Rolling – on the Indian Pacific from inSYDnificant to PERfection

[tgh]

Thanks for another informative and entertaining TR..

 

[Bundy Bear]

Good TR thanks John

 

[RooFlyer]

Nice one.

Back on the train and continuing. I awoke next morning when we were about 100km west of Kalgoorlie.

Did the train stop at Kal (obviously during the night)? Used to, in the evening. Picked up Kal pax who were well lubricated! We got a change of crew there and the difference was startling. The WA crew, I'm sorry to say, were a bit surly (this was some time ago!!).

 

[JohnM]

Nice one.



Did the train stop at Kal (obviously during the night)? Used to, in the evening. Picked up Kal pax who were well lubricated! We got a change of crew there and the difference was startling. The WA crew, I'm sorry to say, were a bit surly (this was some time ago!!).

It stops at Kalgoorlie on the Perth-Sydney journey: Indian Pacific Off Train Experiences - Journey Beyond Rail

That is why I suggested that anyone considering the journey look closely at the off-train offerings, as the trip is not a simple mirror-image each way. It's all about crossing the Nullarbor during the day.

I don't know that you can join in Kalgoorlie. Remember, the Indian Pacific is now entirely a tourist 'experience' train. It is not really for commuting. For example, it no longer has the old 'Red' class, which was recliner seats.

The crewing system all operates out of Adelaide (Journey Beyond HQ is there.) Part (I guess half) of our crew from SYD-ADL departed and their replacement, I believe, would do ADL-PER-ADL-SYD-ADL then swap out for a week off. I presume the other half would do ADL-SYD-ADL-PER-ADL, then swap out for their week off.

 

[henleybeach]

I also understand that drivers also change here. Given that the Indian Pacific only passes Cook twice per week, that implies that drivers rotate between freight trains and the IP. I’m guessing that Journey Beyond owns the passive rolling stock, while Pacific National is contracted to provide the motive rolling stock. Paging @henleybeach to comment or elaborate

Yes Cook is the location where the Port Augusta and Kalgoorlie Drivers use for rest (barracks). They arrive in on a train, rest for a minimum of 8 hours and works a train back. Earlier in the year when there was the floods which washed away the track, some drivers were stuck in Cook for 3 weeks!
Pacific National (PN) is used on a hook and pull contract for all Journey Beyond trains. PN own the locomotives and drivers and journey beyond own the rollingstock and onboard staff. All onboard staff are located in ADL and complete whole journeys ex Adl.
Did you have one locomotive from Adelaide? Obviously 2 from Sydney because of the blue mountains, but one locomotive would have had sufficient horsepower across to Perth.

Between Parkes and Broken Hill is the worst track, always has been and continues to be.
SA and WA have always had very good track maintenance however NSW and VIC have always lacked it.

 

[JohnM]

Yes Cook is the location where the Port Augusta and Kalgoorlie Drivers use for rest (barracks). They arrive in on a train, rest for a minimum of 8 hours and works a train back. Earlier in the year when there was the floods which washed away the track, some drivers were stuck in Cook for 3 weeks!
Pacific National (PN) is used on a hook and pull contract for all Journey Beyond trains. PN own the locomotives and drivers and journey beyond own the rollingstock and onboard staff. All onboard staff are located in ADL and complete whole journeys ex Adl.
Did you have one locomotive from Adelaide? Obviously 2 from Sydney because of the blue mountains, but one locomotive would have had sufficient horsepower across to Perth.

Between Parkes and Broken Hill is the worst track, always has been and continues to be.
SA and WA have always had very good track maintenance however NSW and VIC have always lacked it.

Thanks, HB. Very informative and confirming what I had deduced.

Yes, only one loco ADL-PER: NR54. NR27 and NR59 had lugged us from Lithgow-ADL.

 

[RooFlyer]

I don't know that you can join in Kalgoorlie. Remember, the Indian Pacific is now entirely a tourist 'experience' train. It is not really for commuting. For example, it no longer has the old 'Red' class, which was recliner seats.

Yes, that would be the difference. I recall (vaguely ....) that a couple of young blokes who boarded at Kal would constitute what you would call an instant 'naughty group' and, well ....

 

[VPS]

Thanks for the TR. That would have been very rushed to see McLaren vale but the star of greece has great views

 

[jukebox333]

Entertaining TR John, thanks.

The timings of the IP have changed over the years. I took it when emigrating from Sydney back in 1993, and as @RooFlyer mentioned, it was a 9pm or so stop in Kal coming Westbound. The off train excursion back then was a quick look at the "starting stalls" on Hay Street.

