it is takes about the same time (driving)

I suspect the time it takes to get there will not be a huge issue.
The passenger will go to where the flight is most attractive.

 

[JMB1]

Amazes me how many on this thread are cutting down WSI

Not only is it closer for a significant part of Western Sydney, but if you look at literally any planning docs you'll see that a huge amount of urban development is planned to occur out that way, including Sydney's 3rd CBD Bradfield.

Really speaks to our small town mindset sometimes that people cannot conceive of our biggest city having two functioning major airports

 

[moa999]

Cargo precinct at WSI now under construction. Well away from the passenger terminal.

Will be interesting to see whether WSI opening changes the curfew enforcement at SYD.
Eg. Will the early morning shoulder arrivals still be allowed, will ministerial approvals for delayed arrivals still be granted as much

 

[SYD]

Cargo precinct now under construction.

Will be interesting to see whether WSI opening changes the curfew enforcement.
Eg. Will the early morning shoulder arrivals still be allowed, will ministerial approvals for delayed arrivals still be granted as much

What curfew?

WSI will be 24/7 "curfew free".

 

[moa999]

What curfew?

At SYD.

 

[Quickstatus]

At SYD.

Possibly curfew dispensations might be even rarer?

.....

Looking ahead. I wonder when it will be privatised.

 

[kamchatsky]

I wonder if a plane is late to SYD and it hits curfew, will it be allowed to be diverted to WSI for landing and allow passenger to depart? Or they have to be on hold and then fly to SYD when curfew is over?

 

[SYD]

Really speaks to our small town mindset sometimes that people cannot conceive of our biggest city having two functioning major airports

There’s only a very small minority here espousing that and it’s quite academic now - it’s happening and it’ll be good in the grand scheme of things.