Mixed messages from QF website - can I cancel an Any Seat Award Flight or not?

[ThunderbirdNZ]

...and get my points back, obviously. I accept that I'll lose 5,000 points per passenger for canceling (the 'price' mentioned under 'fees' in FAQ), but when checking what it would actually cost me I got the following result:

"Qantas and Jetstar Any Seat Awards have different conditions from Qantas and Partner Classic Awards. The fare rules will vary depending on the type of Any Seat Award you have redeemed your points for. Check the fare conditions when you make your booking at qantas.com or if you are booking over the phone, your consultant will advise you of the fare rules for your particular Award.

Most Any Seat Awards are non-refundable (including taxes)."

so I checked my booking, and under 'Fare Conditions' I clicked the tab 'Sale' (ie a sale fare) which offered the folloing conditions:

"Qantas & Jetstar Any Seat Award:
If this is a Qantas & Jetstar Any Seat Award and the money paid (if any) for the booking is less than the cancellation fee, or the itinerary has been partially flown, then a proportion of the money and points originally used to obtain the award will be refunded to the applicable Member. The proportion refunded will be the difference between the original ticket value (or remaining ticket value if the itinerary is partially flown) as allocated by Qantas and the cancellation fee, as a proportion of the original ticket value."

The cancellation fee is $300 but I'm presuming that is what the 5,000 points deducted are for. Or do they take 5,000 points AND $300? Obviously I don't want to cancel and then find I get nothing back at all. I wanted to email this query to Qantas but they have no facility for this. If I call their 0800 number does my account get billed for talking to an assistant?

 

[TheInsider]

Did you purchase an Any Seat Award or a Classic Award?

What do you mean getting charged to talk to an assisant on the 0800 number (like ryanair number?)?

 

[ThunderbirdNZ]

Did you purchase an Any Seat Award or a Classic Award?

What do you mean getting charged to talk to an assisant on the 0800 number (like ryanair number?)?

Yes, I tried to edit the subject line to include 'Any Seat Award' but I couldn't.
I just presumed I would be charged points to talk to someone at Qantas since it's related to a booking, and they charge if you want to book over the phone.

 

[Aus ATC]

I have recently (6 days ago) cancelled a JASA (Was going to do a status run but changed my mind after the latest "enhancements"!).

When I spoke with the consultant she initially asked why I didn't cancel on line. I explained (thanks to this forum) that I understood that if I wanted my points refunded - rather than a token $$ value - I needed to speak to a person. She also mentioned the 5000 points fee - I questioned that, given it was a JASA "fully refundable". After a period on hold, she came back and said all points would be refunded.

I am yet to see the points back in my account, but a subsequent call to QFF suggests they will all find their way back.

 

[ThunderbirdNZ]

I explained (thanks to this forum) that I understood that if I wanted my points refunded - rather than a token $$ value - I needed to speak to a person.

Do you have a link to that thread? I don't want to have all my points 'taken'.

What I actually want is to be able to book the open jaw itinerary I can get via Jetabroad (flying Qantas!!) for $2800 (inclusive) that I can't seem to book via Qantas online for anywhere near that price.

Their multi city option doesnt allow 'open jaw' for starters...

 

[Aus ATC]

Here is one...

http://www.australianfrequentflyer....uent-flyer-program/cancelling-jasa-27246.html

Just search on the site (top right hand corner) for "Cancel JASA" and you will find others. Although looking at your first post, if your ASA was on a WhY "sale" fare or similar, the cancellation costs may well be higher.

 

[Vinny]

I just unfortunately had to cancel a JASA trip. I called and was told it would cost 5000 points. The points were back in my account the next day and my credit card was refunded about 3 days later.

 

[ThunderbirdNZ]

thanks for these replies. I'll call tomorrow morning (where's an international call centre when you want one?) and cancel...

As per AusATC's link - it seems ludicrous that one needs to quote T&C to the Qantas staff. They should know.

 

[pshepvic]

The only time the 5000 point cancel fee applies is for Classic Awards.

For JASAs they are fully refundable. Through the website you only get a dollar value that QF decides the points were worth. To get the points plus any dollars back you need to call up. There is no fee for ringing to do this.

If the JASAs was a business saver fare, there may be additional restrictions, but I don't think JASAs normally book in this fare bucket.

For YASAs, what ever the fare conditions are determines what the cancellation fee will be. For international discount economy, it's usually a $300 cancel fee. They will deduct this off the cash portion used and refund the rest of the cash and the points paid, but once again you have to phone up or they'll just give it a token dollar value online.

