Engine surge grounds Qantas jet

[harvyk]

No sorry but that is not bias

It's not the individual story which paints a picture, it's the number of QF stories compaired to every other airline in the world.

The fact is that AFF members have been on other airlines which have had events (including DJ) on them which have been unnoticed by news limited, and yet had the plane been a QF plane the event would have been reported (maybe even as front page news).

 

[medhead]

It's not the individual story which paints a picture, it's the number of QF stories compaired to every other airline in the world.

The fact is that AFF members have been on other airlines which have had events (including DJ) on them which have been unnoticed by news limited, and yet had the plane been a QF plane the event would have been reported (maybe even as front page news).

The selective quoting of my previous post is a good example of bias. Keeping in context of my previous post the number of stories is not about bias, it is about want the news outlets consider to be newsworthy. For all the the obvious reasons that I mentioned, Qantas is considered newsworthy and DJ isn't. This is about what the news providers believe people want to read about. As for every other airline in the world, tell me how many people in Australia are going to but a paper to read about Outer Mongolian Airways - 3? How many people are interested in what is happening with the flagship, iconic airline qantas - A hell of a lot more than 3.

There are dozens of stories every week about the Rudd government. Tony Abbott gets maybe half a dozen stories in a good week. BHP Billiton would get a couple of stories a week, same with Rio, same with telstra, coles, woolworths etc. According to your standard this is all biased. All these stories about BHP and Rio, what about Vale. Clearly bias against BHP and Rio? Or a reflection fo the fact that Australian investors don't give a rats' about the brazillian iron ore producer Vale, in which they are never going to invest? But when Vale does something that will impact on BHP and Rio that gets reported. Why? Bias? no because the readers in Australian want to know.

Same with Telstra, most people in Australia have services with Telstra. Therefore there are a lot more news stories about telstra - it isn't biased to report on something that might effect a lot of people.

The fact that Qantas is considered more newsworthy that DJ or any other airline, does not a conspriacy make.

 

[NM]

Are these engine surges occurring in the RR powered fleet, the GE powered fleet or both?

Perhaps jb747 or someone else close to the action may be in a position to provide some guidance (then again, may not be due to employer restrictions). It used to be common for compressor stalls to occur with P&W engined 747s if power was applied too quickly with a cross-wind when commencing the take-of roll. This was addressed by modifications to the air flow and operating procedures. Obviously a different situation that a surge in-flight.

Most such surges seem to occur soon after take-off and may well be attributed to a disturbance in the airflow when the engine is operating at high thrust levels.

Do these incidents happen more frequently in one engine type of the other, and if so how often does it happen?

Would make for an interesting set of statistics and would need to cover more than just the Qantas fleet.

The problem hearing about these issues is that unless you dig deeper into the issue, than there is no comparison, so it really comes out as QANTAS=bad, but in reality it may be a daily occurrence world wide.

World-wide I expect it is a lot more common that most people would expect. I cannot recall an accident being attributed to an engine surge incident in recent times. Its a situation for which the crew trains regularly. While any in-flight engine shutdown is a significant event, that event in itself is unlikely to place the aircraft or its occupants in any significant danger. But as we know, most aircraft accidents are not attributed to just one failure/issue, but result for a complex mix of things happening in combination and its always possible that an incident such as an in-flight engine shutdown following a surge could be a contributing factor, such as the situation where a flight crew shut down the good engine (wrong engine) in a twin-engine aircraft following a problem with one engine.

The one thing I do know about engine surges is that witnesses often mistake the event of the surge (i.e sparks etc) as the plane catching fire. Sounds like a pretty spectacular (if not scary) event

Sparks are usually associated with blade failure which is commonly a result of bird ingestion, though can be due to other factors such as premature fatigue or manufacturing fault. Surges often result in spectacular flames from the rear of the engine. Both of these would understandably result in concern from those observing either from the ground or seated behind the wing.

 

[markis10]

Are these engine surges occurring in the RR powered fleet, the GE powered fleet or both?

The latest incident on Monday was RR (OJF), OJI was involved in the SYD event last week with the number 3 RB211 surging, OJQ also had an issue with a RB211 surge on Dec 17 last year at SIN, while OJF had a rejected take off in Nov in HKG.

There was an AD out on the RB211s for fuel flow governors and surges when there is rapid acceleration from idle when flying above 25000ft back in 96.

 

[straitman]

Sparks are usually associated with blade failure which is commonly a result of bird ingestion, though can be due to other factors such as premature fatigue or manufacturing fault. Surges often result in spectacular flames from the rear of the engine. Both of these would understandably result in concern from those observing either from the ground or seated behind the wing.

There is a good chance that the average 'Jo' would not understand or see the difference between the two in any case.