Fifth Freedom flights

[Foreigner]

Sharing this info which some of you may know of already:

List of Fifth Freedom Flights - Real World Aviation - Airline Empires

 

[ashleyn]

So what does this really mean and what impact does it have on the average traveller ? I'm a bit confused by the concept.

 

[serfty]

So what does this really mean and what impact does it have on the average traveller ? I'm a bit confused by the concept.

It's when an airline uses the '5th Freedom of the Air' to operate and sell flights that do not depart or arrive in the carrier home country.

Freedoms of the air: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedoms_of_the_air#Fifth_freedom

 

[juddles]

So what does this really mean and what impact does it have on the average traveller ? I'm a bit confused by the concept.

ashleyn, the link posted by serfty has a perfect example - the flights that Emirates does between Brisbane and Auckland.

In general, flights by any given carrier start off restricted to domestic flights within their own country (UAE). The carrier must negotiate to gain the "Freedoms" to operate to or within other countries. In this example (BNE-AKL), Emirates first had to negotiate the Third Freedom (to carry pax from UAE to Australia), and the Fourth Freedom (to carry pax from Australia back to the UAE). It then had to negotiate "Beyond Rights" to allow it to carry pax from UAE via Australia to NZ. But to actually sell seats where pax just went from Australia to NZ (ie not starting in UAE), it had to gain "Fifth Freedom" rights between Australia and NZ.

The impact that this has on the "average traveller" in this case is that we can all aspire to just do the BNE-AKL hop and get a cheap experience in one of those magnificent Emirates A380's - hopefully in First

 

[andyhui01]

I've always been curious why EK has so many 5th freedom flights whereas EY doesn't. Is that a business/fleet decision or does EK have more political power to negotiate these routes?

 

[Himeno]

I've always been curious why EK has so many 5th freedom flights whereas EY doesn't. Is that a business/fleet decision or does EK have more political power to negotiate these routes?

It isn't the airline that negotiates, it is their government. These rights come out of Air Service Agreements. The airline will then request access to the rights the country they are based in has.

eg, if Australia wanted more HND slots, the Department of Transport would negotiate with Japans Ministry of Land, Infrastructure, Transport and Tourism. Then should any new slots come from the negotiation, Qantas would go to IASC asking for the right to use the new slots.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So what does this really mean and what impact does it have on the average traveller ? I'm a bit confused by the concept.

They can mean a range of things... cheap fares, international aircraft for short flights, increased award availability.

China Eastern's tag flight Colombo to Male I've seen as low as $45. KLM's Singapore to Denpasar you can often get business class for less than the price of discount economy on Singapore Airlines. Seen award availability on Air India Hong Kong to Seoul when Asiana has been sold out.

 

[Berlin]

Love finding those weird flights that you would never expect- the other day Air Canada came up as part of a random QF ticket to and from South America and I used this chance to (ever) fly on AC straight away. Awesome list- many on there that I hadn't known about!

 

[esseeeayeenn]

Interesting that Airline Empires lists the AF flights from LAX-PPT and Air Tahiti Nui flights from LAX-CDG as fifth freedom flights.
However as Tahiti is actually part of France these aren't really fifth freedom flights at all.