The only situation I'm not sure about is if the dollar amount paid is less than the cancellation fee. Don't know if they ask you to pay the difference and just give the points back, or if they decide a points or dollar value and deduct that from the pounts refund...?

 

[Craigie]

I called and was told it would cost 5000 points.

To put it as simply as I can, the cancellation conditions are based on the underlying $$ fare conditions you bought it from. I've never seen a $$ fare that has a cancellation condition of 5,000 FF points. When i've booked ASA's(all JASA's) i've printed out the fare conditions during the booking so i can refer to them later should i need to change or cancel. And thank goodness i did. From my few experiences with the qantas call centre, they really don't have any idea. I've had to explain and refer them to the T+C's until they've put me on hold, gone away and made a coffee or something and then come back and said alright.

Annoyingly though, TWICE i've been told that the cancellation fee of 5,000 points has been waived like it was meant to be charged in the first place. Thats why i'm of the opinion they don't know anything....

 

[ozmille]

I'm happy I never had to cancel a JASA before but am going to start and print out the fare rules from now on. It seems like this can be quite a hassle (which it shouldn't be as JASA's have been out there for a while now)

 

[TonyHancock]

I would definitely recommend printing out the fare conditions.

I have a FASA that is a First Saver and is neither refundable or changeable. (No problems with this, but it is something to be aware of.)

I have a JASA that is fully refundable, and I have a JASA where the fair conditions have disappeared from the my booking section. :shock:

 

[equus]

....For JASAs they are fully refundable.

If the JASAs was a business saver fare, there may be additional restrictions, but I don't think JASAs normally book in this fare bucket.

The only situation I'm not sure about is if the dollar amount paid is less than the cancellation fee. Don't know if they ask you to pay the difference and just give the points back, or if they decide a points or dollar value and deduct that from the points refund...?

Not all JASAs are fully refundable. Most domestic JASAs seem to fall into that category, but not necessarily international. The underlying fare conditions will dictate. The "cheap" international JASAs booked at the Classic rate appear to inherit the Business Saver conditions ($300 cancellation fee). Presumably this will apply until the underlying fare gets higher in value than a business saver (and the JASA points get ridiculous).

From the T&Cs I am given to understand that if the dollar amount paid is less than the cancellation fee, then you do not get the opportunity to pay any difference, rather the points are converted to dollars at the value-delivering (to QF) rate, and you get back anything which may be left. When I booked BNE-HKG JASA x2, at the classic rate, I chose to pay a dollar amount which matched the potential cancellation amount (ie $300 per ticket), just in case.

 

[ThunderbirdNZ]

For international discount economy, it's usually a $300 cancel fee. They will deduct this off the cash portion used and refund the rest of the cash and the points paid, but once again you have to phone up or they'll just give it a token dollar value online.

Dayum! Now I guess I have to go back and do the maths and decide if the new airfare is still cheaper/more convenient after adding in the additional $300 'cost'. Per person, right? I wish I'd discovered Jetabroad before I booked online with Qantas. (and my flights would still be with Qantas BTW, just not with points)

 

[serfty]

I second any recommendation to take a copy of any fare rules at the time of booking JASA. (I 'print' to a .pdf using "CutePDF".)

Yesterday I completed a JASA which was "Fully Refundable": (Bookings - Fare Types)

Cancellations (including no show)

• Fare is fully refundable.
• Qantas & Jetstar Any Seat Award: If this is a Qantas & Jetstar Any Seat Award and the itinerary has been partially flown, then a proportion of the money and points originally used to obtain the award will be refunded to the applicable Member. The proportion refunded will be the remaining ticket value as allocated by Qantas as a proportion of the original ticket value.

Next Week I am undertaking a "Business Special" fare which has a $341 cancellation fee: (Bookings - Fare Types)

Cancellations (including no show)

• Before departure:
  
  • A cancellation fee of A$341 per person applies.
• After departure:
  
  • The refund will be the difference (if any) between the fare paid and the applicable fare for the journey travelled, less A$341.
  • Qantas & Jetstar Any Seat Award: If this is a Qantas & Jetstar Any Seat Award and the money paid (if any) for the booking is less than the cancellation fee, or the itinerary has been partially flown, then a proportion of the money and points originally used to obtain the award will be refunded to the applicable Member. The proportion refunded will be the difference between the original ticket value (or remaining ticket value if the itinerary is partially flown) as allocated by Qantas and the cancellation fee, as a proportion of the original ticket value.

