Virgin Australia applied for ADL/OOL-PER-DPS. Failed due International Terminal Requirement

[HS-TQE]

In what's called the "Qatar Special" in the Jetstar equivalent application some months back. Has the Indonesian authorities released more "regional capacity" between Indonesia and Australia?

Also it seems VA are intending to take on their direct "Value Carrier" rivals Batik Air on the PER-DPS corridor. The combined Batik Air group flies twice-daily between PER-DPS, with their Indonesian division providing 12J recliners on their daily flight. The Malaysian (former Malindo) division currently flies an all-Y 737-8 MAX the route.

https://www.iasc.gov.au/sites/default/f ... ec2023.pdf

 

[justinbrett]

In what's called the "Qatar Special" in the Jetstar equivalent application some months back. Has the Indonesian authorities released more "regional capacity" between Indonesia and Australia?

Also it seems VA are intending to take on their direct "Value Carrier" rivals Batik Air on the PER-DPS corridor. The combined Batik Air group flies twice-daily between PER-DPS, with their Indonesian division providing 12J recliners on their daily flight. The Malaysian (former Malindo) division currently flies an all-Y 737-8 MAX the route.

https://www.iasc.gov.au/sites/default/f ... ec2023.pdf

Sounds like VA applied because QF (JQ) applied for most of the allocation, so this would prevent the full allocation to JQ and force it to be split.

My comment on this in the JQ thread (VA applied for 2464):

If approved, QF will take almost all (2320) seats of the 2500 available for the "QR special" capacity.

 

[Saab34]

The Bali seats should be split 50/50 QF Group and VA group. Virgin has considerable less seats on the bilaterals vs the QF group.

 

[justinbrett]

The Bali seats should be split 50/50 QF Group and VA group. Virgin has considerable less seats on the bilaterals vs the QF group.

Sure, but this isn’t new capacity. It’s been there all along.

Why has VA only applied after QF did so? What was holding them back before?

I’m not saying it shouldn’t be split (I think it should) but seems somewhat of a jerk move. Unless it’s all an incredible coincidence…

The logical response would be to block CNS-MEL-DPS and OOL-PER-DPS which are both blatant abuses of the system, and approve ADL-PER-DPS for both carriers.

 

[HS-TQE]

The Bali seats should be split 50/50 QF Group and VA group. Virgin has considerable less seats on the bilaterals vs the QF group.

Agree on principle, though ex-PER not sure how VA would be competitive on PER-DPS market.

Batik Air group as their direct rival on this route already provides the recliner J cabins and VA with a potential single daily would add very little difference with their LCC/BoB in Y against the multiple LCCs and Value Carriers already on this route.

 

[Cynicor]

Would come down to timing. Many want to leave in the am but not too early, and get home late evening but not too late.

 

[PERLHR]

Agree on principle, though ex-PER not sure how VA would be competitive on PER-DPS market.

Batik Air group as their direct rival on this route already provides the recliner J cabins and VA with a potential single daily would add very little difference with their LCC/BoB in Y against the multiple LCCs and Value Carriers already on this route.

Well I for.one, if the route with VA was competitive and at a decent time of the day would fly VA with lounge at least at PER without hesitation than Batik whom I would not touch with a barchpole. Friend.flew biz with them to KUL, said awful.

 

[Cynicor]

What lounge would you get, though. My understanding is VA int doesn’t get any lounge access

 

[PERLHR]

What lounge would you get, though. My understanding is VA int doesn’t get any lounge access

Not use the VA lounge at T1 at Perth outbound? (Suppose not as it domestic only. Unless you can go.domestic.first then International? (If not busy). Dunno. I do wish VA sorted out lounge access for international at home and abroad for 2024.

 

[Cynicor]

I see no way you could use the lounge, assuming you even got access. T1 int is the complete other side, you’d have to be very keen, and early, to do security, lounge, exit, security then immigration and board.

