Help! I had a bad bad accident on an international flight - None take responsibility

[Claire Wilson]

There could be a lot to unpack on this issue. Contributory negligence can reduce damages under Montreal, in theory, to zero. But there could be a lot to unpack.. if the seat belt sign was on, how long had it been on? Did the crew see the passenger go to the toilet but not immediately order her back to her seat? (ie, did they ‘allow’ the passenger to go). If they allowed the passenger to go, what sort of warning accompanied that? Etc etc.

I wouldn’t let the issue of the seatbelt stop me from going to see a lawyer.

I was thinking about the issue of the crew... perhaps they didn’t want to report an accident on their watch? Especially if they failed to stop the passenger moving about the cabin when the seatbelt sign was on. They may have refused to record the claim for fear of dismissal or other sanction.

Finding the price of a lawyer doesn’t mean a lawyer has considered it, or even provided preliminary advice. The OP might only got as far as ‘how much do you charge?’ Not all lawyers provide a first consult for free.

no seatbelt sign was not on, night flight was a very quiet and boring one, only after I closed the toilet door to move to my seat did I encounter the severe air turbulence. you are right on the mark, they did not want to have to report the accident on their watch as instant dismissal upon arrival in dubai would be the course of action!

 

[blackcat20]

"current affair"...I know it is a TV station, would that be ABC TV????

It's a channel 9 show.

 

[Claire Wilson]

So to clarify - the OP was stepping out of the bathroom when turbulence hit and this sent them flying off their feet, causing the injury?

correct, I stepped out of the business class toilet, flight had been sm ooth and uneventful. as soon as I closed the toilet door and wanted to proceed to my seat was I flung thru the business class pantry hitting every metal door/wall

 

[mannej]

A Current Affair (Channel 9) and Today tonight (Channel 7) are the ambulance chasers of evening TV. Always looking for a story where the little guy has been wronged by the major corporation...

 

[Claire Wilson]

I saw an advertisement for them the other day. So they must be around, at least in Victoria. But I have no idea if they'd be interested in something like this.

Quite by accident I also came across this website the other day - law firm based in NSW: Australian Travel Law and Leisure Law

Perhaps the OP could approach them as well.

thank you so much, did not know that that existed, have immediately emailed them, pray please!

 

[Claire Wilson]

A Current Affair (Channel 9) and Today tonight (Channel 7) are the ambulance chasers of evening TV. Always looking for a story where the little guy has been wronged by the major corporation...

Thank you will email them immediately!

 

[juddles]

Claire, don't take too much offence. We see a lot of "one post wonders" who come here, sprout something off, and then disappear never to be seen again. It does make a few of us jaded when we see a woe is me story especially one that is light on details.......

Claire, as per harvyk, we see many one post rants, so that can get me upset. But I see now you have come back, and so this changes for me.
I used the phrase "badly stained wine stain" not as a "dumb uncalled for remark", but rather as a way to emphasise that we (the AFF community to which you reach out to) had no details on which we can try to help.

...... I sustained very serious trauma to right side if right knee+right hand and wrist when I stepped out of EMIRATES business class toilet during flight from Kuala Lumpur-Melbourne.......... I told them I wanted the form to report accident but they just walked away. Upon disembarking I insisted again to be given the form but crew walked away again. They had a wheelchair waiting for me. I was visiting my terminally ill husband staying in Royal Melbourne Hospital. ....

Claire, what I understand from your posts is the following:

1.- You were travelling business class.
2.- You went to the bathroom while there was no turbulence and thus no prohibition of movement.
3.- As you exited the bathroom there was an event of bad turbulence that caused your injuries on your way back to your seat.
4.- Due to this you suffered extremely serious injuries.
5.- You tried to report this to the staff but they ignored you in fear of their jobs.
6.- You were not drunk, nor any other factor that could assign culpability to you.
7.- I hesitate to mention your "age", but you have given enough info to assume you are what in Australia we would call "elderly".
8.- You had travel insurance, who are ignoring you.
9.- Emirates, a leading global carrier, is also ignoring you.
10.- You have suffered permanent injuries.

I just cannot wrap my brain around why no lawyer will assist you. You seem, on the info you give, to have a SPECTACULAR case that a good lawyer could literally make millions of dollars from.

What am I missing here?

