Safety and stupidity. Kudos Qantas, take a good look at yourself others...

[munitalP]

Qantas has suspended flights Melbourne being closed as of 6pm tonight. NZ and DJ continue to fly.

Qantas would risk profit over safety? I doesn't seem so.

Kudos Qantas

This post is regarding the decision to delay vs fly to clarify.
Chile ash cloud hits Tassie, NZ flights | News.com.au

 

[LiamR]

I think Qantas have been around long enough to know the dangers of flying in Ash Cloud (Ahem... BA9)

This is why I have a bit of a soft spot for Qantas. They NEVER put their passengers or crew in any dangerous situation.

Good on them I say.

 

[Saab34]

Not just QF.

QLink, JQ, TT. All now cancelled.

This is why I never go away on a Long Weekend!

 

[LiamR]

This just in - Virgin are stopping all Domestic and International flights from 7pm tonight.

Edit: Out of Melbourne....

 

[openseat]

I think Qantas have been around long enough to know the dangers of flying in Ash Cloud (Ahem... BA9)

This is why I have a bit of a soft spot for Qantas. They NEVER put their passengers or crew in any dangerous situation.

Good on them I say.

So what happened in Bangkok in 1999 was really just a tour of the golf course and not penny pinching about use of reverse thrust. (And of course there would be no penny pincing at QF these days).

 

[pshepvic]

This just in - Virgin are stopping all Domestic and International flights from 7pm tonight.

Edit: Out of Melbourne....

I think this was only because Melbourne airport is closed, not by their choice?

In any case, as I mentioned in the other thread on this topic, I think QF are actually being over paranoid, given their recent bad publicity on safety.

If it was completely unsafe to fly at a lower or higher altitude (as VA and NZ are doing) then CASA would have grounded all flights, and not given the airlines the discretion as to make their own choice.

The flights from Tassie that did fly today have all landed safely without incident, so therefore it was safe to fly.

I would imagine that VA also would have safety as their first priority, and I think if they in any way believed that there was a risk, they too would have grounded all flights.

 

[yohy?!]

Liam...True for QF but JQ and QFlink not so much!

Sent from my HTC Legend using AustFreqFly App

 

[straitman]

Re: Saf

I think this was only because Melbourne airport is closed, not by their choice?

The METAR, TAF and NOTAMS don't indicate that the airport is closed.

In any case, as I mentioned in the other thread on this topic, I think QF are actually being over paranoid, given their recent bad publicity on safety.

There is no way they would be not flying if they thought it safe to do so.

If it was completely unsafe to fly at a lower or higher altitude (as VA and NZ are doing) then CASA would have grounded all flights, and not given the airlines the discretion as to make their own choice.

As I said on the other thread. CASA is a toothless tiger these days and its a long weekend.

The flights from Tassie that did fly today have all landed safely without incident, so therefore it was safe to fly.

But we do not know what damage may have been caused to their engines and this is an easy assessment to make in retrospect.

I would imagine that VA also would have safety as their first priority, and I think if they in any way believed that there was a risk, they too would have grounded all flights.

Their risk assessment process is obviously different to Qantas (as mentioned elsewhere) and now they have come to the same conclusion.

 

[oz_mark]

Re: Saf

Their risk assessment process is obviously different to Qantas (as mentioned elsewhere) and now they have come to the same conclusion.

My understanding is the Virgin were waiting for a later advisory before making their decision.

 

[TonyHancock]

The BBC seems to be suggesting Air New Zealand is adjusting it's flight paths to fly beneath the cloud.

 

[Andyzx]

Where is Senator Bob Brown when you need him? Surely as the Greens party leader he would have sent a delegation to Chile to put an end to the use of carbon based ash export to NZ and Tasmania. At $40 per tonne carbon tax tariff The Puyehue-Cordon-Caulle Volcano Ash Manufacturing Company would be put out of business by now and seriously in debt to the Australian tax payer or labour party...

