Fat flyers

[juddles]

First off, let me apologize for the thread title. I am not one to cast scorn on others due to their physical attributes - I am 6´7¨ so i cause my own share of grief to airlines and fellow travellers. But...

Yesterday I was on a shortish hop from Christchurch to Auckland, Air New Zealand, in one of their extra space economy seats (they have no J, etc) Typical three seat each side arrangement. I had chosen the window seat. I knew from the seat selection online the previous day that the aisle seat was taken also, but as always fingers crossed the middle seat would be free. But it turned out the flight was full.

Problem for me was that the passenger who ended up in the middle seat was quite large, to put it mildly. For her to sit down we had to lift up the armrests! I spent the (shortish) flight squashed against the window. And I dont mean just restricted in my personal space, I mean someone pressed very firmly and intimately against you. Very uncomfortable. The lady was pleasant, but surely there must be some sort of rules about this? If a passenger physically needs two seats dont they need to buy such?

As I said, she was really nice, but it was a hideous flight. I felt very uncomfortable for her as well.

Does anyone out there in the industry know what the rules are for this?

Cheers.

PS next flight was QF AKL-LAX, seated in 1A with empty seat beside me. Good flight.

 

[tuapekastar]

A perennially vexing question juddles, to which I do not have a definitive answer. As someone who will never be mistaken for Twiggy, but who also manages to comfortably fit into a Y seat, I'm quite sure there is a limit, it's just what that limit is that will be up for discussion.

I've heard it said that if a pax cannot sit in the seat without both armrests down, then they're too big for it (was that the case on your flight or were you able to 'down armrests' once the lady was seated?) and that seems like a reasonable starting point for mine.

 

[juddles]

Definitely no chance of getting the armrests down. They also brought her an extension for the seatbelt.

How would they pick an oversized traveller? Would it be left to the poor girl at the checkin counter to make the assessment? That would be bloody tough to put on someone.

 

[deejo77]

Most airlines sell comfort seats however the traveller must instigate this - the airline do not know you are larger until you go to check in (and if you online checkin then not even that). I would hope most larger people would be more comfortable with this option but as it costs them extra money most don't opt for it!!

 

[amaroo]

Not an enjoyable experience for sure.

I know I've been seated & taken a look down the aisle & thought, wishing & hoping....please not me.

 

[Robert K]

It's become socially acceptable to be fat.

Until that changes, this problem isnt going to be fixed.

Getting bigger pants isnt a solution to obesity.

 

[serfty]

Some airlines in the USA have a policy that if a passenger cannot seat themselves without raising an armrest then they have to purchase two seats, go to a bigger seated class or otherwise not fly.

 

[chrisb]

Why did you raise the armrests in the first place?

Also, I notice that VA makes PA's about all armrests down for takeoff and landing, so I assume they wouldn't like this situation.

 

[richie9x]

I have full sympathy for you juddles, because I have been in a similar situation. Seated next to a woman who was overflowing into my space. I ended up with painful shoulder cramps during the flight. Most uncomfortable flight I have every had. I am generally am quite tolerant and will put up being seated next to bigger passengers, but a line must be drawn somewhere.

I did send feedback to Qantas about it, they came back with the following canned reply (although it does have one spelling mistake/grammatical error in it so perhaps it is not a canned response).

"It is difficult for us to anticipate situations like this because the first time we see a customer is at the check-in, by which time many of the seats on the flight are already allocated. Please accept our apologises that you had a disappointing experience. "

But if a passenger has excess baggage, then airlines will sometimes refuse to carry the excess baggage on the same flight. I can't see why they could not do similar for passengers of excess size. Put them on the next flight that has spare seats. Or at the very least make it more widely known that they can purchase comfort seats.

 

[jetlagger]

Juddles
i feel empathy toward you as I have suffered a similar scenario, in Y squashed in the window seat.
Without discrimination, picture.. 'big mama" .. It certainly doesn't make for a pleasant flight.
Should a weight limit be implemented? Especially in Y. I can recall on some earlier regional flights we had to do a weigh in, for aircraft load & balance. This is still done nowadays for Hot Air Ballooning. This could be a reasonable course of action for all passengers to eliminate sensitivity & discrimination.. Just a thought to throw on the table..

 

[JohnM]

Not an enjoyable experience for sure.