 

[Nisho]

Travel Insurer was AXA and they took their time to reply - months actually

In that case... i also think the insurance company should not be left off the hook. Read the terms and conditions of the applicable sections of the travel insurance : and since they are not willing to budge, I reckon you should contact the Financial Ombudsman Service
should they be failing to meet their end of the bargain. This will hopefully start a process where costly lawyers are not involved.


The Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS), an ASIC approved external dispute resolution body. FOS is a free service that resolves insurance disputes between consumers and insurers, so there will be no cost to you.

 

[Claire Wilson]

Claire, as per harvyk, we see many one post rants, so that can get me upset. But I see now you have come back, and so this changes for me.
I used the phrase "badly stained wine stain" not as a "dumb uncalled for remark", but rather as a way to emphasise that we (the AFF community to which you reach out to) had no details on which we can try to help.



Claire, what I understand from your posts is the following:

1.- You were travelling business class.
2.- You went to the bathroom while there was no turbulence and thus no prohibition of movement.
3.- As you exited the bathroom there was an event of bad turbulence that caused your injuries on your way back to your seat.
4.- Due to this you suffered extremely serious injuries.
5.- You tried to report this to the staff but they ignored you in fear of their jobs.
6.- You were not drunk, nor any other factor that could assign culpability to you.
7.- I hesitate to mention your "age", but you have given enough info to assume you are what in Australia we would call "elderly".
8.- You had travel insurance, who are ignoring you.
9.- Emirates, a leading global carrier, is also ignoring you.
10.- You have suffered permanent injuries.

I just cannot wrap my brain around why no lawyer will assist you. You seem, on the info you give, to have a SPECTACULAR case that a good lawyer could literally make millions of dollars from.

What am I missing here?

CORRECT...and yes, I do qualify as ELDERLY though I was very healthy before I boarded the airline. I'm a very active "elderly" doing (did) a lot trekking in Borneo as well as flying to wherever it is peaceful. Beats me too that no lawyer is jumping in...I just don't have the $400 or $500 they charge per hour/looking into the case. I've been married 51+ years to my now terminally ill husband and my 1st priority is to give him the best quality of life till he departs to his own very special cloud in the sky. I'm worse then d desperate and as I'm all alone with no family and friend in this country I totally rely on help from "strangers. your input is very very much appreciated!. I've emailed current affair Channel 9 and wait what they have to say. thank you again for helping!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I just cannot wrap my brain around why no lawyer will assist you. You seem, on the info you give, to have a SPECTACULAR case that a good lawyer could literally make millions of dollars from.

What am I missing here?

You’re missing that the first tier under Montreal (strict liability) caps damages at 100,000 special drawing rights. Greater than that it becomes fault-based.

 

[juddles]

You’re missing that the first tier under Montreal (strict liability) caps damages at 100,000 special drawing rights. Greater than that it becomes fault-based.

I understand nothing of international travel law. I just hope, as a human being, that things that are clearly "not right" can be rectified, or ameliorated.

 

[Claire Wilson]

Claire, as per harvyk, we see many one post rants, so that can get me upset. But I see now you have come back, and so this changes for me.
I used the phrase "badly stained wine stain" not as a "dumb uncalled for remark", but rather as a way to emphasise that we (the AFF community to which you reach out to) had no details on which we can try to help.



Claire, what I understand from your posts is the following:

1.- You were travelling business class.
2.- You went to the bathroom while there was no turbulence and thus no prohibition of movement.
3.- As you exited the bathroom there was an event of bad turbulence that caused your injuries on your way back to your seat.
4.- Due to this you suffered extremely serious injuries.
5.- You tried to report this to the staff but they ignored you in fear of their jobs.
6.- You were not drunk, nor any other factor that could assign culpability to you.
7.- I hesitate to mention your "age", but you have given enough info to assume you are what in Australia we would call "elderly".
8.- You had travel insurance, who are ignoring you.
9.- Emirates, a leading global carrier, is also ignoring you.
10.- You have suffered permanent injuries.

I just cannot wrap my brain around why no lawyer will assist you. You seem, on the info you give, to have a SPECTACULAR case that a good lawyer could literally make millions of dollars from.

What am I missing here?