Senator Brown was quoted as saying

Senator Brown questioned the point of having a full rebate.

"The point of a carbon price is to have polluters pay for the pollution of the atmosphere, creating dangerous carbon climate change, and a huge threat ... to Australia's economy," he said

Brown defends carbon tax committee
:mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen: oops

 

[jb747]

So what happened in Bangkok in 1999 was really just a tour of the golf course and not penny pinching about use of reverse thrust. (And of course there would be no penny pincing at QF these days).

There is nothing wrong with the use of idle reverse thrust. It is actually mandated in many places. Nor, is there anything wrong with the use of less than full flap for landing. That is the norm on many operations. Whilst I'm happy to discuss QF1 with you, you should really read the full report, and understand that, before making throw away comments that show little aviation knowledge.

 

[RSD]

There is nothing wrong with the use of idle reverse thrust. It is actually mandated in many places. Nor, is there anything wrong with the use of less than full flap for landing. That is the norm on many operations. Whilst I'm happy to discuss QF1 with you, you should really read the full report, and understand that, before making throw away comments that show little aviation knowledge.

Any chance you could give a one paragraph summary for those of us that aren't familiar with the report? I vaguely recall seeing the incident on the TV news years ago but don't know any more than that.

 

[straitman]

Any chance you could give a one paragraph summary for those of us that aren't familiar with the report? I vaguely recall seeing the incident on the TV news years ago but don't know any more than that.

Try a google search of QF1 Bangkok and you'll get a wealth of information.

 

[jb747]

Any chance you could give a one paragraph summary for those of us that aren't familiar with the report? I vaguely recall seeing the incident on the TV news years ago but don't know any more than that.

Without going through the whole thing, the myth that is pretty pervasive, is that reverse thrust does most of the work of slowing an aircraft after it lands. The reality is that it does almost nothing. A 60,000 lb engine, might make around 3000 lbs in reverse. The vast majority of the braking comes from...the brakes. You normally can't feel that, and you certainly can't hear it.. Airbus considered reverse so useless that it wasn't even planned to be fitted on the A380, and they only fitted it to the inboard engines at the insistence of the FAA.

You can take asymmetric reverse, and you'll have barely any swing....

 

[munitalP]

heres a nice image from BOM of the dust cloud from satelite

http://www.bom.gov.au/difacs/IDX1840.gif

 

[concorde71]

Good on QF for taking early precaustion. However is anyone going to say the same for Tiger. They canned them as well. Oh sorry, thats a just a regular Tiger airways day

Seriously though, Emirates, Singapore, Cathay, they all fly into Melbourne. I know for a fact Emirates and Singapore flew into melbourne at a Lower safe altitude. I dont see the issue if CASA have approved operations, and the airlines continue to comply with CASA orders then there is no problem..
Please dont let these comments deter from the fact that I applaud QF for taking precautions, however, it seems it may be unnessesary as everyone else (You cant include tiger) is adjusting their operations according to the conditions.

 

[Nigelinoz]

Any chance you could give a one paragraph summary for those of us that aren't familiar with the report? I vaguely recall seeing the incident on the TV news years ago but don't know any more than that.

Here's the ATSB report on the incident.
Investigation: 199904538 - Boeing Co 747-438, VH-OJH, Bangkok, Thailand, 23 September 1999
Cheers
N'oz

 

[RSD]

Seriously though, Emirates, Singapore, Cathay, they all fly into Melbourne. I know for a fact Emirates and Singapore flew into melbourne at a Lower safe altitude. I dont see the issue if CASA have approved operations, and the airlines continue to comply with CASA orders then there is no problem..

But who is saying that CASA has it right? I would trust QF's judgement more than CASA's.

 

[stomplad]

Not just QF.

QLink, JQ, TT. All now cancelled.

This is why I never go away on a Long Weekend!

I agree. That long weekend backlog is just going to be hideous after today's flights are cancelled. Airports wont be nice to hang out in not even at the overcrowded QP.