Flying OneWorld around Europe [credit to QF]

[MG1]

I've got a potential European trip occurring later this year (although the current conflict in the Middle East has made it a little bit more complicated and could even postpone it) and I'd like to know how others travel around Europe.

I'm a QF Platinum member, so, will have reciprocal benefits with BA, IB, and AY. These are on the edges of Europe with *A and ST airlines (such as LH, LX, AF, KL) dominating the centre.

[I'd love to build up lifetime status with another airline as well but this seems unlikely being Australian-based.]

In order to build up lifetime status with QF (and to use my benefits, such as extra luggage), would it be worth booking multiple flights through a OW hub, such as London, which will mean travelling all day with a layover, as opposed to say a 1-2 hour direct flight?

With the UK not being part of the EU, would I be questioned/disallowed/penalised if they see me doing this multiple times over the course of a couple of weeks?

What are your preferences?

 

[Mwenenzi]

Where in EU do you want to go?
Commuting via LHR/LGW/LCY MAD HEL may be expensive. Your money or someone else's money?
In EU trains may be better depending on destination. Point to point can be similar to aircraft on short routes.
EU is small

No issues with multiple EU entries. 100's to 1000's of Aussies in UK go to EU for a weekend or even a day trip to France

 

[MG1]

Where in EU do you want to go?
Commuting via LHR/LGW/LCY MAD HEL may be expensive. Your money or someone else's money?
In EU trains may be better depending on destination. Point to point can be similar to aircraft on short routes.
EU is small

No issues with multiple EU entries. 100's to 1000's of Aussies in UK go to EU for a weekend or even a day trip to France

Thanks for your response @Mwenenzi.

It'll be my money.

I was potentially looking at going to Switzerland, Luxembourg, Germany, and maybe elsewhere depending on what time and money allow.

So, once I'm in Europe, a sample itinerary could be something like ZUR-LHR-LUX-LHR-BER in J on BA (withy WP benefits) instead of direct flights ZUR-LUX on LX and LUX-BER on LH where I have no status.

I can look at the train options as well.

I still need to compare timings and pricings. If the pricing is similar, then it'll basically come down to are the extra SCs worth the amount of hours that it'll take to obtain them.

 

[SYD]

As above, what sort of itinerary are you considering?

Short hops within continental Europe and the UK are usually better on trains and/or driving. You can book most trains online these days - so handy to compare cost/timing.

The downside to trains is schlepping your luggage on and off. The locals are usually travelling for a short period and can put small bags overhead. Foreign tourist with larger bags have to fight over sometimes limited luggage racks.

Driving, just be mindful of one way rental fees and potential cost of crossing borders (even within the Schengen zone).

Flying is still useful for larger hops or where it could mean multiple trains to get from A to B. There can be some good value (and decent SC earners) if you research and plan ahead. Many Euro legacy carriers still price as return tickets and therefore one way fares can be very high but they’re getting better. Be careful with “Lite” fares as you may not get all OWE benefits eg BA “Lite” doesn’t provide checked luggage - even as OWE (AFAIK).

Don’t be afraid to forgo SCs and consider some of the LCCs if that’s the most efficient way to get from A to B. We resorted to Ryan Air last year - it wasn’t awful.

 

[MG1]

As above, what sort of itinerary are you considering?

Short hops within continental Europe and the UK are usually better on trains and/or driving. You can book most trains online these days - so handy to compare cost/timing.

The downside to trains is schlepping your luggage on and off. The locals are usually travelling for a short period and can put small bags overhead. Foreign tourist with larger bags have to fight over sometimes limited luggage racks.

Driving, just be mindful of one way rental fees and potential cost of crossing borders (even within the Schengen zone).

Flying is still useful for larger hops or where it could mean multiple trains to get from A to B. There can be some good value (and decent SC earners) if you research and plan ahead. Many Euro legacy carriers still price as return tickets and therefore one way fares can be very high but they’re getting better. Be careful with “Lite” fares as you may not get all OWE benefits eg BA “Lite” doesn’t provide checked luggage - even as OWE (AFAIK).

Don’t be afraid to forgo SCs and consider some of the LCCs if that’s the most efficient way to get from A to B. We resorted to Ryan Air last year - it wasn’t awful.