 

[Harrison_133]

The IASC has received submissions from both Virgin and the Qantas Group to address criteria for their applications of additional Indonesia capacity.

Qantas Group:

https://www.iasc.gov.au/sites/default/files/documents/20240108%20QF%20IASC%20INDONESIA%20SUPPLEMENTARY%20SUBMISSION.pdf

Virgin:

https://www.iasc.gov.au/sites/default/files/documents/IASC-Indonesia-Capacity%20080124%20FINAL.pdf

 

[Saab34]

Unlikely that QF group will get full capacity. Either one each or all Virgin.

I think Jetstar should be comparing its fares w/baggage vs Virgin’s fares w/bagagge. Not JQ Starter vs VA Choice. In many instances, JQ is closer to VA once baggage added.

 

[jase05]

Will the tag flights for QF and VA be for purchase or will empty aircraft fly?
I just can see someone willingly paying to go to fly in the opposite direction for hours in Economy just to save a few bucks potentially

 

[oz_mark]

Will the tag flights for QF and VA be for purchase or will empty aircraft fly?
I just can see someone willingly paying to go to fly in the opposite direction for hours in Economy just to save a few bucks potentially

Can't imagine they will fly them empty.

Unlike QR, they can sell the domestic leg.

 

[HS-TQE]

Considering PER Int'l and VA mainline Dom is in the same building in PER, I would guess the domestic tag would be treated as a domestic flight if VA uses a 'Swing' gate in PER meaning 'through' passengers would have to clear immigration (and collect bags and re-check if returning from Bali) in PER, otherwise the 'D' Sticker system (i.e ID and boarding pass with a 'D' sticker attached would be required) comes into use for VA's domestic tag passengers if they use the Int'l Gates in PER

 

[Harrison_133]

Will the tag flights for QF and VA be for purchase or will empty aircraft fly?
I just can see someone willingly paying to go to fly in the opposite direction for hours in Economy just to save a few bucks potentially

From the VA submission: "the traffic rights necessary for the Gold Coast-Perth-Denpasar one stop route would also allow Virgin Australia to become a new competitor on the Gold Coast-Perth route."

So yes, seats should be available on the domestic leg, albeit most likely operating from international terminals like JQ 787 tag flights.

 

[justinbrett]

Considering PER Int'l and VA mainline Dom is in the same building in PER, I would guess the domestic tag would be treated as a domestic flight if VA uses a 'Swing' gate in PER meaning 'through' passengers would have to clear immigration (and collect bags and re-check if returning from Bali) in PER, otherwise the 'D' Sticker system (i.e ID and boarding pass with a 'D' sticker attached would be required) comes into use for VA's domestic tag passengers if they use the Int'l Gates in PER

I think for IASC to consider it a flight from a regional port, it has to be direct (1 stop) - ie single flight number, international.

 

[PERLHR]

From the VA submission: "the traffic rights necessary for the Gold Coast-Perth-Denpasar one stop route would also allow Virgin Australia to become a new competitor on the Gold Coast-Perth route."

So yes, seats should be available on the domestic leg, albeit most likely operating from international terminals like JQ 787 tag flights.

And hence the ridiculous situation of domestic flight (PER-OOL) and no lounge access due to international access. VA need to start opening international lounges at various places.

 

[Bagpuss]

Considering PER Int'l and VA mainline Dom is in the same building in PER, I would guess the domestic tag would be treated as a domestic flight if VA uses a 'Swing' gate in PER meaning 'through' passengers would have to clear immigration (and collect bags and re-check if returning from Bali) in PER, otherwise the 'D' Sticker system (i.e ID and boarding pass with a 'D' sticker attached would be required) comes into use for VA's domestic tag passengers if they use the Int'l Gates in PER

Which is the purpose of gate 50 at Perth.

 

[PERLHR]

Which is the purpose of gate 50 at Perth.

So what does Gate 50 actually offer/do if one was a pax? Trying to recall it's position...is it not at end of T1 (away from exit entry points? )