Qantas to outsource ground handling across Australia

[AIRwin]

And larger international aircraft have already been flying on some domestic routes (e.g. Jetstar 787 Dreamliners are flying from Melbourne to the Gold Coast and Cairns).

 

[Must...Fly!]

And larger international aircraft have already been flying on some domestic routes (e.g. Jetstar 787 Dreamliners are flying from Melbourne to the Gold Coast and Cairns).

Exactly right. And more A380s flying too.

 

[jb747]

QF rejects the union’s claims that the recent disruptions are linked to the decision 18 months ago to outsource ground handling at airports:

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/featured/easter-travel/

A letter I read the other day, from someone trying to actually do the flights, laid the blame for his various delays over the week on a number of groups….all of which have been outsourced. There’s a reason DNATA were nicknamed “do nothing at the airport”.

 

[Daver6]

Clearly saving them money.... Qantas Forced to Fly a Boeing Dreamliner Full of Lost Bags But No Passengers

 

[Must...Fly!]

What the hell do the federal government have to do with any of it. Incoherent ramblings from the TWU

Oh right, election in 5 weeks

 

[AIRwin]

Qantas Forced to Fly a Boeing Dreamliner Full of Lost Bags But No Passengers

Looks like it was QF6115 operated by VH-ZNH?

 

[TheInsider]

What the hell do the federal government have to do with any of it. Incoherent ramblings from the TWU

Oh right, election in 5 weeks

Federal govt didn't pay Job Keeper to any of the ground handlers nor catering companies. Therefore losing a lot of workers.

 

[eastwest101]

Federal govt didn't pay Job Keeper to any of the ground handlers nor catering companies. Therefore losing a lot of workers.

I think it was actually the "foreign" owned ground handlers and catering companies wasn't it? I find it a very quaint idea that if you perform a job for a foreign-owned company then your job somehow does not matter. A lot of the outsourced ground handlers, caterers and other support staff like security screening were all foreign-owned. So jobkeeper kept all the people in the head office in a job, but anyone who actually does something, and/or has the misfortune to be employed by a foreign-owned company lost their jobs and went elsewhere. Along with the voluntary and involuntary staff redundancies at all the airlines of course.

Looks like Bain and Qantas took a 2012 solution to a 2020 problem and then got caught out by its own outsourcing contractors being ineligible for Jobkeeper, and have run into an epic labor/skills shortage and lack of contractor capacity in 2021. A massive "own goal" by the airlines but also partly responsible State and Federal governments who couldn't see the future in front of them plain as day.

 

[justinbrett]

Federal govt didn't pay Job Keeper to any of the ground handlers nor catering companies. Therefore losing a lot of workers.

Which is a subsidiary of Emirates, fully owned by the Government of Dubai. Which is not short of cash.

The D in DNATA stands for Dubai, and the N stands for National - not our nation, theirs.

 

[TheInsider]

Which is a subsidiary of Emirates, fully owned by the Government of Dubai. Which is not short of cash.

The D in DTATA stands for Dubai, and the N stands for National - not our nation, theirs.

Still employs Australian workers, like it or not the workers are the ones who got screwed over.

DNATA actually stands for Do Nothing At The Airport
Swissport is also HNA Group

 

[justinbrett]

Still employs Australian workers, like it or not the workers are the ones who got screwed over.

DNATA actually stands for Do Nothing At The Airport
Swissport is also HNA Group

Only companies with a downturn in revenue were eligible.

The workers were entitled to jobseeker which was the same rate, so were not personally disadvantaged. The employer, a foreign government, cannot benefit from taxpayer funds. I hope Qantas has well written contacts and they’re taking Emirates to the cleaners right now for penalty fees.

There’s plenty of YouTube videos from former Emirates cabin crew that indicate they are not a great company to work for.

 

[Must...Fly!]

Maybe one should look toward the businesses who outsourced to foreign owned companies? Qantas broke the law in the process for ramp services, don't forget.

Bain

What do they have to do with it? BNE/SYD/MEL/ADL are VA customer and ramp operations, not outsourced. As far as I can recall they haven't outsourced anything since taking over either.

 

[justinbrett]

Maybe one should look toward the businesses who outsourced to foreign owned companies? Qantas broke the law in the process for ramp services, don't forget.

Apparently. I still don’t understand what Qantas did wrong. Surely it’s up to them if they want to outsource. Someone’s gonna need a whiteboard to explain that one to me.