Thanks @SYD.
At this stage, I was considering something like ZUR-LHR-LUX-LHR-BER in J on BA (withy WP benefits) but the exact itinerary is still a WIP.

I can consider taking trains as well - the biggest issue there would be lifting the luggage on and off.

I'll keep in mind what you said about the lite fares.

 

[SeatBackForward]

Save your money. Intra-EU business class is....economy at the front of the plane.

Use trains - far more convenient, and if you want to build up Status Credits, do status runs between AUS<>NZ.

 

[vbroucek]

IMHO, biggest issue with doing it is being slapped by high LHR departure taxes twice.

 

[SYD]

Thanks @SYD.
At this stage, I was considering something like ZUR-LHR-LUX-LHR-BER in J on BA (withy WP benefits) but the exact itinerary is still a WIP.

So the actually trip is ZUR-LUX-BER (as mentioned in you’re earlier post)?

I can consider taking trains as well - the biggest issue there would be lifting the luggage on and off.

Yes, that’s what I mentioned. Not so bad if able bodied but a pain in the… if not. Paying for First on a train can be getting you into airfare pricing.

I'll keep in mind what you said about the lite fares.

Maybe also look for city pairs nearby. There can be radically different pricing.

IMHO, biggest issue with doing it is being slapped by high LHR departure taxes twice.

No, not if transiting.

Even with a stop over, the fee to go to Europe is a fraction of lonhghaul fees.

 

[vbroucek]

No, not if transiting.

Even with a stop over, the fee to go to Europe is a fraction of lonhghaul fees.

Sorry, somehow missed you just want to transit through LHR...

 

[SYD]

Sorry, somehow missed you just want to transit through LHR...

Well, that’s what the OP is pondering.

 

[offshore171]

For that part of Europe, trains are the hands down choice

Town centre to town centre, and avoid time wasted at airports and X-ray machines, waiting at luggage belts etc.

Find schedules, book and get your digital tickets all in the app.

Download DB Navigator app (German)

DB Navigator App - App Store

Download DB Navigator by Deutsche Bahn on the App Store. See screenshots, ratings and reviews, user tips and more apps like DB Navigator.

apps.apple.com

And SBB Navigator (Swiss)

SBB Mobile App - App Store

Download SBB Mobile by SBB AG on the App Store. See screenshots, ratings and reviews, user tips and more apps like SBB Mobile.

apps.apple.com

Doing multiple transits at LHR is my idea of hell!

 

[dajop]

Trains are certainly a viable alternative for Zurich to Luxembourg, and might even be worth stopping off half way at Strasbourg, really interesting place (about 2.5 hrs or so from both.)

On the other hand LUX-Berlin looks like a more arduous trek ( and TBH the German rail system has been a bit of a hot mess for a couple of years now) and flying would probably be advantageous
.
Whether you want to do a journey via LHR - not so sure. You may not have status but if flying in business class you get many of the benefits (lounge access, priority security). And if a LCC offfered a better schedule personally I’m more than happy with them for short hops.

 

[MG1]

Thank you @SeatBackForward, @vbroucek, @SYD, @offshore171, @dajop for your responses.

It looks like considering rail travel, for a shorter leg, might be the way to go. I'll compare the pricing and see how close it is to air travel. There will definitely be nice scenery to view and travelling between city centres without the airport security process, would be more relaxing.

I've used LCY and LGW previously but not yet at LHR.

I haven't been to Strasbourg but could add that to the list for consideration.

 

[offshore171]

I haven't been to Strasbourg but could add that to the list for consideration.

Would highly recommend it. We spent a couple of nights there between Zurich and Paris. Spectacular city, and some of the best food and wine in France.

The station at Strasbourg is itself quite a sight, being encased in a glass atrium. You literally walk out of the station into a town square surrounded by hotels and restaurants. I can recommend the Hotel Tandem


These trains are quick

 

[Melburnian1]

Thank you @SeatBackForward, @vbroucek, @SYD, @offshore171, @dajop for your responses.

It looks like considering rail travel, for a shorter leg, might be the way to go. I'll compare the pricing and see how close it is to air travel. There will definitely be nice scenery to view and travelling between city centres without the airport security process, would be more relaxing.

