Qantas rolls out Classic Plus Flight Rewards

[MooTime]

Look at the US, they're the "innovators" in this space. Everyone is just basically following the big 3 US airlines.

The US are innovators cos why........they near on 1st to introduce dynamic pricing. Hardly a claim to fame.
Another case of oh yeah let's follow the yanks. For what positive result.....

 

[encryptededdy]

For what positive result.....

Profits for the airlines

 

[MooTime]

Profits for the airlines

That's fine, but we're on a FF website. What's our benefit?

 

[elanshin]

The US are innovators cos why........they near on 1st to introduce dynamic pricing. Hardly a claim to fame.
Another case of oh yeah let's follow the yanks. For what positive result.....

For maximising profit. Which is what companies try to do. Never said anything about it being better for thr consumer.

 

[Brissy1]

My mistake, I should have said half a trillion, not billion!

When you type that number out, you realise why you're never going to get a classic award seat to LHR in J: the naive keen Qantas collector's 500,000 points is fighting against 500,000,000,000 other points for that seat.

Then at 1c/ point, instead of buying toasters all the qff'ers could together buy over ½ of Qantas Airlines (market cap $b9.5)

 

[levelnine]

That's fine, but we're on a FF website. What's our benefit?

None. Unless you count the realisation that FF schemes are not for our benefit as a benefit.

Then at 1c/ point, instead of buying toasters all the qff'ers could together buy over ½ of Qantas Airlines (market cap $b9.5)

One of the benefits of having your own currency. You get to decide what they can be redeemed for. If people could actually redeem them for cold hard cash at 1c/pt, almost everyone but the most hardcore FF user would take that option.

 

[RooFlyer]

Then at 1c/ point, instead of buying toasters all the qff'ers could together buy over ½ of Qantas Airlines (market cap $b9.5)

Yes! < Fist pump>

You’ve got Qantas points with fuel, with wine, theatre tickets, toasters, meals oh and even for the occasional flight.

Ta-dah! I bring you Qantas Shares (TM). Get Qantas points for your share sales (rather than cash) and buy shares again with Qantas points - except paying the brokerage in cash of course.

You will now get points instead of cash for the Qantas share buyback scheme

 

[QPProletarian]

Wonder if this begins to create tax implications, I guess the loophole is this is another way of applying a dynamic approximate value just like gift card redemptions.

 

[ChrisMars]

It will be interesting to read the next PointHacks point valuation article. Last QFF currency valuation was at 1.9

 

[flyguy77]

Last QFF currency valuation was at 1.9

They are pretty much just making up numbers with these really - it's not exactly long-term PhD level data analysis going on....

Pointhacks is a website that makes its income from advertising points and credit card sign ups - It is always in their own self interest to promote points.

Due to this they will always label them as more valuable than they actually are and never really emphasise the many limitations.

 

[aikman]

They are pretty much just making up numbers with these really - it's not exactly long-term PhD level data analysis going on....

Pointhacks is a website that makes its income from advertising points and credit card sign ups - It is always in their own self interest to promote points.

Due to this they will always label them as more valuable than they actually are and never really emphasise the many limitations.

Agree. Anyone who values QF points more than AA miles has zero credibility.

 

[diamondhands]

The comments on those point valuation articles are always the best part. The logic they apply to their valuations is contradictory with the main goal of recommending programs they can get affiliate revenue from.

One of the reasons they say QFF points are so valuable is that they are easy to obtain. In what world does endless supply make something valuable…

 

[tdimdad]

At the moment, we have no idea how many classic award seats they released on different routes (eg to/from LHR in premium cabins), meaning they could release 0 on the most in-demand routes and still be consistent with their 5 mil claim.

I think the critical aspect would be predictability of reward availability. The total pool of points in circulation is of less interest because only a tiny fraction of the point holders would be actively redeeming them for the same rewards at the same time with you. Yes, there is competition and a redemption has no guarantees but to me the key piece would be an FF member knowing what the available redemption options are.