I know I've been seated & taken a look down the aisle & thought, wished & hoped....please not me.

Back in the days when I travelled whY I often prayed to the god I don't believe in: "Please, NO, NO, NO, not me" as the huge monster came down the aisle and I had a vacant seat next to me. I'm quite lean but why should that be a concession to someone who flows into my seat area just because they can?

Personally, I would have complained immediately to the CSM, saying it was totally unreasonable AND UNSAFE that the armrests had to go up because of the monster adjacent, full flight or not.

This is one major reason I won't travel whY any more.

 

[JohnK]

I feel sorry for you juddles but don't know what you can do if the FA's are in agreeance with this practice.

I am rather large myself but I was once in the aisle seat on a VA flight and the person sitting in the middle seat was just oozing everywhere. I was extremely uncomfortable and this person made no effort whatsoever to stick within the confines of the middle seat.

Luckily there was a spare aisle seat a few rows back and I sat there for the remainder of the flight.

 

[casanovawa]

Hmm, i remember a flight a few years ago...

This largish guy sits next to me and comes out with the line "Hmm, are they are making these seats narrower and narrower?"... I refrained from answering that the seats weren't changing... but was pressed up against the window all the way from Perth to Brisbane....

 

[dfcatch]

Let's go with the idea of combining body and baggage weight to give you an allowance.

The smaller you are - the more bags you can check.

And for a woman like that - zero baggage unless she buys another seat as she has already loaded the plane for 2 people.

I don't want to be rude, and I'm sure she is embarrassed by it - but when you're fat, you're fat, you know you're fat, and you know damn well that you're not going to fit into the seat.

I would want a refund for my seat if I were you - and if the airline doesn't like it - they should have made her but two seats.

 

[Archphoto]

Had a similar experience flying long-haul to LA in whY - this woman barely managed to cram herself into into the seat (she actually wouldn't fit with the armrests down so she was kind of perched above the seat itself) - her top half basically took over half of my seat when she took her place. Added to that I was crammed in the middle row with her and once that seatbelt light was off, I was out of the seat begging to move to any other available seat.

No way in h*** was I going to be able to fly 14hrs plus in that condition! She couldn't have cared less, and her less than stellar personal hygiene only added to the predicament at hand.

Thankfully there was a spare seat - right at the back of the plane. I'll be honest - it would be the absolute last seat I'd *ever* consider choosing under normal circumstances, but in this case, it was like manna from Heaven.

I'd love to be able to afford J every time I fly, but it's just not possible (even my clients baulk at this, whilst expecting me to be fresh and perky for a 9am meeting after almost 24hrs of flying) - and as others have lamented, it's yet another aspect of whY that is truly soul-destroying.

Seriously, if the airline can offload a 2year old who throws a tantrum, why can't they offload someone who is causing such obvious discomfort to another passenger/s or demand payment for a second seat that will enable them to remain on-board and ensure the safety and comfort of the other passengers?

 

[serfty]

...
Seriously, if the airline can offload a 2year old who throws a tantrum, why can't they offload someone who is causing such obvious discomfort to another passenger/s or demand payment for a second seat that will enable them to remain on-board and ensure the safety and comfort of the other passengers?

Different airlines, different region.

The OP was talking about a flight within NZ and I can tell there's many a 'big mamma' moment when those of some indigenous/islander heritages head down the aisle ...

 

[Canny man]

Irrespective of discrimination there's a safety issue here. The airlines, rightly, police bags in the footspace as they may impede in an evacuation. Surely a morbidly obese passenger is more of an impediment than a bag that can be kicked out of the way.

 

[UP4014]

Empathy to you both. While some people are oversize, airline seats are also under size for the 21st century!

 

[rechoboam]

Empathy to you both. While some people are oversize, airline seats are also under size for the 21st century!

Idea for website:
"if your personal size means you may have trouble fitting into one seat without affecting your neighbours you may be required to book two seats for comfort and convienience. Please call in advance to avoid inconvenience at checkin. "

But yes one of the many reasons I would rather travel less often for leisure and save up for J if possible.

 

[jetlagger]

Idea for website:
"if your personal size means you may have trouble fitting into one seat without affecting your neighbours you may be required to book two seats for comfort and convienience. Please call in advance to avoid inconvenience at checkin. "

Fantastic idea!