I haven't been to Strasbourg but could add that to the list for consideration.

Look up the Seat 61 website for all you want to know about European (and UK) rail travel.

Why not buy a first class paper or mobile Global Eurailpass? See the Eurail site for details: available for consecutive periods up to three months, or X days in X month(s).

As you mentioned, travelling by rail gives the advantage of city centre to city centre. Enjoy lunch or a beer/wine/soft drink in the dining or buffet car on many trains. The scenery is often magnificent, and unlike an aircraft, you can move around and stand up for a while if you're sick of sitting down. WiFi reception on trains in UK/Europe is often good. There are always heaps of hotels near major city stations, ranging from 2 or 2.5 stars to sometimes 5 stars.

Paper Eurailpasses are mailed to Australia. They always reliably arrive in my experience.

You can travel by Eurostar high speed rail from London St Pancras International to Lille, Paris, Brussels or Amsterdam. Compulsory reservation so the earlier you book, the better. A supplement is payable, as is the case with many trains, though not slower regional ones.

Strasbourg to Paris (about 490km) is only an hour and 40 minutes from Paris by high speed train.

EuroBusiness class on the airlines within Europe is deficient compared to rail, as it's merely the middle seat in a bay of 3 blocked off.

Fly into London or Manchester and out of Europe on an open jaw ticket. Milan (MXP) tends to be cheapest, and is an airport I have used on multiple occasions. The Elizabeth line connects LHR to London Paddington, and Milan has a rather slow airport train taking c.55 minutes from Milano Centrale station. Airport trains and metro (underground) rail are not normally included with a Eurailpass, but suburban trains in Austria and Germany ('S-bahn') are. The Urban Rail site by Mr Schwandl is useful.

 

[dajop]

Airport trains and metro (underground) rail are not normally included with a Eurailpass, but suburban trains in Austria and Germany ('S-bahn') are.

As well as Switzerland., Denmark, Norway. and others. Also In London, the Elizabeth Line (from Heathrow) , Gatwick Express and Stansted Express are included.

I find the passes are really useful for meandering, flexible itineraries, or exploring from a central point. And for Switzerland which has very expensive rail. If just taking in a small number of journeys, on a fixed schedule, individual rail fares may well be the way to go. Also I would be very reluctant to do the 8 hr journey from Luxembourg to Berlin by rail unless breaking up the journey enroute. I've found about 5-6 hrs is my limit.

Travelling from Venice to Zurich, (6 hrs, single train via Milan) I was really over it by the team we reached the Swiss border . The train was full and loud, and not helped after leaving Milan with some teenage boys running up and down the carriage, and a large loud family group spread over multiple seat banks, including the 2 seats beside us, who insisted on using devices for calls, games and watching videos without headphones,. Eurobusiness on a plane would have been lovely. On the flipside the flexibility of the Eurailpass helped out when I spat the dummy on that journey, as once within Switzerland I changed to a very peaceful Swiss train for the last 2 hrs (reservations not required).

 

[Economy_Gold]

I am often in Europe and usually consider both the flying and train options. However, I think the discussion so far is a little bit overly pro-train and does not mention the downsides:
- You have to move your own luggage and have to find space for it (this was mentioned previously, but can be a real stress factor on some trains)
- Europe has a much higher crime rate than Australia. So leaving any luggage behind while having food/drink in the dining car comes with a real risk of it being stolen.
- The train system in Germany has become increadible unreliable and, if there is a disruption, can be pure chaos, especially if you don't speak German.
- Some trains can be very old and rundown, like some TGVs in France.
- Train tickets do not automatically mean you get a seat. For example in Germany you have to pay extra for the seat reservation and, from time to time, the reservation system breaks down and you end up on the floor...

 

[VPS]

Thank you @SeatBackForward, @vbroucek, @SYD, @offshore171, @dajop for your responses.

It looks like considering rail travel, for a shorter leg, might be the way to go. I'll compare the pricing and see how close it is to air travel. There will definitely be nice scenery to view and travelling between city centres without the airport security process, would be more relaxing.

I've used LCY and LGW previously but not yet at LHR.

I haven't been to Strasbourg but could add that to the list for consideration.

and if you go to Strasbourg a day trip to Colmar is well worth it