The current mass drops of CR seats is far removed from any predictability and that should be stopped. I wonder if there would be basis to challenge that practice through ACCC, arguing that the company provides no visibility to the service offering but customers sign up & pay up but are left blind on what's available for redemption?

 

[I love to travel]

It really pays NOT to rely on the calender if it is only showing classic plus and search by day. Occasionally a nice surprise.

 

[elanshin]

I think the critical aspect would be predictability of reward availability. The total pool of points in circulation is of less interest because only a tiny fraction of the point holders would be actively redeeming them for the same rewards at the same time with you. Yes, there is competition and a redemption has no guarantees but to me the key piece would be an FF member knowing what the available redemption options are.

The current mass drops of CR seats is far removed from any predictability and that should be stopped. I wonder if there would be basis to challenge that practice through ACCC, arguing that the company provides no visibility to the service offering but customers sign up & pay up but are left blind on what's available for redemption?

Thats very hard to argue and C+ will have deterred a lot of that. I think there were some senate enquiries directed at this last year.

Basically from a regulatory pov, it'll be hard to argue that CR are not available (they are, just lots of demand and people fighting for them). Qantas is doing something (C+) to help people find more flights. C+ are generally still cheaper than the cost acquisition most of time.

It just doesn't help our cause of getting CR flights.

 

[downgraded]

is far removed from any predictability

I'm a bit over all these complaints about a lack of predictability. So what? It actually randomises who might see them which will broaden the accessibility of CRs to a wider audience - probably something QF wants as it allows the message to get out that "well we found CR seats". By reducing the gaming of the process it actually makes it fairer.

 

[Flyfrequently]

Slightly OT, but received Qantas Insights Crew survey about Classic +
Told them what I thought, probably not what they wanted to hear

My experience with CR over the last 9 years has reaped F and J redemptions for 2 pax to UK, Europe and USA almost yearly - never had trouble getting seats.
I do consider ourselves fortunate in that regard.

 

[Doctore1003]

I find myself thinking differently about the value of Qantas Points now.

I just cancelled a domestic Y->J upgrade request for PER-MEL next week. Previously I had no problem spending 54k points this way (for 2 pax). But now I think of those points almost like actual money - and 54k points x 1.5 cents works out to over $800.

I just can't justify it.

The risk of CR drying up in a few years makes me want to save points for future CR+ bookings in case that's my only option.

Anyone else feel this way?

 

[CaptJCool]

The question of how many CR seats

5 million
Last half year
14.5 million on QF dom & int
29 million



At most on average = 17.3%
So if a 737 has 162 Y seats & 12 J
Then 28 Y and 2 J are open for CR

Seat maps | Qantas AU

View the onboard seat maps for the aircraft in our fleet including A380, Boeing 747 and the new Qantas 787-9 Dreamliner.

www.qantas.com

Hence the concern and surprise about 20,000,000 seats open to CR
By the time you take out EK Metal codeshare plus etc
And add back CR JQ options
THEN
You might be talking 14 Y CR on a 737 with 2 J CR

 

[MelbFlyer]

I find myself thinking differently about the value of Qantas Points now.

I just cancelled a domestic Y->J upgrade request for PER-MEL next week. Previously I had no problem spending 54k points this way (for 2 pax). But now I think of those points almost like actual money - and 54k points x 1.5 cents works out to over $800.

I just can't justify it.

The risk of CR drying up in a few years makes me want to save points for future CR+ bookings in case that's my only option.

Anyone else feel this way?

I think it depends on the amount of points you have and how much value you put into them.

For me, I'm not a massive points earner (should just be able to reach Points Club in a few months time - but I did top-up some points a few months ago as I did the sums and it was cheaper to buy points then redeem award seats, than to buy a regular revenue seat - so that helped toward the progress to PC).

I'd personally not spend points on a domestic trip in business but would rather save up / use points for international business reward seats. If I was earning points as if printing money, no question yes (even if only in 737 business).

But yes overall, moving forward it will be harder to redeem traditional classic reward seats over Classic+.

We all know it's coming / inevitable despite Qantas' reassurances that there's still 5m Classic reward (non-plus) seats etc.