That 10pm departure got us in to East Perth at 10am on a Sunday morning, where, back in 1993, I was greeted by the sight of median strip signs at traffic lights pointing to "Roster Petrol"...

 

[JohnM]

Entertaining TR John, thanks.

The timings of the IP have changed over the years. I took it when emigrating from Sydney back in 1993, and as @RooFlyer mentioned, it was a 9pm or so stop in Kal coming Westbound. The off train excursion back then was a quick look at the "starting stalls" on Hay Street.

That 10pm departure got us in to East Perth at 10am on a Sunday morning, where, back in 1993, I was greeted by the sight of median strip signs at traffic lights pointing to "Roster Petrol"...

Obviously back in the day, now long gone, when it was a passenger train.

 

[BAM1748]

And on we go into the state of PERfection. Next stop Rawlinna – a very large sheep station. Here we stop and disembark for dinner beside the train, set up by the Rawlinna people and served by the train crew. Menu: roast lamb – what else?

View attachment 304910View attachment 304911View attachment 304912View attachment 304913View attachment 304914View attachment 304915View attachment 304916

Back on the train and continuing. I awoke next morning when we were about 100km west of Kalgoorlie.

The journey through to PER was quite slow on the final day. We had several stops to allow other traffic to pass. It was, however, nicely timed to have lunch coming down the Avon Valley from Northam, through Toodyay, to run alongside the Avon River, just below the right side windows. I became engrossed talking a couple from MEL who were going to have a few days in PER before flying to DRW to go on The Ghan to ADL, so I didn’t take any pics of the lunchtime view.

Possibly some of the stops were to align with that timing, as well as giving way to other traffic. Maybe @BAM1748 or @henleybeach can offer some insights.

<snipped>


While the classic coast-to-coast aspect of the Indian Pacific holds an innate attraction, I think that the SYD-ADL sector could easily be foregone for anyone who has been to Broken Hill and to the Barossa, McLaren Vale or Hahndorf, the major off-train options.

Furthermore, the SYD-ADL sector is by far the worst section of track. This is well-known. Many people were saying that they slept very badly on the first night, but I had no trouble.

So, with that, the end.

Stops, while aligned for passenger side trips and meals also allow brake inspections (walking the train checking brake shoe wear), fueling, train crosses (opposing movements of trains) as generally the IP or Ghan can outpace trains going the same direction. Trains have several types when it comes to priority, Pass and A, B and C class. Passenger and A class freight is good for 115km/h down to 80km/h and 60km/h. Operators pay a different fee for different classes and priorities.

Priority and pulling over for others to pass is part of how it works as no capital city is connected with double track all the way. When heading Sydney to Perth the double track runs to Wallerawang which is 150km west of Sydney (used to be double track to Orange but a pencil pusher fixed that), then the next several thousand km's is single track with crossing loops for trains to pass each other.

If some one I know isn't sure they want a big train trip I suggest trying the Adelaide to Sydney section, it's 24 hours so you get to try the who thing for a day.

The Sydney to Adelaide line only opened right through in 1970, the Indian Pacific has only been running operating since 1970. Not that long ago. The line the Broken Hill was until 1970 a branch line from Parkes albeit 800km long. NSW managed the maintenance to BH and Commonwealth Railways then Australian National now ARTC (Australian Rail Track Corp) managed the maintenance from BH into South Australia. The road bed on the NSW of the boarder is rougher as it was originally a pioneer line although it could have been improved by now if Govt's were willing. On the SA side of the boarder they have a narrow gauge line from BH to Peterborough which was abandoned in 1970.

Having said that, the second night sleeping on any train is better than the first because your usually so tired from not sleeping properly the first night.

Here is a shot of mine from 1988 of the Indian Pacific near Peterborough SA, Hauled by Australian National locos, stainless cars owned by Commonwealth Railways and the two red cars owned by State Rail Authority of NSW for sit up service to all the intermediate stops along the way or for $165 you could travel Sydney to Perth sitting up and pay for meals as you went. Note, on the right it looks like a wash or creek with some trees, that's the old South Australian Railways road bed for the narrow gauge to BH.

https://flic.kr/p/ZEGCD3

 

[BAM1748]

Entertaining TR John, thanks.

The timings of the IP have changed over the years. I took it when emigrating from Sydney back in 1993, and as @RooFlyer mentioned, it was a 9pm or so stop in Kal coming Westbound. The off train excursion back then was a quick look at the "starting stalls" on Hay Street.

That 10pm departure got us in to East Perth at 10am on a Sunday morning, where, back in 1993, I was greeted by the sight of median strip signs at traffic lights pointing to "Roster Petrol"...

