Travel into Pakistan

[munitalP]

I have been requested to send staff into Pakistan for about a weeks work. I need them to carry $100K plus worth of equipment plus their personal gear including computers, cameras phones etc...

The equipment will weigh in total about 50kg and will be in 2 ABS shock proof boxs which will be checked as luggage (excess) on flights.

As the areas of work is across Pakistan (4 seperate locations), I will be providing armed body guards for my staff (I am seriously thinking about going myself! :shock to escort them from Karachi to site 1, site 2, site 3, site 4 then back to Karachi. except site 4 (which is slightly north of Khanewal), everything else is in the south of Pakistan.

I have some questions I hope someone here will be able to answer. I know Pakistan is in turmoil at the moment, but that mainly seems to be in the north - Islamabad area - Australian Gov, US Gov and Canadian Gov all reccommend no travel unless essential. Here's my questions...

Q1. Anyone who's travelled to Pakistan recently - whats the undertones you picked up against non Muslums and European's in general?

Q2. Internal travel - what are the roads like - what sort of vehicles should be hired 4x4 or car?

Q3. Has anyone had dealings with protective security before? www.executivesecurity.ca got the thumbs up from my customer, but they were at the top of the google list and I wonder if thats where they came from...

Q4. Hot tips from anyone who's been there before in regards to basically everything especially regarding hotels...

I have looked at the following flights as well:

QF31 SYD/SIN then SQ460 (J's)

or

SQ232 / SQ460 (J's)

Either way, SQ gets the SIN / Karachi legs but as there will be an overnight in SIN, eith QF or SQ get the OZ/SIN flights - they are also approx the same $$

Cheers

Mr!

 

[straitman]

munitalP,

A PM is on its way.

 

[winetraveller]

I have been requested to send staff into Pakistan for about a weeks work. I need them to carry $100K plus worth of equipment plus their personal gear including computers, cameras phones etc...

The equipment will weigh in total about 50kg and will be in 2 ABS shock proof boxs which will be checked as luggage (excess) on flights.

As the areas of work is across Pakistan (4 seperate locations), I will be providing armed body guards for my staff (I am seriously thinking about going myself! :shock to escort them from Karachi to site 1, site 2, site 3, site 4 then back to Karachi. except site 4 (which is slightly north of Khanewal), everything else is in the south of Pakistan.

I have some questions I hope someone here will be able to answer. I know Pakistan is in turmoil at the moment, but that mainly seems to be in the north - Islamabad area - Australian Gov, US Gov and Canadian Gov all reccommend no travel unless essential. Here's my questions...

Q1. Anyone who's travelled to Pakistan recently - whats the undertones you picked up against non Muslums and European's in general?

Q2. Internal travel - what are the roads like - what sort of vehicles should be hired 4x4 or car?

Q3. Has anyone had dealings with protective security before? www.executivesecurity.ca got the thumbs up from my customer, but they were at the top of the google list and I wonder if thats where they came from...

Q4. Hot tips from anyone who's been there before in regards to basically everything especially regarding hotels...

I have looked at the following flights as well:

QF31 SYD/SIN then SQ460 (J's)

or

SQ232 / SQ460 (J's)

Either way, SQ gets the SIN / Karachi legs but as there will be an overnight in SIN, eith QF or SQ get the OZ/SIN flights - they are also approx the same $$

Cheers

Mr!

Can't impart anything specifically about Pakistan, but I can recommend this company. A member of our board spent a while living in Moscow, and was under threat of kidnap for various reasons.

This is the company he used. They are UK based but may well be able to do Pakistan.

Bodyguard Services - Close Protection Services - Bodyguard Training - VIP Protection - Training - Counter Threat Group, UK

 

[docjames]

Well, not to be a party-pooper, but I think your #1 question needs to be : Is it ESSENTIAL? (Caps intentional!)

Also, when are you going? Security situations can change suddenly, so i'd be keeping all intineries and bookings as flexible as possible, despite the increased cost in doing so.


Sorry i cant help with your specific questions, will be interesting to hear what others have to say on this one. Staitman, anything you can share i public? I know some doctors who have travelled there in emergency relief post-earthquake, and had nothing but priase for the country and it's people. But it certainly had it's challenges.

 

[munitalP]

Thanks Straitman and Winetraveller

Mr!

 

[munitalP]

Well, not to be a party-pooper, but I think your #1 question needs to be : Is it ESSENTIAL? (Caps intentional!)

.

The definition of ESSENTIAL is wide and varied...

In this case it is essential for ongoing works with this customer, but if the security risk to my staff is too high, I will happily wave goodbye to this customer.

I will leave the risk factor to be called by someone in the know on the ground in Pakistan, the day before leaving SIN (hence the SIN stopover) in my planning

Thanks for your observations -DOCJAMES



Mr!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Hi

You've probably already done this but make sure that the travel insurance policy isn't voided by travel to Pakistan.

It is possible that there would be no medical coverage as a result of terrorist (or any other similar or riot) activity.

Regards

Mel_T

 

[browski]

Q1. Typically not a religious thing. Just anti-american (but they are not Robinson Crusoe in that regard).
Q2. Roads are fine on the Islamabad-Lahore-Karachi corridor. If you are going into NWFP or Baluchistan then 4wd is almost essential.
Q3. Catch 22 situation here. Security unfortunately attracts attention.
Q4. Fly Emirates, multiple daily flights and multiple destinations. Train from Pindi to Peshawar is spectacular. Go to the cricket.......full house at Gaddafi Stadium, Lahore is a great experience.

 

[Soundguy]

Q3. Catch 22 situation here. Security unfortunately attracts attention.

