Qantas petition to open state borders

[antycbr]

QF's petition to open borders and resume flights isn't going to keep everyone happy I suspect.

Latest tourism figures for June show an increase of more than 2.35 million visitors May->June, with the majority being intrastate or regional. If everyone starts flying to QLD what's it going to do for regional towns in Victoria and other states? Source: Rare good news for Australia's coronavirus-hit tourism operators

Suggest you wait for the figures in July and August before drawing any conclusions. The boom in May and June was the short window where we thought we had C19 beaten and people started to book stuff again.

also it shouldn’t be state intervention that shapes tourism decisions.

 

[Pushka]

From a risk perspective it’s a much more controlled environment than your average supermarket. I flew SYD to BNK on Saturday and adherence to policies such as mask usage was close to 100%.

We flew Adelaide - Cairns then Cairns - Bne - Adelaide last month on full flights. The only time I felt at risk of any infection was actually when we arrived back in Adelaide where all passengers were lined up in a narrow corridor in the international arrivals area (airport has been completely reconfigured) and police were lined up at desks with computers, absolutely no social distancing for them and us, and we had to bend down close to the interviewer because of background noise and we simply could not hear what was being asked of us. Then I was told to stand back while waiting for the return of my drivers licence while the next passenger came to stand directly in front of me for their interview. It was so bad I messaged SA's CMO and asked her to review what was happening. And very few were wearing masks. We were.

 

[esseeeayeenn]

From a risk perspective it’s a much more controlled environment than your average supermarket. I flew SYD to BNK on Saturday and adherence to policies such as mask usage was close to 100%.

Mask wearing should be compulsory on all flights.

 

[antycbr]

Mask wearing should be compulsory on all flights.

The people who weren’t are children. Hard to make them do it consistently.

 

[Spongbob]

Mask wearing should be compulsory on all flights.

Qantas management disagree: "We strongly recommend you wear your face mask while travelling".

 

[Pushka]

Mask wearing should be compulsory on all flights.

Qantas management disagree: "We strongly recommend you wear your face mask while travelling".

It is a bit difficult when on our three flights the majority of flight crew weren't wearing them. Jetstar and Qantas.

 

[dajop]

It is a bit difficult when on our three flights the majority of flight crew weren't wearing them. Jetstar and Qantas.

Presumably they have done a risk assessment. I wonder if it's different on the MEL originating flights. On my SQ flight last month (ex-MEL) all crew wore gloves, masks and wrap around type safety glasses - at least when they were in the cabin.

 

[Spongbob]

Presumably they have done a risk assessment.

If so, it should be made public.

 

[antycbr]

If so, it should be made public.

As a private company they are under no obligation to do so unlike the state governments.

 

[p--and--t]

Qantas management disagree: "We strongly recommend you wear your face mask while travelling".

It is a bit difficult when on our three flights the majority of flight crew weren't wearing them. Jetstar and Qantas.

If so, it should be made public.

As a private company they are under no obligation to do so unlike the state governments.

If the relevant CHOs and fed aviation regs do not require or mandate the wearing of masks, what leg would QF have to mandate its staff to wear masks and how would such a demand be treated by the fair work commission.

Other large multi state companies like Coles and Wooliies "encourage" their staff and provide masks but do not mandate.

 

[dajop]

If the relevant CHOs and fed aviation regs do not require or mandate the wearing of masks, what leg would QF have to mandate its staff to wear masks and how would such a demand be treated by the fair work commission.

Other large multi state companies like Coles and Wooliies "encourage" their staff and provide masks but do not mandate.

Under workplace safety and health laws?

Companies are required to assess the workplace risks to their employees and make appropriate decision on what risk level is acceptable and what protection measures - including PPE - to use. There is nothing stopping a company mandating certain actions, where supported by risk assessment, and these may also go above and beyond minimum industry or government standards.

 

[p--and--t]

Under workplace safety and health laws?

Companies are required to assess the workplace risks to their employees and make appropriate decision on what risk level is acceptable and what protection measures - including PPE - to use. There is nothing stopping a company mandating certain actions, where supported by risk assessment, and these may also go above and beyond minimum industry or government standards.

