Should I stay or should I go (EuroZone)

[Abdul_A350]

Unfortunately that position has a couple of facts against it.There are examples of similar attacks in the USA,UK,Canada,France,Belgium,Denmark,Sweden and Africa-multiple instances in most of those places.Two things are common to most-the attacker uses the word Allah and psychiatric reports are not revealed.

Unfortunately your argument makes little sense at all. If you have so many instances to cite, why cling to the most tenuous ones.

When I listen to the ongoing Catholic disaster, I hear things done by bad people, not bad Christians. Even if your "dr" is not from a real PhD, it is a little depressing to think that an ostensibly educated man could be so simplistic.

 

[amaroo]

For those claiming they 'know' what's going on because of what they see and read in the media: Paul Sheehan suspended from Sydney Morning Herald following false rape story - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

Indeed: ABC apologises for 'error' over five-year-old asylum seeker rape claims on Nauru

 

[marki]

Germany’s federal criminal police said they are in possession of files containing personal data on members of the extremist Islamic State group and believe them to be authentic?

http://www.wsj.com/articles/germany-says-it-has-files-on-islamic-state-members-1457613695

There has been a twelvefold increase in clandestine attempts to enter Britain via European ports and train tunnels since 2012, according to figures obtained by The Economist under freedom of information laws. Lorries are X-rayed for stowaways and sniffer dogs patrol regularly, making the obstacle course harder than ever. Yet this has done little to deter migrants—nor to soothe the fears of Eurosceptic voters ahead of the June 23rd referendum.

http://www.economist.com/news/brita...crease-comes-awkward-time-european-referendum

There has been some action in the Aegean and hopefully the increased presence will go some way to stopping illegal shipping of desperate people who will find safer alternatives like staying where they are as the reports trickle in that all is not so fantastic as ......housing is scarce and you automatically don't get cars ....etc ..etc. and you have to work hard and the conditions back at home are better. (as seen on TV reports!!)

 

[drron]

Unfortunately your argument makes little sense at all. If you have so many instances to cite, why cling to the most tenuous ones.

When I listen to the ongoing Catholic disaster, I hear things done by bad people, not bad Christians. Even if your "dr" is not from a real PhD, it is a little depressing to think that an ostensibly educated man could be so simplistic.

Oh my.So you obviously consider yourself much more educated than this poor soul from the colonies.
However every day there are attacks carried out in the name of Allah.Most of the victims are other muslims.The Shia/Sunni divide does cause problems.
Here is a site that lists such attacks.I do not agree with them but the list does appear accurate-
List of Islamic Terror Attacks

148 attacks in the last 30 days,1203 dead.Seems to me to be a problem.
However it is up to those muslims who object to extremism to speak up.It's a pity that those who do speak up often become ex-muslims.
So here are examples from the left of politics who describes herself as an ex-muslim atheist communist-
MARYAM NAMAZIE: Why I had to face down the bullies trying to silence my supposedly ‘offensive’ stance on Islam - One Law for All
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryam_Namazie
Press Release – women’s rights groups urge government to hold inquiry into Sharia ‘courts’ and the lack of access to justice - One Law for All

And she is the second speaker here-
[video=youtube_share;iDc2Nfxk3Bk]https://youtu.be/iDc2Nfxk3Bk[/video]

So it is important for muslims themselves to speak out about Islamism because denouncing everyone as Islamophobes is playing into the hands of the Far Right.They are gaining ground throughout the Western World.That is not good for the future.

 

[Abdul_A350]

.So you obviously consider yourself much more educated than this poor soul from the colonies.

It is difficult to be more educated than I, most people need to work for a living. Whether that matters or not is a different question.

If you have not heard Muslims denouncing extremism then you have not really been listening. A lot of extremists today are indeed Muslims. But the vast vast majority of Muslims are not extremists.

http://mediamatters.org/research/2014/08/21/muslim-leaders-have-roundly-denounced-islamic-s/200498

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kelly-james-clark/why-dont-moderate-muslims_b_8722518.html

 

[JohnK]

Oh my.So you obviously consider yourself much more educated than this poor soul from the colonies.

You can't have a meaningful debate with someone who is passionate about their beliefs.

Not all muslims are terrorists but the majority of terrorists are muslims. True or false?

 

[drron]

It is difficult to be more educated than I, most people need to work for a living. Whether that matters or not is a different question.

If you have not heard Muslims denouncing extremism then you have not really been listening. A lot of extremists today are indeed Muslims. But the vast vast majority of Muslims are not extremists.

Muslim Leaders Have Roundly Denounced Islamic State, But Conservative Media Won't Tell You That | Research | Media Matters for America

Why Don't Moderate Muslims Denounce Terrorism?