The fare when purchased was 60K QFF points and $227.51. I could have gone $0 and ~76K QFF points.

So any cancellation would absorb that $227.51 and I suspect a pro-rata calculation on points. More on that here: http://www.australianfrequentflyer....n-points-scs-any-seat-22911-5.html#post337459

 

[burrco]

I second any recommendation to take a copy of any fare rules at the time of booking JASA. (I 'print' to a .pdf using "CutePDF".)

Yesterday I completed a JASA which was "Fully Refundable": (Bookings - Fare Types)

Next Week I am undertaking a "Business Special" fare which has a $341 cancellation fee: (Bookings - Fare Types)
The fare when purchased was 60K QFF points and $227.51. I could have gone $0 and ~76K QFF points.

So any cancellation would absorb that $227.51 and I suspect a pro-rata calculation on points. More on that here: http://www.australianfrequentflyer....n-points-scs-any-seat-22911-5.html#post337459

When I cancelled in a similar scenario (amount paid less than the cancellation fee) some formula was applied, which no-one could explain to me, and I lost a significant pro-rata amount of points and got back some of the fee. The whole process took seven weeks and no one could explain to me why the points I lost wasn't just the difference between my original cost and the cancellation fee.

Never had any problem cancelling a JASA booked in standard business though - no fees or charges - just make sure they confirm on the phone that the points are to be refunded - not a cash payment.


EDITED TO ADD:

Just looked at my account and the cancelled booking was for Premium Economy. I had paid $150US plus 72k in points and the cancellation fee was $300US. I got $47.xxUS & 41,050 points refunded.

 

[ThunderbirdNZ]

I just rang them now to enquire as to what the cost of canceling would be. She looked at my booking reference and then the flight, and then told me it would cost $300 pp to cancel. I asked how that would be recovered since I paid for the whole thing with points - how many points would that cost me? She said she would put me on hold and find out, which she did. After 6 minutes of hold music the call was cut off. Funny how that happens a lot with all call centres when they have a curly one!

Whats annoying is that the fare I booked (but with points) had a price of $2800 pp. But it only took me to NY and back. With Jetabroad for $2880 I can fly to NY, stop there, fly on to Amsterdam, and then return to NZ from Barcelona (albeit via London/Sydney). Which is what I want/need to do.

 

[medhead]

I'm going to revive this thread as I have a similar question about a YASA. It's domestic ADL-BNE-SYD-ADL Fare classes X, E, E. Cost was $230 + 23000 points. Anyway, would be nice to be able to cancel the flights now. Looking into this and I'm getting mixed messages. The QFF T&Cs say:

15.1.2 There is no fixed relationship between the cash price charged by the applicable airline for a seat and the points required to redeem Any Seat Awards through Qantas Frequent Flyer and not all Qantas and Jetstar special promotional fares are available as Any Seat Awards. Fare Conditions for Any Seat Awards are different to the fare conditions applicable to cash fares.

, and

15.6.1 A refund of an Any Seat Award will only be made in accordance with the applicable Fare Conditions and these Terms and Conditions, and the following provisions:
(a) If a refund is requested prior to travel commencing, and the money paid to obtain the Any Seat Award is equal to or greater than the cancellation fee (or refund fee) specified in the Fare Conditions, and the original Any Seat Award booking was not made on jetstar.com, then the refund of the Any Seat Award will be made by re-crediting Points redeemed to the Member's account and refunding any money paid to the Member's Accepted Payment Card, less any applicable cancellation fee (or refund fee) set out in the Fare Conditions.

15.6.1(a) is the one that would most likely apply, so I've only quoted it. That clause suggests that a refund is available. However, the normal X and E fare conditions say no refund. Obviously, I do need to check the special ASA fare conditions for anything about refunds, the trouble is those are on a computer 700 miles away from me.

Qantas is offering me a $387 voucher, clearly a refund is preferable.

Is there any more recent experience with cancelling and refunding a YASA out there. Anyone willing to give a theoretical opinion on were I stand? (theoretical since I don't have the actualy fare conditions to had). Anyone, willing to offer any advice on the situation and how to proceed to obtain my desired outcome. NB I'm happy enough to do the flights, just that christmas shopping is more important.

The terms also say the most restrictive fare conditions applies to all flights in the case of mix fare bookings so I can't even ask for classic award rules on the X class segment.