And what justification would QF have to have a different conclusion to the state and fed CHOs who (except for Vic) have deemed its recommended but not mandatory; Oh and made multiple statements that they are not the most important and not a mandatory measure to prevent the spread of the virus

[edit] I would be not surprised if the relevant unions have been consulted and the status quo is a result + relying upon CHO advise.

Don't assume my participation in the debate as support either way to the decision.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

As a private company they are under no obligation to do so unlike the state governments.

But you could sue them if they get it wrong.

It's hard to understand how some airlines (not all) want us to believe flying is very safe, but at the same time claim it's too dangerous for their crew to heat a meal, or make tea of coffee. So it's not exactly clear what the risks are.

 

[antycbr]

But you could sue them if they get it wrong.

It's hard to understand how some airlines (not all) want us to believe flying is very safe, but at the same time claim it's too dangerous for their crew to heat a meal, or make tea of coffee. So it's not exactly clear what the risks are.

Good luck winning against the airlines lawyers. When you sign up to travel you are agreeing to probably thousands of safe work method statements that govern your travel.

Airlines spend their entire lives managing risks. If you don’t like it don’t travel but let those of us who wish to do so.

 

[dajop]

And what justification would QF have to have a different conclusion to the state and fed CHOs who (except for Vic) have deemed its recommended but not mandatory; Oh and made multiple statements that they are not the most important and not a mandatory measure to prevent the spread of the virus

They could take their own advice from specific experts in transmission of viruses, to take a more conservative position than CHOs. Business do this every day in all areas of their operation. Some rely on government advice, others go beyond the minimum government requirements. It would be more difficult (and potentially more problematic legally if something should go wrong) if they took a less conservative stance than government advice.

Not that Qantas has done this, as you point out mask wearing is only a recommendation, but they are perfectly entitled to require crew, or even customers to wear masks if they so wish. They are a private enterprise not a government service. Indeed some airlines operating in Australia (Rex and Link Airways, formerly Fly Corporate) do require masks ..... Coronavirus Information

In providing an extra layer of protection against the spread of COVID-19, and for the safety and wellbeing of all passengers and crew, from 1 June 2020, all passengers across the network will be required to wear face masks.

Presumably that applies to staff as well.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

They could take their own advice from specific experts in transmission of viruses, to take a more conservative position than CHOs. Business do this every day in all areas of their operation. Some rely on government advice, others go beyond the minimum government requirements. It would be more difficult (and potentially more problematic legally if something should go wrong) if they took a less conservative stance than government advice.

Not that Qantas has done this, as you point out mask wearing is only a recommendation, but they are perfectly entitled to require crew, or even customers to wear masks if they so wish. They are a private enterprise not a government service. Indeed some airlines operating in Australia (Rex and Link Airways, formerly Fly Corporate) do require masks ..... Coronavirus Information



Presumably that applies to staff as well.

I think Qantas have already Dr Ian Hosegood Qantas Director Medical Services

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Good luck winning against the airlines lawyers. When you sign up to travel you are agreeing to probably thousands of safe work method statements that govern your travel.

Airlines spend their entire lives managing risks. If you don’t like it don’t travel but let those of us who wish to do so.

Lots of people do win against airlines! And it's why we have regulators and consumer protection laws, because businesses aren't necessarily out there with consumer protection/welfare as their primary objective. They balance the risks against their commercial interests. If they get it wrong they are open to challenge.

 

[antycbr]

Lots of people do win against airlines! And it's why we have regulators and consumer protection laws, because businesses aren't necessarily out there with consumer protection/welfare as their primary objective. They balance the risks against their commercial interests. If they get it wrong they are open to challenge.

Shouldn’t the same thing apply to state governments?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Shouldn’t the same thing apply to state governments?

It does!

 

[Spongbob]

Airlines spend their entire lives managing risks. If you don’t like it don’t travel but let those of us who wish to do so.

I mostly agree. That is why I will not fly in the current circumstances.

But, if somebody else does and becomes infected from the flight they could transmit the virus to others who choose not to fly.