Tiger Announce MEL-PER and MEL-ASP

[serfty]

Slots are generally only important in Peak times.

A $200 MEL-PER fare to me ex MEL would be less costly than a $99 fare ex AVV.

As far as the JQ advertising goes it's 'spin'.

 

[stuartfaz]

Slots are generally only important in Peak times.

A $200 MEL-PER fare to me ex MEL would be less costly than a $99 fare ex AVV.

As far as the JQ advertising goes it's 'spin'.

For me, any fare ex-MEL is less costly than going JQ ex-AVV...to me, it doesn't seem like JQ passes on all the savings an airline should get from operating out of a shed in Geelong...

 

[pauly7]

I think you missed my point. The triangle is infinitely more profitable to fly than the routes that cough has chosen, even in a startup situation and despite competition. There is a very good reason why Tiger is not starting up on these routes - and it's not by choice. Can you work it out?

Clearly the answer to my question was "no".
I'm not flattering anyone that Tiger will be scared of anyone's competitive response - that's your interpretation. Thanks for the warning to pay attention - I don't know why we hadn't noticed Tiger until now. I'll just go shoot some staff to wake the others up.

Dave, I (and I know many others) really value your opinion and the information you and others here provide on DJ's plans etc.

But there is no need to be sarcastic and condescending - it is actually very unlike you - which leads me to believe you are a bit frustrated by people assuming your company is sleeping on the job etc from the recent QF/JQ hogging all the news. This is only a discussion board, people are speculating because there hasn't been much news on DJ.

I for one have no doubt that you and your team have a robust plan for dealing with Tiger, Jetstar, Qantas and beyond. And just remember you are representing your company on here!

I really hope you continue to contribute in a constructive and helpful manner, like you were before all of this....

Thanks again

 

[crazydave98]

Dave, I (and I know many others) really value your opinion and the information you and others here provide on DJ's plans etc.

But there is no need to be sarcastic and condescending - it is actually very unlike you - which leads me to believe you are a bit frustrated by people assuming your company is sleeping on the job etc from the recent QF/JQ hogging all the news. This is only a discussion board, people are speculating because there hasn't been much news on DJ.

I for one have no doubt that you and your team have a robust plan for dealing with Tiger, Jetstar, Qantas and beyond. And just remember you are representing your company on here!

I really hope you continue to contribute in a constructive and helpful manner, like you were before all of this....

Thanks again

Hi Pauly7,

When someone tells me I'm dreaming and flattering myself and my company it is offensive and I think I'm entitled to be a bit narky towards the perpetrator.

I'm not frustrated at people thinking we're not on the job because we're not joining Jetstar and cough acting like a pair of seagulls squabbling over a chip. We have very deliberately stayed away from that - we're quite happy not to be associated with them. I've made the point many times that Qantas is our competitor - over 50% of our capacity competes against just Qantas and only 14% of our capacity competes against just Jetstar (and the rest against various combinations of QF/JQ/TR/ZL etc). Maybe if Jetstar and cough flew over 20 services a day SYD-MEL and SYD-BNE we would respond differently.

I value participatation AFF to get direct feedback about what members value and want and how they perceive the various airlines stack up, and believe it or not this influences decisions we make. Several members of this forum met with me and Brett Godfrey at our offices (thanks Lindsay for organising) and he trawls the boards too (G'Day Brett). But what does frustrate me are the armchair halfbacks trying to tell us how to actually run the business, or just taking every opportunity to put the boot in like some tribal football yob - definitely not meeting your criteria of "constructive and helpful". But thank you to the majority of members who are generally constructive and helpful.

CrazyDave

 

[dajop]

Well QF have now entered the fray as well. MEL-ASP has dropped from $286 to $149 for travel during the period 01 Dec - 18 Mar, which makes MEL-ASP only $9 more than AYQ-ASP (and bizarrely HBA-ASP "red e deal" some $252 more than MEL-ASP)

 

[garyjohn951]

Thank God for competition, could you imagine the 1000's we would be paying if Qantas has a monopoly.

 

[crazydave98]

man im still no closer...only things i can come up with egarding why theyve started up where they have are using underutilised airports with lower fees (ROK, MKY), lack of LCC competition (PER, ASP) established base & connectivity (DRW), and established leisure market (OOL), gives them some control over flights n prices.

As for the triangle, i remember reading that AirAsia Long Haul is considering giving SYD a miss due to high fees. Could be same deal for TT. Then again, that didn't stop DJ starting on the triangle back in '00.