Well at least I know humility isn't one of your problems.
Your links actually support what I have said-all suggest thousands of Muslims express non agreement with the jihadis.The Twitter link in one article went to a page with 325 followers.
Problem is there are 1.5 billion muslims worldwide.It is estimated that 1% are inclined to violence and another 10-15% could be convinced to follow them.Sure that means that at least 84% of muslims are opposed to violence but you are going to need a lot more than thousands speaking out as well as many to actively work towards some way of neutralising the extremists.I don't think saying you don't believe the extremists after each attack is in any way sufficient.
Here is a local muslim's opinion-
Islam needs to invest in people and universities, not mosques

 

[esseeeayeenn]

You can't have a meaningful debate with someone who is passionate about their beliefs.

Not all muslims are terrorists but the majority of terrorists are muslims. True or false?

Manifestly false.
Unless you are artificially restricting your analysis to the past few years.
And forgetting the IRA, the German terrorist groups, etc etc.

 

[JohnK]

I don't think saying you don't believe the extremists after each attack is in any way sufficient.

I will never forget the scenes of celebration in Auburn, Lakemba and Punchbowl after 9/11. These people still live here.

In Sydney in the 90s I worked with a Kenyan muslim with Pakistani ancestors. Couldn't trust him as far as I could throw him. Always thinking of the next scam. A few of us used to catch up for drinks regularly end 1999-2000. He was always whining about the Kosovars killed in the Yugoslav civil war. Then it all turned and now innocent Christians were being killed. He said nothing during a few drink nights. Then I asked him how they were in Kosovo. He said it was all fine and smiled. I asked him if he had any sympathy for the innocent Christians dying now and he just looked at me blankly. I called him a hypocrite and that was the end of our catchups.

My eyes have seen enough. My ears have heard enough. The world is finally waking up.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

In Sydney in the 90s I worked with a Kenyan muslim with Pakistani ancestors. Couldn't trust him as far as I could throw him. Always thinking of the next scam.

But his religion probably had little, if anything, to do with his scamming.

 

[esseeeayeenn]

I am unsubscribing from this thread because it has just become an opportunity to ventilate racist sentiments.

 

[JohnK]

But his religion probably had little, if anything, to do with his scamming.

That's fine. But crying when muslims are dying and laughing when Christians are dying. What do you call that?

There is a pattern here. Just look at what's going in Europe. That's not an exaggeration.

And it's not racist. It's real life experience some choose to ignore. "If I haven't seen it, and haven't heard it then it can't be true!". Right?

 

[Franky]

(I will never forget the scenes of celebration in Auburn, Lakemba and Punchbowl after 9/11. These people still live here.)

As well as the woman dancing in the street in Palestine clapping her hands with glee. One of those things you never forget or forgive.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

As well as the woman dancing in the street in Palestine clapping her hands with glee. One of those things you never forget or forgive.

Again, that is the person, not the religion or race or ethnicity.

 

[JohnK]

Again, that is the person, not the religion or race or ethnicity.

Sorry MEL_Traveller. I really respect your knowledge and opinion on most topics but not here.

A radical muslim is still a muslim. They both believe in the koran. They both go to the same mosques. Our biggest problem for many years was ignoring all these atrocities and writing them off as radicals/extremists.

I can assure you it is muslims that need to change. Not the other way around.

 

[marki]

FYI

BREAKING: Car explosion in Charlottenburg #Berlin #Germany killing the driver was caused by bomb, background unknown

This morning was driving on my wAy to Tegel past this area !

http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2016-03-15/car-bomb-kills-driver-in-central-berlin-police/7249636

 

[Abdul_A350]

And it's not racist.

I completely agree. There is no "Muslim race". Ignorant superficial prejudiced nonsense, yes. Racist, no.

 

[Deleted member]

Unfortunately your argument makes little sense at all. If you have so many instances to cite, why cling to the most tenuous ones.

When I listen to the ongoing Catholic disaster, I hear things done by bad people, not bad Christians. Even if your "dr" is not from a real PhD, it is a little depressing to think that an ostensibly educated man could be so simplistic.

And there was me thinking , "keeping it simple" was the way to go!!!

 

[Deleted member]

Again, that is the person, not the religion or race or ethnicity.

Bollocks !!

 

[marki]

I completely agree. There is no "Muslim race". Ignorant superficial prejudiced nonsense, yes. Racist, no.

There is a systematic religious tainted observation that one like me is sub - human in the eyes a Muslim religion being female. Non - Muslim ( considered fair meat and game) walking in my attractive clothes which Cause me issues like being called all sorts of colourful names ( Not being racist) I am an infidel. ..... I would be lynched in certain countries where there is no freedom of speech.?
I think we should speak up about these facts and not be PC about it.

this is a little off topic now sorry mods

Religions are not all little lovely Lambs.

Eurozone has traditions many have at its core religion.

We should respect not just one faith. We should not be covering crosses or hiding the holy mother statues because it offends new arrivals in ( i.e. in Germany)

End my preaching rant