Yes, this is a problem. Very obviously dress like the locals.... according to my Pakastani friends the major cities should be fine in most parts but very few of the city dwellers visit the remote areas where trouble is more likely. If you are going to such places having security is fine but do NOT rely on this alone; pack your own heat (fairly easy to organise in such parts of Pakistan) and BE prepared to use it if necessary. An American missionary friend of mine recently went through the Khyber Pass into Afghanistan & had no problems but he was travelling with a party of locals, all armed. Everybody around there is. There are no security or government checkpoints at all in that area, no passport or ID necessary. All in all a great holiday spot!

 

[rwatts]

... If you are going to such places having security is fine but do NOT rely on this alone; pack your own heat (fairly easy to organise in such parts of Pakistan) and BE prepared to use it if necessary. ...

That's fine when one is travelling for one's self, but in munitalP's case he would be asking his staff to do this. A very different kettle of fish and a huge responsibility to undertake.

Richard.

 

[munitalP]

Just an update, the area of work has decreased to being about 300km north east from Karachi in the Ghotki District, this area is closer to the Indian border and I believe somewhat safer - thanks to date on all the comments so far, if this new information helps shed more light, it's much appreciated

Mr!

 

[Soundguy]

That's fine when one is travelling for one's self, but in munitalP's case he would be asking his staff to do this. A very different kettle of fish and a huge responsibility to undertake.

You're right but I guess I was thinking from what munitalP wrote he would be keen to protect his staff the best way he could. The point is if you employ local security staff in Pakistan you have a 97% chance they they will have at least some sympathy with any potential terrorists or kidnappers. It's just how it works. If you get the common mindset and composition of the country you will understand.

But by having your own protection as well - without informing the security guys exactly who or what - the odds are better in your favour. Remember the Bombay massacre recently? In any situation don't ever let Moslem terrorists take you alive. Here is another reason why. And one of these mutilated victims was a young pregnant woman.

 

[Chrisd26]

Have been to Pakistan many times over last 10 years - always found it to be a very safe and friendly place. Cricket is a great conversation starter! If you are friendly they respond likewise.

Always be willing to tip a few rupees 50 - 100 for hotels etc and always use porters if they are around airports etc. Its their living and they make things so much easier with check in etc. I give porters a bit more because they do help you out so much.

Never found any religious problems - have been to many mosques in non prayer time to marvel at their architecture. I wander on my own to shops and markets etc - and to great restaurants - there is no anti west feelings with locals. KFC is everywhere! They generally speak excellent English. There are extremists in all countries.

Roads etc can be a bit rough - 4wd is probably best way to go. Used armed guard once while driving - would not again - no need but always best to hire a local driver.

I travel by Singapore or Thai and PIA internally - pretty well direct flights from Sydney. Travelled most areas but sadly have not been to Peshawar or the Khyber Pass - one day hopefully.

I usually stay at Pearl Continental in Karachi and Lahore and the Serena in Islamabad. (approved because of their level of security)

If in Lahore a must is a visit to the border crossing point to see the daily closing of the border - a famous and spectacular show.

I will be heading back there in a couple of weeks.

You will find it a great experience

Cheers

Chris

 

[munitalP]

Welcome to AFF ChrisD26

Thank you for your post - you seem very experienced in Pakistan. Good solid information - my employees wont be given the option of sightseeing though, in and out for them

thanks

Mr!

 

[medhead]

You're right but I guess I was thinking from what munitalP wrote he would be keen to protect his staff the best way he could. The point is if you employ local security staff in Pakistan you have a 97% chance they they will have at least some sympathy with any potential terrorists or kidnappers. It's just how it works. If you get the common mindset and composition of the country you will understand.

But by having your own protection as well - without informing the security guys exactly who or what - the odds are better in your favour. Remember the Bombay massacre recently? In any situation don't ever let Moslem terrorists take you alive. Here is another reason why. And one of these mutilated victims was a young pregnant woman.

I have a very different picture of pakistan and the diversity of it's population, that doesn't include a common people with a common mindset. But then that's just me.

I'm really not sure how your suggestion of gettng protection is at all helpful. While I spend a few years wearing a suit decorated with bunny ears and have fired the odd not so angry shot. I would not want my employer to send me somewhere with one of my collegues, give us heat and tell us this is to protect yourself against your security guards. Not the least of which, because my collegues haven't (to my knowledge) fired any shots. It's just totally wrong for any properly carried out corporate risk assessment.

 

[straitman]

munitalP,

It was good to talk to you yesterday afternoon. I hope the information was useful though not as specific as I thought it might be. It seems to be all coming together for you, so good luck with the project.

I'll catch you in Melbourne or Latrobe Valley some time soon.

 

[browski]

Yes, this is a problem. Very obviously dress like the locals.... according to my Pakastani friends the major cities should be fine in most parts but very few of the city dwellers visit the remote areas where trouble is more likely. If you are going to such places having security is fine but do NOT rely on this alone; pack your own heat (fairly easy to organise in such parts of Pakistan) and BE prepared to use it if necessary.

No, this problem does not exist,and it is not the problem to which I referred; nor is this sound advice.

 

[munitalP]

munitalP,

It was good to talk to you yesterday afternoon. I hope the information was useful though not as specific as I thought it might be. It seems to be all coming together for you, so good luck with the project.

I'll catch you in Melbourne or Latrobe Valley some time soon.

Yeah, thanks for the advice...

I'll make a point of calling in and saying Hi when next valley visiting!

cheers

Mr!

 

[docjames]

munnitalP - has this trip been and done / if not, plans changing in light of yesterday's horrible events?