The half hour/hour Kal stop was to fuel the locomotives, as was the stop at Cook and there was one in the night at Tarcoola back in those days as well as Broken Hill.

Fuel stop at Cook, March 1994.

https://flic.kr/p/EKSkBb

 

[SeatBackForward]

Pass and A, B and C class. Passenger and A class freight is good for 115km/h down to 80km/h and 60km/h. Operators pay a different fee for different classes and priorities.

As opposed to the US method, where the vast majority of tracks are privately owned, and the Amtrak passenger services can often wait for hours to let the privately run freight trains take priority.

 

[NM]

So, it seems if you want to become a member of the "naughty" group, you need to travel on The Ghan. The IP seems to be for the "nice" people in the lead up to the big bloke in the red suit coming to visit.

Great report and its been on my bucket list for a few years now.

 

[BAM1748]

As opposed to the US method, where the vast majority of tracks are privately owned, and the Amtrak passenger services can often wait for hours to let the privately run freight trains take priority.

Correct, privately owned except the North East Corridor. Not all the freight railroads are created equal when it comes to dispatching Amtrak.

I'm thinking of a ride on the California Zephyr (Chicago to Sacramento return) in February to enjoy travelling the Rockies and Sierra Nevada's in winter which doesn't have a great on time record.

Here are some stats and which railroads cause the most delays.

Freight Delays and Your Amtrak Service

Delays can happen for a variety of reasons, but the leading cause of delay to Amtrak trains is “freight train interference.”

www.amtrak.com

 

[CorvettePete]

Hi John, great trip report.

I thought that I would add a few comments as we have just got back from taking the Indian Pacific from Perth to Sydney.

I agree with you that the off train experiences are better going from Sydney to Perth. In fact, for ourt trip, the only times that we got off the train was in Rawlinna for breakfast (egg and bacon rolls), in Cook for 30 minutes during the refuelling and in Adelaide for about 2 hours.

When we originally booked (in about 2019), there was a Broken Hill stop and a Kalgoorlie stop and a longer stop in Adelaide and a stop in the Blue Mountains. The Broken Hill stop had been dropped months before we went on the train. We missed the Kalgoorlie one because we were waiting for a freight train and the Adelaide stop was shortened because the train was running late.

Our train ended at Lithgow and we were bussed to Katoomba from where we got a special train to Central. Because we were running late, the Blue Mountains excursion was cancelled.

Each passenger got $150 refund for missing the Kalgoorlie stop but nothing for the other disruptions.

As you said in one of your comments, it is very much an on-board experience.

We had one of the Platinum rooms with a Queen bed and (I think) a larger bathroom than Gold. The lounge and the restaurant were also quite roomy. I understand that the food is largely the same but that Platinum get an extra starter with dinner. The wine and drink choices are different. We made the most of the free flowing drinks.

I was very keen to do it as I had done the trip when I was about 12 (a long time ago) and wanted to relive it. I am happy that we did it but I think that you have to be ready to go with the flow when things done run to plan.

(Our trip was more complicated as we drove to Perth, took the train to Sydney, flew back to Perth and then drove home to Canberra. It did mean that we got to see Kalgoorlie and Broken Hill - and many other places.)

Thanks for doing your trip report.

 

[JohnM]

One of the things that I have noticed in recent times, as I drive past East Perth station on Sunday mornings prior to departure of the train is that there no longer seems to be the car transport car behind the loco. In the past, it seemed to be a fixture. Maybe they don't offer that option any more for their own reasons or because it declined to much in popularity.

 

[NM]

One of the things that I have noticed in recent times, as I drive past East Perth station on Sunday mornings prior to departure of the train is that there no longer seems to be the car transport car behind the loco. In the past, it seemed to be a fixture. Maybe they don't offer that option any more for their own reasons or because it declined to much in popularity.

They still advertise it as a service:

Motorail - Journey Beyond Rail

www.journeybeyondrail.com.au

 

[JohnM]

They still advertise it as a service:

Motorail - Journey Beyond Rail

www.journeybeyondrail.com.au

Interesting. Maybe the uptake is zero of late.

Also, on the IP it's only available between PER-ADL and reverse. I had never thought about that limitation before.

I recall that the last one I saw some months ago with cars prepped to go out of PER on a Sunday morning only had about two cars. Pre-Covid it was often probably 6-10 or more. It always just seemed part of the train as I drove past on Sunday mornings.

I'll be more conscious of checking it out in the weeks to come.

 

[drron]

Really enjoyed the TR. Have wanted to do this for a long time and were booked for Christmas 2021 but that didn’t happen.
So it looks like a trip ADL- PER with hopefully our car coming along at the back of the train.