Group SYD-LAX-SFO Booking: VA or QF?

[OccasionalFlyer]

Hi all,

I am arranging a group booking for around 20 people to travel SYD-LAX-SFO. I requested quotes from both Qantas and Virgin Australia. The Qantas quote came in at a reasonably good price (compared with what I was expecting) but the Virgin quote really surprised me - it is several hundred dollars cheaper per person than Qantas. This adds-up to quite a substantial saving.

We would be flying VA1/2 for the SYD-LAX/LAX-SYD sectors, and then Virgin America for LAX-SFO/SFO-LAX. We are all flying Economy.

I have heard some bad stories from people about cancelled/late changes on Virgin flights, etc. (although I am sure you would hear the same from people who have been subject to the same thing on other airlines) - having these kinds of situations arise with a group of 20 people doesn't sound like a logistically fun exercise for me to manage!

I have only ever flown Qantas internationally (I am QF Gold, no status on VA) so I was hoping for opinions on Virgin? How about things like in-flight meals, entertainment, baggage allowance, etc. in comparison to Qantas? From the research I have done it seems to be comparable.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[rioter]

I have flown that route quiet a bit a handful of times with VA never with QF. The flights are mostly on time. The in flight entertainment is not as extensive as qantas but still will be more than enough to tide you over for the flight. The timing of the LAX->SYD flight means you are flying pretty late, so if you can sleep on a plane you will be out for a lot of the flight.

Just another option to consider is flying with air New Zealand. It means you transit in auckland instead of LAX. A much more pleasant experience(IMHO).

 

[OccasionalFlyer]

Thanks for the info. How do you find the aircraft (777) as I usually fly QF11/12 (A380)? As an aside, I've heard from others that they also have music and cycle the cabin lighting when you're boarding the plane??

Just another option to consider is flying with air New Zealand. It means you transit in auckland instead of LAX. A much more pleasant experience(IMHO).

Yep, got a quote from Air NZ but they came in around the same price as Qantas. Virgin is a lot cheaper than both.

 

[erkpod]

I've recently travelled VAi & VX.

Baggage allowance depends on fare type & status but should be fine. Just read the websites & don't go over your limits & you'll be fine.

I don't eat much on planes but the food on VAi compares well with what I had the last time I was on QF. There won't be much on VX as LAX - SFO is like flying SYD - MEL & not all American carriers do a full meal service on short sectors.

If you were a regular flyer you might find the VAi IFE to be lacking in content but if not, there's a bit to watch. There's seatback IFE in both the VAi & VX planes so you don't need to bring a device. The VX planes also have some US cable channels that are live streamed to the plane.

I've found the 777 to be a little noiser than the A380 but it's not unbearable. I find the 380 seats to be a little wider & a little more comfy (which is good) but it's fairly equal for the flight length.

I've found mostly good staff on either airline.

As for transiting LAX, allow yourselves plenty of time between the flights, especially because you are travelling as a group. Traveling solo, my average is 60 minutes plane to street.

The Customs & Immigration areas can get quite busy because you've got a few international flights arriving around the same time.

You'll arrive into TBIT off VA1 & then will need to go over to T3 for the VX flight. - it's a short walk.

You'll probably want to eat on arrival into LA - there's a cafe/diner to the right of the arrivals hall in TBIT or there's more eateries landside on the departure level. There's nothing landside between TBIT & T3 nor anything pre-security in T3. Airside eating in T3 wasn't that crash hot the last time I was there. Eat in TBIT if you can.

departure level.

 

[jneufeld]

I know this may be an unpopular suggestion but I think with a group of around 20 people a direct flight might be more sound logistically. On that basis I would consider United's direct flight from SYD-SFO. Yes it's operated on a 747 from the stone age, and has economy that anyone taller than an elf may find cramped but, you will get to SFO in one flight and not have to deal with 20 weary souls trekking through LAX at rush hour.

I would think that UA will come in cheapest too, you may want to look at spending some of that saving in airfare on Economy Plus seating which would give you that little bit of extra space to make it slightly less unpleasant.

 

[Hvr]

jneufeld's suggestion whilst pragmatic and suitable for a group of school kids would IMHO leave you flying the worst airline of the bunch.

If you're travelling with a group of adults then once you've booked the flight (after they've all paid you!) they're responsible for turning up on time etc. Leave them behind, they're adults they can pay their own way and catch up.

As for the the choice of carrier why not put it to the vote? Tell them the cost of each carrier and set a firm date for responses and go with the majority.

 

[UP4014]

When things go wrong QF will have more redundancy which for a group of 20 could be handy.

Matt

 

[Limewood]

have you considered AIRNZ? they have some incredible deals on of late, a phone call with 20 pax might do better, one stop AKL then direct to SFO and no LAX!.

 

[OccasionalFlyer]

Thanks for the suggestions and advice everyone. I have flown SYD-LAX-SFO with the same group (of different people) several times before on Qantas, and are fairly well accustomed with that route (in fact, I don't really mind LAX - they usually shuttle our group through the express transfer lane at customs which makes the process fairly quick).

