Refused J upgrade - onboard it was empty.

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A100

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Bit of a disappointing experience on VA today. Tried to use one of my complimentary WP upgrades both on the phone and then again at the lounge. Told there was no seats. Get onboard and J is totally empty. Not a good look for a WP. Are they making it harder to redeem these upgrades? Not what I have come to expect of VA treatment of their platinums which is generally very good.
 
The thing to take away from this was that you were told there were no seats/it was a full cabin, when it wasn't. That said, just because there is a seat free doesn't mean you should be able to upgrade, and this is a commonly debated topic. In the US, they fill the front cabin, but this is not the case in Australia .More common is they'll upgrade you/take into account your request if they need to sell more Y seats. Just because you have the points or WP upgrades doesn't mean you should be able to use them whenever you like. I do agree that if they lied to you though, that's not on. Perhaps there was a miscommunication and they meant to say no more seats in the fare bucket they'd need to upgrade you.
 
The thing to take away from this was that you were told there were no seats/it was a full cabin, when it wasn't. That said, just because there is a seat free doesn't mean you should be able to upgrade, and this is a commonly debated topic.

I'd certainly be debating it when the J cabin is empty. :?:
 
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I'd certainly be debating it when the J cabin is empty. :?:

Yeah that seems really odd, but just because you can doesn't mean you'll always get a yes is what I meant.

Maybe empty cabin = no catering etc.

That would be my guess too. No sales so they hadn't assigned a FA to that area.

Empty cabin in J would allow crewing to be reduced by one, a significant cost saver versus potential upgrade revenue.
 
Similar thing happened to me on qantas which the way it was done I construed as disingenuous behavior. What's wrong with the truth?? Sorry we are maintaining a few spare seats?
 
Re the VA catering, two friends recently used points at the last minute to upgrade on VA between MEL and SYD on a morning weekday flight. (I do not know how many hours in advance they did this).

The FA said that 'there is no catering for you' (as there was only one other J passenger) but somehow the FA found suitable meals or refreshments (presumably breakfast).

As an aside, the crew used the J bins to store their bags. My friend expressed surprise that the bins were full: the FA sheepishly admitted that they were not supposed to use the J bins but 'no one showed on the manifest as booked in J.'
 
Empty cabin in J would allow crewing to be reduced by one, a significant cost saver versus potential upgrade revenue.

Don't disagree this is possible. But the CSS looks after J, that person will still be on the aircraft. Surely their other duties as supervisor would prevent them for taking on the full role of another cabin crew?
 
I'd certainly be debating it when the J cabin is empty. :?:

So hard to tell I guess...

What if a group of 4 had missed their connection/changed flights at the last minute for example and that at the time took up all the seats VA were prepared to release? They only make a few seats avail to upgrades....

Although unlikely I know, there are so many variables that we have no visibility about its hard to comment!
 
So hard to tell I guess...

What if a group of 4 had missed their connection/changed flights at the last minute for example and that at the time took up all the seats VA were prepared to release? They only make a few seats avail to upgrades....

Although unlikely I know, there are so many variables that we have no visibility about its hard to comment!

Fair comment. I'm used to knowing what awaits me through Expertflyer.
 
Don't disagree this is possible. But the CSS looks after J, that person will still be on the aircraft. Surely their other duties as supervisor would prevent them for taking on the full role of another cabin crew?

It allows them to drop a crew member as the dedicated J is not needed, it was posted here by a VA insider a little while ago, with crew going from 5 to 4 from memory.
 
It allows them to drop a crew member as the dedicated J is not needed, it was posted here by a VA insider a little while ago, with crew going from 5 to 4 from memory.

I presume that would require a bit of advance planning i.e., they wouldn't turn away a FA at the last minute. So if a few people rolled up at the last minute and wanted to by a J seat, would they turn them away?
 
I presume that would require a bit of advance planning i.e., they wouldn't turn away a FA at the last minute. So if a few people rolled up at the last minute and wanted to by a J seat, would they turn them away?

This would be interesting to find out.

As markis10 pointed out - some aircraft going out with one less FA does presumeably save money, say in the OP's case they saved say $500 in wages, but if the OP gives up flying VA because of their experience and starts flying QF, then how much money has VA saved? I would suggest that VA would have saved $500 now and potentially sacrificed at least twice that amount if not more in future bookings and potntial revenue.
 
While airlines are cut throat, Saving $500 wouldn't worth the effort considering the scheduling of aircraft and crews overall. That crew member would be getting off this flight onto another so would be needed elsewhere before or after.

Matt
 
I presume that would require a bit of advance planning i.e., they wouldn't turn away a FA at the last minute. So if a few people rolled up at the last minute and wanted to by a J seat, would they turn them away?

Not sure why the OP was refused the upgrade, but as mentioned earlier, it could have been there were connecting J guests who didnt make it, maybe he left the request too late,( is it up to 40mins prior for an upgrade in the lounge?) or they had reduced the number of reward/comp seats allocated for that flight. Who knows !


In regards to crew members on a 737 , there is always a minimum of 4 crew, 1 x cabin Supervisor and 3 cabin Crew.
It is the cabin supervisor who looks after J, so if there are no J guests onboard they assist the cabin crew with the food service.

Pretty sure the only time there are 5 crew ( 1 x CS, 4 x CC) is when the scheduled flight time is less than 1.5hrs, as the 5th crew member is there to assist for service related duties, and not for operational reasons, ie safety requirements etc as I have often seen a 4 crew complement on shorter flights as well.
They probably wont replace the 5th crew if someone goes sick or if the network is under stress as that 5th crew member may be used elsewhere
 
While airlines are cut throat, Saving $500 wouldn't worth the effort considering the scheduling of aircraft and crews overall. That crew member would be getting off this flight onto another so would be needed elsewhere before or after.

Matt

Not necessarily, its quite feasible that yield management can put together a sting of such flights, or even a return where the extra person becomes the standby shift.
 
FA's dont earn a hell of a lot, they might save $25/$30 in wages MEL-SYD for one person
 
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