All true and all will have affected Tiger's route choices - well done that man.

But when we started on SYD-BNE back in 2000 and SYD-MEL soon after, we had our very own little Domestic Express Terminal at SYD - which no longer exists (well it's now a DHL freight shed). T2 is chockers - we already can't get enough gates when we want them and that's after taking into account that because it's a common user terminal and we are the biggest user we get preference on the common user (as opposed to dedicated) gates. Standby reckoned the 80 movement an hour cap was the problem - wrong because there are "new entrant" slots reserved. But no doubt Tiger will eventually find some slots and gates at SYD at various times of the day - they just aren't going to be doing double digit frequencies on the triangle any time soon.

 

[kamchatsky]

Thank God for competition, could you imagine the 1000's we would be paying if Qantas has a monopoly.

I CANNOT WAIT when we can get cheaper tickets to SYD-AYQ/ASP ...... Right now the red centre is too expensive!

I think Tiger is doing it right by starting it at the "not so expensive and not so much competition" routes to establish a presence around Australia. it simply makes a lot of sense that way.

 

[Standby]

Hi Pauly7,

When someone tells me I'm dreaming and flattering myself and my company it is offensive and I think I'm entitled to be a bit narky towards the perpetrator.

I'm not frustrated at people thinking we're not on the job because we're not joining Jetstar and cough acting like a pair of seagulls squabbling over a chip. We have very deliberately stayed away from that - we're quite happy not to be associated with them. I've made the point many times that Qantas is our competitor - over 50% of our capacity competes against just Qantas and only 14% of our capacity competes against just Jetstar (and the rest against various combinations of QF/JQ/TR/ZL etc). Maybe if Jetstar and cough flew over 20 services a day SYD-MEL and SYD-BNE we would respond differently.

I value participatation AFF to get direct feedback about what members value and want and how they perceive the various airlines stack up, and believe it or not this influences decisions we make. Several members of this forum met with me and Brett Godfrey at our offices (thanks Lindsay for organising) and he trawls the boards too (G'Day Brett). But what does frustrate me are the armchair halfbacks trying to tell us how to actually run the business, or just taking every opportunity to put the boot in like some tribal football yob - definitely not meeting your criteria of "constructive and helpful". But thank you to the majority of members who are generally constructive and helpful.

CrazyDave

Dave pls continue to say what you passionately believe,robust discussion is good. Many posters here are actually reasonably sensible businesspersons with a resonable grasp of economics and market forces,we may not work for an airline but fundamentally the things that drive competition in the free market are no different in Avaition and most other industries...excluding Oil and banking obviously.
I said earlier I fugure so far Tiger have used around 2 and a 1/2 of the 5 aircraft they say they will start with. (I actually believe they will quietly exit a few SE Asian cities very quickly when they see how quickly Aussie punters are drawn to their entry fares-which are a heap more than they have to charge on their own turf-site todays specials of 3 cent plus taxes fares)
My punt is they will start with 8 aircraft.
Now I dont have any fancy airline scheduling tools but on a piece of paper I can make 2 aircraft do 9 return daily SYDMEL legs all within curfew.
SYDMEL is I imagine both QF and DJ most profitable route.They will think they can make money on it just as your team did when facing QF and AN. The telegraph business section hints as much today in an article "tiger bites off JQ routes".Another 3 aircraft will handle less frequency but put a stamp on MELBNE and SYD BNE and also allow them to do overnight flying from BNE & SYD to PER and DRW.
When DJ started on the eastcoast they impacted QF and AN bottom line,
This is going to happen and I'm sure your team are working in the background on protecting yr patch Brett isnt a dummy and I wouldnt suggest such.
MAC bank own SYD they will make space avail because there is money in it for them.
I'm just joining the dots here its pretty simple .I'm not having a go at you or yr company but to state they wont enter the market and they arent yr competitor are both not true.Anyone who takes any of yr customers is a competitor.
All you have to say is 1/we are watching them and 2 we have a strategy to deal with them. Snide comments are beneath yr normal imput

 

[stuartfaz]

But no doubt Tiger will eventually find some slots and gates at SYD at various times of the day - they just aren't going to be doing double digit frequencies on the triangle any time soon.

So it's possible Tiger may give the triangle a miss to start off with?

I'm having doubts about them operating from BNE, they seem to have made a point of noting on this site e-Travel Blackboard: Australia's Number One Industry Newsletter that there will be shuttle services taking Tiger passengers from OOL to Brisbane, maybe using OOL a la AVV down here. AVV with class, maybe.

Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but I found it interesting.