CORRECT...and yes, I do qualify as ELDERLY though I was very healthy before I boarded the airline. I'm a very active "elderly" doing (did) a lot trekking in Borneo as well as flying to wherever it is peaceful. Beats me too that no lawyer is jumping in...I just don't have the $400 or $500 they charge per hour/looking into the case. I've been married 51+ years to my now terminally ill husband and my 1st priority is to give him the best quality of life till he departs to his own very special cloud in the sky. I'm worse then d desperate and as I'm all alone with no family and friend in this country I totally rely on help from "strangers. your input is very very much appreciated!. I've emailed current affair Channel 9 and wait what they have to say. thank you again for helping!

 

[dajop]

In that case... i also think the insurance company should not be left off the hook. Read the terms and conditions of the applicable sections of the travel insurance : and since they are not willing to budge, I reckon you should contact the Financial Ombudsman Service
should they be failing to meet their end of the bargain. This will hopefully start a process where costly lawyers are not involved.


The Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS), an ASIC approved external dispute resolution body. FOS is a free service that resolves insurance disputes between consumers and insurers, so there will be no cost to you.

This may be complicated if the insurance was taken out in Malaysia, whilst the OP was resident in Malaysia. FOS are not relevant for a non-Australian travel insurance policy.

Although it's still not clear if the travel insurance was with AXA (Australia) or AXA (Malaysia).

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I understand nothing of international travel law. I just hope, as a human being, that things that are clearly "not right" can be rectified, or ameliorated.

100k SDRs is about AUD190k. No ‘millions’ and you can’t claim emotional damages (although there may be some limited exceptions to this under Australian law).

 

[juddles]

100k SDRs is about AUD190k. No ‘millions’ and you can’t claim emotional damages (although there may be some limited exceptions to this under Australian law).

Forgive me, but I suspect the legal world is not so bound. A story within Australia that an elderly person was so outrageously treated by Emirates, and left crippled, could hurt Emirates very badly. And Qantas too because of their close ties.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Forgive me, but I suspect the legal world is not so bound. A story within Australia that an elderly person was so outrageously treated by Emirates, and left crippled, could hurt Emirates very badly. And Qantas too because of their close ties.

The Montreal Convention is the exclusive avenue for legal action where an accident has occurred on board an international flight.

Unfortunately the public doesn’t seem to pay much attention to reputation when it comes to these things. Malaysia Airlines is fighting victim’s families tooth and nail to get out of paying under the Montreal Convention. Apart from a couple of us, no one else seems to care (public, media, politicians all included).

 

[juddles]

..... is the exclusive avenue for legal action ....

I disagree. You are referring to claims against the airline under said convention. I am talking the airlines desire to sweep mess under any carpet.

Does the Montreal Convention prevent A Current Affair from running a piece that costs Emirates said millions?

 

[Claire Wilson]

This may be complicated if the insurance was taken out in Malaysia, whilst the OP was resident in Malaysia. FOS are not relevant for a non-Australian travel insurance policy.

Although it's still not clear if the travel insurance was with AXA (Australia) or AXA (Malaysia).

Although I do not want to knock travel insurers it is a well known fact that Malaysian travel insurers make it virtually impossible to claim. not only do they take their time...they come up with the most ridiculous clauses … and in my case they just could not be bothered as they knew only too well themselves that dealing with an (int) airline is driving you to distraction. I've posted a message on Emirates facebook page, send them another prickly email, emailed current affair Channel 9 , 9news and Today channel 7, will now undertake to contact your suggestion and then I'm done. thank you for helping me, very much appreciated!

 

[dajop]

Although I do not want to knock travel insurers it is a well known fact that Malaysian travel insurers make it virtually impossible to claim. not only do they take their time...they come up with the most ridiculous clauses …

I have similar mistrust of Singaporean travel insurers, and maintain an annual worldwide medical insurance policy sold in UK. Something that many contributors to this forum do not understand that consumer protection in SE Asian countries, such as Singapore and Malaysia, consists basically of a middle fingered salute to the consumer.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I disagree. You are referring to claims against the airline under said convention. I am talking the airlines desire to sweep mess under any carpet.

Does the Montreal Convention prevent A Current Affair from running a piece that costs Emirates said millions?

Montreal doesn’t preclude anything. But how exactly is a piece by ACA going to cost the airline millions? Similar reports about Malaysia Airlines (as an example) don’t seem to have an impact. There were a whole suite of articles on television about alleged sexual assault by a steward on an MH flight. Did everyone stop flying?