If anything, current situation is why you outsource. Assuming QF has good contracts, the risk and liability for providing catering and ground handling rests on the contractors.

Something tells me though Qantas doesn’t have good contracts.

 

[eastwest101]

Maybe one should look toward the businesses who outsourced to foreign owned companies? Qantas broke the law in the process for ramp services, don't forget.


What do they have to do with it? BNE/SYD/MEL/ADL are VA customer and ramp operations, not outsourced. As far as I can recall they haven't outsourced anything since taking over either.

Yep - and that's why VA have been less affected than QF regarding baggage, or at least not so much in the mainstream news, although in some of their smaller ports I think VA might use Swissport or DNATA contractors so will be interesting to see how things go moving forward. My point was more about the generalized cost-cutting of both airlines with regard to aircrew and also ground crew, they are all suffering from labour/skills shortages now, and I suspect that many people think that the aviation industry has no job security, so won't be able to attract new staff. As a matter of fact, any industry that was seen as "disposable" (e.g. hospitality, tourism etc) will be having trouble attracting staff, so no surprises there.

 

[Must...Fly!]

Surely it’s up to them if they want to outsource. Someone’s gonna need a whiteboard to explain that one to me.

Try the explanation from the court that made the decision?

I am not a poster boy for being negative about outsourcing but what Qantas did was pretty wild.

Qantas used COVID as a 'window of opportunity' to illegally outsource ground crew, court finds

The Federal Court finds in favour of the Transport Workers Union against Qantas in a case challenging the outsourcing of about 2,000 ground crew jobs by the airline.

www.abc.net.au

 

[justinbrett]

Try the explanation from the court that made the decision?

I am not a poster boy for being negative about outsourcing but what Qantas did was pretty wild.

Qantas used COVID as a 'window of opportunity' to illegally outsource ground crew, court finds

The Federal Court finds in favour of the Transport Workers Union against Qantas in a case challenging the outsourcing of about 2,000 ground crew jobs by the airline.

www.abc.net.au

Nope, you’re gonna need the whiteboard

Still don’t get it. Don’t know why you think it’s wild. Maybe I’m just a capitalist pig.

 

[Must...Fly!]

Nope, you’re gonna need the whiteboard

Still don’t get it. Don’t know why you think it’s wild. Maybe I’m just a capitalist pig.

I am almost the polar opposite of a unionist but I can see what is wrong with what was done...

 

[jase05]

Nope, you’re gonna need the whiteboard

Still don’t get it. Don’t know why you think it’s wild. Maybe I’m just a capitalist pig.

As a strong anti unionist who despises the TWU I tend to agree

 

[drron]

When you read the Judges comments on the QF outsourcing case he put emphasis on the difference in evidence of 2 QF executives who at the time were involved in the outsourcing. he particularly mentions the evidence of one which made the judge think it was not all above board. That exec now works for VA. I am a cynic.

 

[RAM]

Clearly saving them money.... Qantas Forced to Fly a Boeing Dreamliner Full of Lost Bags But No Passengers

The cost of flying between SYD & MEL is much less that extra gate fees at SYD & MEL for a large number of delayed flights.

Q by using larger aircraft (due to low number of international flights) means they need a longer turnaround time (& more staff working longer hours) per larger plane.

The turnaround time for a B737 or A320 is much shorter than that required for a B787 or A330 (for example). The domestic ground handling contract is based on the lower capacity aircraft being virtually all that are serviced by the Q domestic terminals ground handlers (nearly Aust-wide with DNATA).

Q unilaterally substituting widebody for narrow body planes is the main reason for the flights leaving without bags, Q will not pay for (& likely DNATA cannot find) previously experienced staff to work for ten days to two weeks over this school holiday/Easter/Anzac peak demand period.

DNATA's contract should not see them liable for Q 'enhancing' customers' experience. Should and won't do not necessarily follow if it was all left to the lawyers (as too often happens in business without operational execs reading the contract carefully). Even with banks and multi-hundred million fixed rate loans - see the lawyers miss crucial details such as early refinancing with no penalties if interest rates drop in the interim ten years (one case I came across). Cost a major bank close to $63m as they'd locked in 10yr fixed rate funding and lent it to this company plus a margin. Oops. Still kept chasing that company's business though.

Time will tell (note to Q accounts in Aug 2022 revealed perhaps?) who foots the bill for this customer 'enhancement'.