 

[futaris]

Wonder if the shuttlebusses will be free if you're coming/going from a TT flight.

 

[stuartfaz]

Wonder if the shuttlebusses will be free if you're coming/going from a TT flight.

Don't know. You'd think if they were to give you no other choice in how to get to BNE with them (i.e. not flying there) they'd throw it in with the fare.

Then again, the terms 'free' and 'low-cost airline' have never really gone together well...

 

[NM]

Perhaps its a shuttle bus to the train station and they expect you to take the train from there?

 

[Yada Yada]

I'm not having a go at you or yr company but [...snip...] Snide comments are beneath yr normal imput

Well, as a (mostly) regular here for more than two years, I can say that from my point of view, too many AFF members seem to attack Virgin Blue. Most of it is snide and sarcastic and just uncalled for. Too many people here behave like rusted-on QFF loyalists, taking every opportunity to slag off at other airlines, but specifically Virgin Blue. I just don't get it.

Go back and re-read some threads to see what I mean. There are consistent jibes about almost every aspect of DJ, the planes, the crews, the food, the fares, the rewards program, their competitions, etc. They even get blamed because the DJ forum here does not have many regular new posts, as if that's some reflection on the airline!

I've reduced my involvement at AFF this year because I just got sick of reading so much negative comment (including a lot of "dog whistling" type remarks) directed at Virgin Blue. I don't regard any of the responses by crazydave98 to to be unwarranted given what goes down here for "informed" comment.

 

[futaris]

Plenty of people take stabs at QF too. It's not DJ specific. A lot of people recommend flying QF and crediting to AA, simply because QF's FF program is relatively poor.

 

[d15.in.oz]

…from my point of view, too many AFF members seem to attack Virgin Blue. Most of it is snide and sarcastic and just uncalled for.

I factor Jetstar gets beaten around the ears, more often than any other airline, on AFF.

In fact, I think I often come out sounding like an apologist for them (OK, I’ll admit I might have a slight soft spot for ‘em... “…fly away, da, da, de, da…” OMG I’ve been indoctrinated - but I have no issue about denouncing their attempts at Yield Management… aka Price Rises. After all - QAN has installed, reputably, one of the world’s foremost practitioners of the dark art, as the company CEO.)

Yada Yada, I don’t mind you calling it how you see it (in fact, bring it on), or bluntly replying to my posts that “pigs may go flying past” (‘cause, truly they’re often circling my keyboard), but know that your zeal in defence of Virgin Blue, is just as passionate as those who - love and defend Qantas.

In regards to crazydave98, it might not be said, but I would imagine most on here, above anything else, respect that someone from Virgin Blue, who is obviously in the know, has the spirit to post, unofficially on behalf of their company! (Not the type of executive voice we hear from any other airline on AFF.)

My position is simple, I want heaps of market competition, loads of cheap fares, exceptional customer service and all the extra freebies I can get my hands on…plus I cough and complain when I don’t get it - just a normal customer really!

 

[jakeseven7]

Plenty of people take stabs at QF too. It's not DJ specific. A lot of people recommend flying QF and crediting to AA, simply because QF's FF program is relatively poor.

LOL I agree, but I think Jetstar cops the most beating (rightly deserved IMHO) way over and above Virgin.

And most people here seem have a love hate thing going with QF

Hopefully crazydave & yada yada continue to contribute constructively as they have in the past, giving us the inside story on DJ

 

[Mal]

Wonder if the shuttlebusses will be free if you're coming/going from a TT flight.

The Tiger CEO was quoted recently as saying that they wouldn't be free, but would be low cost in the spirit of the airline. (not exact words, but my best recollection).

 

[dajop]

Tiger have now announced MEL-LST, a daily departure from MEL @ 15:50, returning from LST @ 17:20.

What next? My tip is ADL. There are some gaps in the schedule that are a perfect fit for services to ADL (ie allowing for 2 x 30min turnarounds + 2:35 flying) I guess MEL-ADL @ 8:30 M/W/F/S and another MEL-ADL daily @ 12:15. Time will tell.

 

[stuartfaz]

Tiger have now announced MEL-LST, a daily departure from MEL @ 15:50, returning from LST @ 17:20.

TT's selling these for $39.95, no blackout.

JQ responds with a $29 MEL-LST sale from 29/11 (TT MEL-LST launch date) to 29/2/08 blackout dates 13/12/07 to 31/01/08 incl.

Same as the other TT routes, really.

EDIT: and JQ's sale fares arent available on Fridays and Sundays either.