A few more logistical questions regarding transferring. It's possible that we will need to fly into SYD from another airport. When travelling on Qantas, we got all our boarding passes when we checked-in at our origin port so all that needed to be done in SYD was go to the QF transfer bus and head across to the international terminal. Is that the same with Virgin? From what I understand on their website, we need to check-in again for the international flight at the transfer lounge in T2, and then we will receive our boarding passes. If that's so, will that give us SYD-LAX and LAX-SFO, or do we need to check-in again in LAX to get the LAX-SFO boarding passes?

Also, when flying Qantas after we clear in LAX we dropped our bags just before exiting TBIT and then walked across to the American Airlines terminal. Does that work the same (except, obviously, walking to the Virgin America terminal instead)?

Thanks!

 

[jneufeld]

When travelling on Qantas, we got all our boarding passes when we checked-in at our origin port so all that needed to be done in SYD was go to the QF transfer bus and head across to the international terminal. Is that the same with Virgin?

Your flight from X-SYD will need to be on the same ticket as the SYD-LAX-SFO for this to work, so your baggage can be tagged through. Virgin won't tag your bags through to SFO from your point of origin if the domestic sector is a separate ticket. Your international BPs will be issued at the transfer lounge in SYD.

Also, when flying Qantas after we clear in LAX we dropped our bags just before exiting TBIT and then walked across to the American Airlines terminal. Does that work the same (except, obviously, walking to the Virgin America terminal instead)?

This is possible only if the bags have been tagged through to SFO

 

[OccasionalFlyer]

Your international BPs will be issued at the transfer lounge in SYD.

Thanks for that. Yes, I would make sure everything is on the one booking/ticket. So, do we check-in to the international flight at our point of origin, or in SYD when the BPs are issued? In other words, could I walk up and get the entire groups BPs in SYD or does every person in the group need to go up individually?

 

[MandM]

... Your international BPs will be issued at the transfer lounge in SYD.

IIRC, the last couple of times I've transited via SYD or BNE ex MEL I have had my international boarding pass (for LAX) issued at MEL.

 

[notzac]

All boarding cards will be issued at point of departure - if you depart from MEL, you'll should get all three boarding cards to get you to SFO at the one time.

 

[OccasionalFlyer]

So, the Virgin Australia website isn't completely correct?

From: Domestic and International Flight Connections | Virgin Australia

The following information is for guests who have a domestic departure (check-in), and need to connect through another domestic port onto an international flight.

Domestic Check-in Connecting through Sydney

When you check in at a domestic port, your bags will be checked through to your final destination. You will receive a transfer wallet, which contains a map of the transfer port and a bus pass to use in Sydney. Upon arriving in Sydney, make your way to the transfer lounge at Gate 37 and check in for your international flight. Once you have received a boarding pass for your international flight, you will be shown downstairs to the transfer bus – which will take you to the International Terminal. If you are issued with a boarding pass at the transfer lounge, you will not be required to check in again at the International Terminal.

Seems a bit odd that they wouldn't issue all the BPs at the point of departure? That's definitely how Qantas works, even when connecting onto a code share (AA) for LAX-SFO.

 

[notzac]

So, the Virgin Australia website isn't completely correct?

Does that surprise you?

The reason they couldn't issue all boarding cards in the past is that domestic ran on Navitaire and international ran on Amadeus. Now that everything is on Sabre, it's quite simple for them to issue everything in one go.

The only problem with this that I've run in to in the last year was a check in agent that wasn't trained to check through to an International flight. No idea if that's still a problem, but I'd be surprised if it was..

 

[OccasionalFlyer]

Does that surprise you?

Fair point mate

Nevertheless, I'll also double-check with the group booking person. I am all about having the simplest trip possible, particularly when managing a group, so the less lining-up at check-in counters, etc. the better!

So, having discussed the logistics of international Virgin flights, what's the opinion on the general quality of service? I've had good experiences on domestic Virgin flights, but never flown with them internationally. It seems that VA1/2 are their flagship services (given the numbering!) so you'd hope that they would at least try to do a good job with the clients... I assume that we get full meals (unlike short haul international flights, to NZ and such)?

 

[notzac]

It's what you'd expect on a long haul flight. Generally you'll get served lunch on the way out and brekkie before landing, snacks and drinks available throughout, flight attendants are mostly good - nothing specific that I can think to complain about.

 

[OccasionalFlyer]

It's what you'd expect on a long haul flight. Generally you'll get served lunch on the way out and brekkie before landing, snacks and drinks available throughout, flight attendants are mostly good - nothing specific that I can think to complain about.

Good to hear. Out of curiosity, some people have said they try and make it trendy when boarding (music and changing the cabin lighting) - is that true, or something they did back in the day and have given-up on now?

 

[notzac]

Good to hear. Out of curiosity, some people have said they try and make it trendy when boarding (music and changing the cabin lighting) - is that true, or something they did back in the day and have given-up on now?

There's music when you board (Tony Bennett I think), but I can't remember whether they do anything with lighting. Virgin America certainly does, but Virgin Australia has gone for a much more professional look in the last couple years.

 

[MandM]

Good to hear. Out of curiosity, some people have said they try and make it trendy when boarding (music and changing the cabin lighting) - is that true, or something they did back in the day and have given-up on now?

They still do it. It isn't crazy rave lighting or anything. I don't find it either good or bad. It just is.